Spectata Patricia Cassia

The story you might like to tell could be entitled "SI VIS PACEM PARA BELLVM".

The character is Caesar Octavianus Agustus, and the story goes through all of his victories until the doors of the Aedes of Ianus are closed, and the golden age started again in Rome.

Reverenter

Gallus Solaris Alexander

-----Original Message-----
From : “L. Sicinius Drusus“ <lsicinius@...>
Date : 09 May 2003 04:19:46

I Really don't think the Pax Romana had as much to do

>with the colapse of the Roman state. A growing Statism
>was a far greater factor, and the real cause of the
>destruction of inovation. Most likely the Pax Romana
>postponed the increasing despotism that was choking
>Roma. Don't forget that state powers are most likely

Don't forget that only the backward half 'fell' and they did not consider it that at the time. Historical evidence, however we hate to admit it, is that despotism works. The East, always more despotic, survived for another thousand years. The longest-running state in history is probably Egypt, rule by God. China comes close but was only a true temporally continuous entity for 2,500 years. Assyria also had a long history and if the King wasn't God, he was certainly magic.

Caesariensis.

“People who go around getting their panties in a knot when they allow
others to threaten their beliefs usually gain nothing but a sore ass...“
--Gwenius Maximus, 01/26/02

"Oh, go away and think for yourselves!".
"Master, tell us how to go away and think for ourselves". - 'Life of Brian'.




--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-----Original Message-----
From : Karen Blackburn <Karen-Julia@...>
Date : 08 May 2003 23:54:47

>I haven't bought a tunic from la wren but have made some myself for both my husband and myself. I have found for my own use that linen is better but my husband says it depends on the weather. If it is warm, then linen is cooler and more comfortable but in the cooler weather wool is prefered. You may however, need to wear a thin linen tunic under the woollen one as some woollen fabrics itch, especially round the neck.
>

I've always understood that a tunica should not resemble a closed poncho but is a long strip wrapped round under the arms from the left and then clasped over the shoulders as far as it might want any sleeves, and belted.

Caesariensis


“People who go around getting their panties in a knot when they allow
others to threaten their beliefs usually gain nothing but a sore ass...“
--Gwenius Maximus, 01/26/02

"Oh, go away and think for yourselves!".
"Master, tell us how to go away and think for ourselves". - 'Life of Brian'.




--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve omnes,

Just testing ML . My last message did not appear.

QLP

Salvete omnes,

I came across this upcoming movie called Megalopolis. Its something
to look forward to for next year. Check it out.

Quintus Lanius Paulinus


http://www.starseeker.com/films/megalopo.htm

Salvete,

Just testing ML. Postings not appearing.

QLP

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Quintus Lanius Paulinus"
<mjk@d...> wrote:

> Salve omnes,

Boudiccan Rebellion
http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_507144.html?menu=
Megalopolis – Future Rome
Director Francis Ford Coppola has described Megalopolis as "a Roman
epic, a Cecil B. DeMille" style picture. The setting is modern New
York and the premise is that the world of the future is being
negotiated today. The characters include artists, businessmen,
politicians, and the common people, all having a stake in the future
but few able to directly determine their destiny. New York is
portrayed as the counterpart of ancient Republican Rome and the plot
is inspired by a very famous incident during the period of the Roman
Republic called the Catiline Conspiracy. Although set in the present
day, the surroundings will conjure the ambience of ancient Rome.
According to Coppola, "Say you're downtown, around Wall Street, and
suddenly you come across a Roman temple. You'll see that sensibility
in the way it's staged and shot. A taxicab will be from modern New
York, but you'll feel like you're in Rome. The story is a very Roman
story but it's also a very modern American story." Estimated to have
a budget of $60-80 million, the film has been compared to Ayn Rand's
novel The Fountainhead, with "a real estate entrepreneur who wants to
construct the title building out of new and cheap advanced plastic
compound and the well-liked New York mayor who is out to stop him."




For those who don't know:

The Cataline Conspiracy: Between the repulsion of Lepidus by Catalus
and the uneventful passage of Caesar over the bridge, there were 29
years of almost uninterrupted trouble as the Roman republic collapse
in on itself. One of the most intriguing events of this chaotic
period was the Conspiracy of Cataline (not the same guy as Catalus),
and again the Milvian Bridge figures into the story.
All of the accounts of Cataline were written after his conspiracy was
discovered and his revolt was put down, so what was said about him by
his victorious enemies might be suspect. But even his former
followers tell the same story: he was eloquent, charming, rich,
dissolute, mean, extravagant, unwise, and insatiably ambitious. He
was the epitome of the chaos of his times. Cataline surrounded
himself (as did many others of the nobility, and as do boxers,
football players, and rap stars of today) with an entourage of thugs
and criminals. They and Cataline were accused by their enemies (and
later by some of their followers) of almost any conceivable excess.
There is no doubt that they were a criminal gang. Their power in the
city quickly grew and they eventually got the support of a number of
Senators, most of whom were enemies of Pompey -- they appear to have
thought that they could use Cataline to bring Pompey down a notch or
two. Some even said that Crassus, Pompey's chief rival, at least
tacitly supported Cataline, who was plotting a coup.
In 64 BC, Pompey was off fighting the Mithradatic Wars overseas, and
Cataline saw a chance to put his plan into action. But another
schemer, Cicero, was also around, and he wanted to thwart Cataline.
The goal of Cicero, Rome's most successful lawyer and most famous
orator, had always been to avoid being identified with any of the
political camps or gangs in the city -- he wanted to know and control
everything, but to be seen as a "clean hands" outsider. He had spies
planted everywhere, and some of them were in Cataline's gang. When he
got wind of Cataline's impending coup attempt, Cicero bribed some of
Cataline's supposed allies, barbarian representatives of the
Allobroges tribe from Gaul, to help him trap Cataline. The details
are complex, but, in short, Cicero's men and the magistrates
intercepted the Allobroges along with Cataline's emissaries at (where
else?) the Milvian Bridge as they were leaving town. There was a
short scuffle -- the Allobroges didn't participate -- and then
Cataline's men were captured. The Allobroges, acting on Cicero's
suggestion, had asked the emissaries to bring along letters from
Cataline outlining the plot, and these letters were taken and read
out in the Senate by Cicero. The Senate was outraged, but more
importantly, the general public, on whose support Cataline had
depended, were also outraged, and this because of two things. First,
although almost anything else might be tolerated, nobody should ever
recruit barbarians, and especially Gauls, in a conspiracy against
Rome. Secondly and more importantly, the letters seized from
Cataline's emissaries made it clear that his plot involved widespread
arson in the city, and fire was every Roman's worst nightmare.
Cataline escaped the but he and many of his high ranking followers
were quickly caught and executed under quasi-legal circumstances.
Accusations against Crassus were suppressed, either because the
Senate thought he was too powerful to beard or because, as Crassus
maintained, the accusations were trumped up by his enemy Cicero.
Cicero was said to have resisted attempts by his allies to bring
trumped up charges against Julius Caesar.
Milivian Bridge www.org website

>
> Just testing ML . My last message did not appear.
>
> QLP

SVVBE

>Is that Flavia Minervina Iucundia peeking in? Welcome! Is it true
>you're thinking of joining us at Roman Days in June?

Yes, yes...it's everyone's favorite ex-senator and ex-post-pre-pro-praetor! But, SHHHHHHH! It's a secret. I don't want Equitias to know. ;op And am I thinking of joining y'all at Roman Days in June?! Heck no! I SHALL be at Roman Days in June, courtesy of the infinitely generous Q. Fabius Maximus. (Alas, I am a po' college student.) Three cheers for Fabius! Hip-hip...HUZZAH! Hip-hip...HUZZAH! Hip-hip...HUZZAH!

>Anyone who missed my earlier post about a block of NR rooms at the >Days
>Inn, feel free to e-mail me for the info.

I don't know what I am doing about a hotel room yet. Something tells me that I will Fabius' love slave for the weekend in exchange for the airfare. Howe'er, if someone would like to split the cost of boarding, then I could still be a candidate for being a Vestal. (SHUT UP, CASSIUS!)

Also, whilst I have someone's undivided attention, let it be known that I shall be needing a ride back to the airport Monday afternoon so I can get back to Tampa. So, spread the word, please.

>And Happy Birthday Lucius Cornelius!

Screw you, Lucius Cornelius! (hee hee)

Valete,

Minervina Iucundia Flavia
--
_______________________________________________
Come to http://www.sailormoon.com the sailormoon friends & fan community where you get chat, e-mail and can even build your own homepages!

Powered by Outblaze

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Quintus Lanius Paulinus"
<mjk@d...> wrote:

> Salve omnes,
>
> Just came across these 2 new upcoming films to be shot in the near

future. They look pretty interesting.

Boudiccan Rebellion
http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_507144.html?menu=




Megalopolis – Future Rome
Director Francis Ford Coppola has described Megalopolis as "a Roman
epic, a Cecil B. DeMille" style picture. The setting is modern New
York and the premise is that the world of the future is being
negotiated today. The characters include artists, businessmen,
politicians, and the common people, all having a stake in the future
but few able to directly determine their destiny. New York is
portrayed as the counterpart of ancient Republican Rome and the plot
is inspired by a very famous incident during the period of the Roman
Republic called the Catiline Conspiracy. Although set in the present
day, the surroundings will conjure the ambience of ancient Rome.
According to Coppola, "Say you're downtown, around Wall Street, and
suddenly you come across a Roman temple. You'll see that sensibility
in the way it's staged and shot. A taxicab will be from modern New
York, but you'll feel like you're in Rome. The story is a very Roman
story but it's also a very modern American story." Estimated to have
a budget of $60-80 million, the film has been compared to Ayn Rand's
novel The Fountainhead, with "a real estate entrepreneur who wants to
construct the title building out of new and cheap advanced plastic
compound and the well-liked New York mayor who is out to stop him."



For those who don't know:

The Cataline Conspiracy: Between the repulsion of Lepidus by Catalus
and the uneventful passage of Caesar over the bridge, there were 29
years of almost uninterrupted trouble as the Roman republic collapse
in on itself. One of the most intriguing events of this chaotic
period was the Conspiracy of Cataline (not the same guy as Catalus),
and again the Milvian Bridge figures into the story.
All of the accounts of Cataline were written after his conspiracy was
discovered and his revolt was put down, so what was said about him by
his victorious enemies might be suspect. But even his former
followers tell the same story: he was eloquent, charming, rich,
dissolute, mean, extravagant, unwise, and insatiably ambitious. He
was the epitome of the chaos of his times. Cataline surrounded
himself (as did many others of the nobility, and as do boxers,
football players, and rap stars of today) with an entourage of thugs
and criminals. They and Cataline were accused by their enemies (and
later by some of their followers) of almost any conceivable excess.
There is no doubt that they were a criminal gang. Their power in the
city quickly grew and they eventually got the support of a number of
Senators, most of whom were enemies of Pompey -- they appear to have
thought that they could use Cataline to bring Pompey down a notch or
two. Some even said that Crassus, Pompey's chief rival, at least
tacitly supported Cataline, who was plotting a coup.
In 64 BC, Pompey was off fighting the Mithradatic Wars overseas, and
Cataline saw a chance to put his plan into action. But another
schemer, Cicero, was also around, and he wanted to thwart Cataline.
The goal of Cicero, Rome's most successful lawyer and most famous
orator, had always been to avoid being identified with any of the
political camps or gangs in the city -- he wanted to know and control
everything, but to be seen as a "clean hands" outsider. He had spies
planted everywhere, and some of them were in Cataline's gang. When he
got wind of Cataline's impending coup attempt, Cicero bribed some of
Cataline's supposed allies, barbarian representatives of the
Allobroges tribe from Gaul, to help him trap Cataline. The details
are complex, but, in short, Cicero's men and the magistrates
intercepted the Allobroges along with Cataline's emissaries at (where
else?) the Milvian Bridge as they were leaving town. There was a
short scuffle -- the Allobroges didn't participate -- and then
Cataline's men were captured. The Allobroges, acting on Cicero's
suggestion, had asked the emissaries to bring along letters from
Cataline outlining the plot, and these letters were taken and read
out in the Senate by Cicero. The Senate was outraged, but more
importantly, the general public, on whose support Cataline had
depended, were also outraged, and this because of two things. First,
although almost anything else might be tolerated, nobody should ever
recruit barbarians, and especially Gauls, in a conspiracy against
Rome. Secondly and more importantly, the letters seized from
Cataline's emissaries made it clear that his plot involved widespread
arson in the city, and fire was every Roman's worst nightmare.
Cataline escaped the but he and many of his high ranking followers
were quickly caught and executed under quasi-legal circumstances.
Accusations against Crassus were suppressed, either because the
Senate thought he was too powerful to beard or because, as Crassus
maintained, the accusations were trumped up by his enemy Cicero.
Cicero was said to have resisted attempts by his allies to bring
trumped up charges against Julius Caesar.


Articls from Milivian Bridge www.org website

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

Julilla Sempronia Magna ominibus SPD

It's a fine Friday in Maius and time to knock off work (or at least
waste a little time while you should be finishing up). I'd like to
invite you to the Provincia America Boreoccidentalis web site to test
your knowledge of our local familiae, ancient Rome, and the provincia
with three new ludi!

http://ambor.novaroma.org/ludi.htm

---
IULI.SEMPRON.MAGN.PR.AM.BOR.
@____@ Julilla Sempronia Magna
|||| www.villaivlilla.com/
@____@ Praetrix America Boreoccidentalis
|||| http://ambor.novaroma.org
Discussion Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AmBor_Waves/

Salvete Plebeian citizens!
This is just a friendly reminder that the fifth run-off election for the 1(one) vacant office of Tribunus Plebis is currently in progress! Voting will continue until Sunday May 11th, 18:01 Roman Time, but why wait? Vote now by going to http://www.novaroma.org and clicking 'VOTE NOW' !.If you don't remember your voter code or are a new citizen, no problem. You can have your voter code automatically mailed to you by doing the following:Go to http://www.novaroma.org/bin/view/gentes . Find the name of your gens (they are listed alphabetically). Two columns to the right of your Gens name, click on the 'number of cives'. A new page opens that contains a listing of all the citizens in your Gens. Find your name and click on the link. On the new page you'll see a box which contains information about you. Click on "Get voter code". On the new page, enter your year of birth and click 'request voter code'. Your voter code will be emailed to you. Once you have your voter code, go to http://www.novaroma.org and click 'VOTE NOW'.

Thank you for your participation in this election!

Valete bene

Lucius Pompeius Octavianus

Tribunus Plebis



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve Jullila,

That is a very nice website you have. Well done indeed.

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "julilla" <curatrix@v...> wrote:
> Julilla Sempronia Magna ominibus SPD
>
> It's a fine Friday in Maius and time to knock off work (or at least
> waste a little time while you should be finishing up). I'd like to
> invite you to the Provincia America Boreoccidentalis web site to
test
> your knowledge of our local familiae, ancient Rome, and the
provincia
> with three new ludi!
>
> http://ambor.novaroma.org/ludi.htm
>
> ---
> IULI.SEMPRON.MAGN.PR.AM.BOR.
> @____@ Julilla Sempronia Magna
> |||| www.villaivlilla.com/
> @____@ Praetrix America Boreoccidentalis
> |||| http://ambor.novaroma.org
> Discussion Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AmBor_Waves/

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Tite Octavi.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Kristoffer From <from@d...> wrote:

<<snipped>>

> > Somehow, I suspected this since the very day
> > I first met you, my dear Tite Octavi :-).
>
> Why does nobody seem surprised? I don't get it! ;)

It has to do with your death-metal T-shirts :-).

> > By the way, I have been sooooo boring and
> > predictible as to get the following results
> > (just my top ten):
> > 1.- Roman Paganism
>
> Ya, ya...why aren't you part of our clergy already? Here, sign the
> dotted line, and never mind the fine print.

Actually, I think that you are right! :-).

> > My poorest result was Christian Wicca (#25),
> > with oddities like Thelema (#23), Satanism
> > (#18) and Discordianism (#16) in pretty low
> > positions...
>
> 's not my fault that strange test seemed not to like me. Or maybe
> like me too much. Christian Wicca was my #4, BTW.

Now *that* would make me worry :-).

CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Saturnine.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Caius Curius Saturninus
<c.curius@w...> wrote:

<<snipped>>

> Almost the same as mine:
> 1. Roman Paganism
> 2. Romuva
> 3. Slavic Paganism
> 4. Mesopotamian Paganism
> 5. Hellenic
> 6. Druiry
> 7. Celtic
> 8. Asatru
> 9. Anglo Saxon Heathenry
> 10. Finnish Paganism
> 25. Christian Wicca

It seems that neither of us is too original, my friend :-).

> About the Finnish Paganism, it is a bit difficult to know how exact
> the survived traditional information bits are. There sure has been
> very strong pagan era religion as in the 16-18th century the church
> still actively tried to root out pagan traditions. In the woodlands
> of Eastern Finland there was some local "shamans" (I don't know
> better word, and I'm not referring to shamanism) who consulted the
> spirits and healed people.
>
> There has been survived quite amount of knowledge about pagan
> medicine, but their religious practises are not known well as there
> is no reliable written records about them.
>
> There are some mentions of the old Finnish gods, spirits and demons
> even in the works of first Finnish author Mikael Agricola (16th
> century, first one to written in Finnish). There are also some
> other
> scattered literary remarks of the tradition, but how reliable they
> are cannot be said as they are written by mostly christian priests
> with motivation to promote christianity.
>
> The Kalevala is more difficult work of literature as it is not
> accurate collection of Finnish tradition but instead it is an
> independent story that relies heavily on the collected old
> tradition.
> The trouble is that we don't know which parts are purely from
> authors
> imagination, which are from survived tradition and which are just
> altered to fit into the epic story. Even if we would know which of
> the songs are formed in which way, we still would not know how each
> part had survived and altered through the countless storytellers
> during the many generations. This is of course universally the
> problem with non-literary tradition.

A very interesting information, Saturnine. Thank you.

I see many parallels between the Finnish Religion and the Irish
Tradition (safe that Irish tales were written down a few centuries
earlier).

And you are right; religions that do not have a literary tradition
are very difficult to study seriously. We will never be too grateful
towards all those black-robed mediaeval benedictine monks who kept
the works of Cicero, Ovid and Horace :-).

CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Gai Iuli Scaure.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory Rose" <gfr@i...> wrote:
> G. Iulius Scaurus S.P.D.
>
> Salvete, omnes.
>
> This survey has some strange algorithms. It suggested for me:
>
> #1 Roman Paganism (That will disappoint all those who thought I was
> here for the politics and the toga parties)

Do not worry. We still now that you are here just for the toga
parties :-).

> #2 Romuva (Very odd. I don't often think about Lithuania, actually)
> #3 Slavic Paganism (Ice-cold vodka can be pleasant, as Gn. Salix
> reminds us)

Sheeeeahhh! *hic* ;-).

> #4 Druidry (On the whole I prefer C. Iulius Caesar and Aulus
> Plautius, thank you very much)

But then, there's whiskey as well :-).

> #5 Mesopotamian Paganism (I did once have a student on a
> fill-in-the-definition question tell me that "Pazuzu was the demon
> of breaking wind")
> ....
>
> #21 Traditional Wicca
> #22 Thelema (The site looks rather like Thelemarketing to me)
> #23 Ecclectic Wicca (Is this a pun on "Ecclesia" or can't the chap
> spell "eclectic"?)
> #24 Dianic Wicca
> #25 Christian Wicca (I am I the only one who thinks this is as much
> an oxymoron as "Jewish Nazism"?)

It does sound quite complicated, yes. However, as someone quite
familiar with Catholicism, I can assure you that such a thing is by
no means impossible :-).

(No offence meant towards our Catholic citizens; just a little joke
:-) ).

CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF

G. Iulius Scaurus Q. Lanio Paulino salutem dicit.

Salve, Q. Lani.

> Boudiccan Rebellion
> http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_507144.html?menu=

This sounds like another opportunity for a movie to make a mockery of
history. Of course, Boudicca must have had a "macho lover" to lead
the rebellion (Tacitus appears to have taken no notice of the chap,
but Warner Brothers is closer at hand to the actual events and privy
to sources to which Tacitus wasn't :-). Dio Cassius attributes the
revolt to the procurator's attempt to recover bounties paid to client
kings at the time of the conquest (there is evidence from elsewhere
that some treaties with client kings in the early principate paid
generous bounties to those kings in exchange for Roman support during
the king's life and annexation of the client kingdom by Rome at the
king's death, accompanied by reversion of an amount equal to the Roman
subsidy to the Roman treasury; this may have been a factor in the
Icenian revolt) and attempts to call in loans made by major figures at
Nero's court (Dio Cassius mentions Seneca by name, and he shares
Tacitus' anti-Julio-Claudian bias) to client kings in Britannia.
Tacitus takes the usual moralising and anti-imperial tone in his
account, as well as his tendency to portrary every senior Roman who
dealt with Britons except Agricola as corrupt or incompetent. I
suspect we'll see rather more attention to the rape allegations than
the problems of assimilating a Celtic population to Roman administration.

> Megalopolis – Future Rome
> Director Francis Ford Coppola has described Megalopolis as "a Roman
> epic, a Cecil B. DeMille" style picture. The setting is modern New
> York and the premise is that the world of the future is being
> negotiated today. The characters include artists, businessmen,
> politicians, and the common people, all having a stake in the future
> but few able to directly determine their destiny. New York is
> portrayed as the counterpart of ancient Republican Rome and the plot
> is inspired by a very famous incident during the period of the Roman
> Republic called the Catiline Conspiracy. Although set in the present
> day, the surroundings will conjure the ambience of ancient Rome.
> According to Coppola, "Say you're downtown, around Wall Street, and
> suddenly you come across a Roman temple. You'll see that sensibility
> in the way it's staged and shot. A taxicab will be from modern New
> York, but you'll feel like you're in Rome. The story is a very Roman
> story but it's also a very modern American story." Estimated to have
> a budget of $60-80 million, the film has been compared to Ayn Rand's
> novel The Fountainhead, with "a real estate entrepreneur who wants to
> construct the title building out of new and cheap advanced plastic
> compound and the well-liked New York mayor who is out to stop him."

Lucius Sergius Catilina as Howard Roark? Given "One from the Heart,"
I guess I shouldn't be surprised at Coppola filming an epic about
Rome's leading advocate of debt repudiation.

> For those who don't know:
>
> The Cataline Conspiracy: Between the repulsion of Lepidus by Catalus
> and the uneventful passage of Caesar over the bridge, there were 29
> years of almost uninterrupted trouble as the Roman republic collapse
> in on itself. One of the most intriguing events of this chaotic
> period was the Conspiracy of Cataline (not the same guy as Catalus),
> and again the Milvian Bridge figures into the story.
> All of the accounts of Cataline were written after his conspiracy was
> discovered and his revolt was put down, so what was said about him by
> his victorious enemies might be suspect. But even his former
> followers tell the same story: he was eloquent, charming, rich,
> dissolute, mean, extravagant, unwise, and insatiably ambitious. He
> was the epitome of the chaos of his times. Cataline surrounded
> himself (as did many others of the nobility, and as do boxers,
> football players, and rap stars of today) with an entourage of thugs
> and criminals. They and Cataline were accused by their enemies (and
> later by some of their followers) of almost any conceivable excess.
> There is no doubt that they were a criminal gang. Their power in the
> city quickly grew and they eventually got the support of a number of
> Senators, most of whom were enemies of Pompey -- they appear to have
> thought that they could use Cataline to bring Pompey down a notch or
> two. Some even said that Crassus, Pompey's chief rival, at least
> tacitly supported Cataline, who was plotting a coup.
> In 64 BC, Pompey was off fighting the Mithradatic Wars overseas, and
> Cataline saw a chance to put his plan into action. But another
> schemer, Cicero, was also around, and he wanted to thwart Cataline.
> The goal of Cicero, Rome's most successful lawyer and most famous
> orator, had always been to avoid being identified with any of the
> political camps or gangs in the city -- he wanted to know and control
> everything, but to be seen as a "clean hands" outsider. He had spies
> planted everywhere, and some of them were in Cataline's gang. When he
> got wind of Cataline's impending coup attempt, Cicero bribed some of
> Cataline's supposed allies, barbarian representatives of the
> Allobroges tribe from Gaul, to help him trap Cataline. The details
> are complex, but, in short, Cicero's men and the magistrates
> intercepted the Allobroges along with Cataline's emissaries at (where
> else?) the Milvian Bridge as they were leaving town. There was a
> short scuffle -- the Allobroges didn't participate -- and then
> Cataline's men were captured. The Allobroges, acting on Cicero's
> suggestion, had asked the emissaries to bring along letters from
> Cataline outlining the plot, and these letters were taken and read
> out in the Senate by Cicero. The Senate was outraged, but more
> importantly, the general public, on whose support Cataline had
> depended, were also outraged, and this because of two things. First,
> although almost anything else might be tolerated, nobody should ever
> recruit barbarians, and especially Gauls, in a conspiracy against
> Rome. Secondly and more importantly, the letters seized from
> Cataline's emissaries made it clear that his plot involved widespread
> arson in the city, and fire was every Roman's worst nightmare.
> Cataline escaped the but he and many of his high ranking followers
> were quickly caught and executed under quasi-legal circumstances.
> Accusations against Crassus were suppressed, either because the
> Senate thought he was too powerful to beard or because, as Crassus
> maintained, the accusations were trumped up by his enemy Cicero.
> Cicero was said to have resisted attempts by his allies to bring
> trumped up charges against Julius Caesar.

I am no great fan of M. Tullius Cicero, but this seems to present
Catilina in a rather better light than all the ancient sources (even
if we assume a largish degree of bias). For those interested in more
about the Catilinarian conspiracy:

Andrew Drummond, Law, Politics and Power: Sallust and the Execution of
the Catilinarian Conspirators (Stuttgart, 1995).

A. Kaplan, Catiline: The Man and His Role in the Roman Revolution (NY,
1968).

Charles M. Odahl, _The Catilinarian Conspiracy (New Haven, 1971).

J.T. Ramsey, Sallust's Bellum Catilinae (Chico, Ca., 1984).

Sir Ronald Syme, Sallust (Berkeley, 1964).

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Salve,

On Sat, May 10, 2003 at 01:55:12AM -0000, Gregory Rose wrote:
>
> Lucius Sergius Catilina as Howard Roark?

<choke><LOL> That is a hilarious image. "Rand does Rome"... no, wait,
that's too close to "Debbie does Dallas"... never mind. :)


Vale,
Caius Minucius Scaevola
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Mater artium necessitas.
Necessity is the mother of invention.
-- N/A

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory Rose" <gfr@i...> wrote:

> G. Iulius Scaurus Q. Lanio Paulino salutem dicit.
>
> Salve, Q. Lani.
>
> > Boudiccan Rebellion
> > http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_507144.html?menu=
>
> This sounds like another opportunity for a movie to make a mockery

of

> history.
> > Megalopolis – Future Rome
> > Director Francis Ford Coppola has described Megalopolis as "a

Roman

> > epic, a Cecil B. DeMille" style picture. >
> Lucius Sergius Catilina as Howard Roark? Given "One from the

Heart,"

> I guess I shouldn't be surprised at Coppola filming an epic about
> Rome's leading advocate of debt repudiation.
>
> > For those who don't know:
> >
> I am no great fan of M. Tullius Cicero, but this seems to present
> Catilina in a rather better light than all the ancient sources (even
> if we assume a largish degree of bias). For those interested in

more

> about the Catilinarian conspiracy:
>
> Andrew Drummond, Law, Politics and Power: Sallust and the Execution

of

> the Catilinarian Conspirators (Stuttgart, 1995).
>
> A. Kaplan, Catiline: The Man and His Role in the Roman Revolution

(NY,

> 1968).
>
> Charles M. Odahl, _The Catilinarian Conspiracy (New Haven, 1971).
>
> J.T. Ramsey, Sallust's Bellum Catilinae (Chico, Ca., 1984).
>
> Sir Ronald Syme, Sallust (Berkeley, 1964).
>
> Vale.
>
> G. Iulius Scaurus

Salve Iuli,

That is a good critique you gave. I just cut some of our dialogue to
save space.

I realize that most movies made about Ancient Rome are usually off
the mark historically, especially when they try to put in 20th
century values, philosophies, jargon and slang as well as distorting
actual events in the name of artistic licence. This, of course, can
be frustrating to historians and other academics. Yet they do serve
a good purpose however by stimulating the interest of the masses,
many of whom do not study history in their schools since these
institutions have dropped such courses from the compulsory lists of
subjects over the last 20 years.
As a kid I would be drawn to movies like Quo Vadis, The Robe, Ben Hur
etc. and would often leave the theatre wondering how true and
accurate these stories were. I went home, hit the books and
encyclopedias to learn the truth. Thus developed my passion for
Ancient Rome and history over the years.

I am sure we can get more and more lay people interested in Rome and
Nova Roma by initially sending them to movies like Gladiator or this
new Boudicca than by initially dropping books the heavy translations
of the Civil Wars by Caesar, Seutonius' 12 Caesars, Polybius' Punic
Wars etc.
The deeper interests and readings will come in time, people will
graduate to watching TV documentaries followed by books but its
better not to scare people off initially. In my opinion Gadiator,
innaccurate as it was, did much to revive new interest in ancient
Rome as Ali did for boxing 35years ago.

Respectfully,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gnaeus Salix Astur"
<salixastur@y...> wrote:

> > #25 Christian Wicca (I am I the only one who thinks this is as

much

> > an oxymoron as "Jewish Nazism"?)
>
> It does sound quite complicated, yes. However, as someone quite
> familiar with Catholicism, I can assure you that such a thing is by
> no means impossible :-).
>
> (No offence meant towards our Catholic citizens; just a little joke
> :-) ).
>

No offense taken honest, really. Pay no attention to that big pole
surrounded by the wood. The ropes? Uhm, mountain climbing,
honest. Never mind those chants of "2... 4... 6... 8... who do we
incinerate?" That's just a little cheerleading practice, honest.
<Evil Grin>

Q. Cassius Calvus

Salve Friends


I would like to expedite the production of the June Eagle so we can have it and some of the back issues for Roman Days. That's the first week end in JUNE, In Maryland.

So in order to get it printed for that weekend , I would ask that anybody who has anything for the JUNE Eagle to send it in ASAP. ( May too).

Thanks in advance. I wish I had thought of it earlier but I didn't.


Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
Curator Differum


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

G. Iulius Scaurus S.P.D.

Avete, Quirites.

Here's a link to the website of the Rutgers University "U.S. Epigraphy
Project":

http://usepigraphy.rutgers.edu/

The goal of the U.S. Epigraphy Project is to gather and distribute
information about ancient Greek and Latin inscriptions preserved by
institutions in the U.S. More than 2,300 inscriptions (720 Greek,
1,575 Latin) are currently entered in the project database and images
and transcriptions of many can be seen on this site.

Valete, Quirites.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Salvete omnes,

Just as a sidenote; the quiz was not made by SVR (although we do have other tests at SelectSmart). It seems very nice though! I *wish* we had made such one, lol :).

Valete bene,
Solaris


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Q. Cassi.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "quintuscassiuscalvus"
<richmal@a...> wrote:

> > (No offence meant towards our Catholic citizens; just a little
> > joke :-) ).
> >
>
> No offense taken honest, really. Pay no attention to that big pole
> surrounded by the wood. The ropes? Uhm, mountain climbing,
> honest. Never mind those chants of "2... 4... 6... 8... who do
> we incinerate?" That's just a little cheerleading practice,
> honest.
> <Evil Grin>
>
> Q. Cassius Calvus

It is always nice to see the performance of pagan rituals, even if
they belong to a different, slightly intolerant tradition ;-).

CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF

Salve Titus Pius!

Diana Moravia Aventina wrote:
< > You probably should have not clicked 'I agree'
< > when asked these two questions: "Humor and
< > Chaos should be the primary focus of your
< > path." "Confronting, embracing, and possibly
< > utilizing darkness and death are primary
< > elements in your path. "

TP: I didn't! Well, at least I didn't give either of those answers very
high
priority...and I'm quite sure I answered no to the first one.

I'm still sceptical :-) My undoing is that I clicked that I liked the
Ravenwolf and Conway books, which I do. They are light reading and fun and
good for newbies who hoepfully will go on to read more serious works. But I
don't believe those books are historically correct. There should have been a
choice between I agree and I disagree.

< *tsk* *tsk* Thor's the barroom brawler to attract the loud masses of
< beerswilling simpletons. And his name's spelled Tor. Oden's the 'cool
< dude'. :)

Thor is the English spelling. And I think he is cool *because* he is the
bar-room brawler (this is the ex-biker chic speaking...). Beerswilling
simpletons are quite refreshing after 8 hours a day spent with
coffee-swilling simpletons in suits :-p When I die I hope to end up in
Valhalla as a Valkyrie serving beer to huge blond and blue eyed Viking
Warriors who have a soft spot for Latin girls :-)

< 's not my fault that strange test seemed not to like me. Or maybe like
< me too much. Christian Wicca was my #4, BTW.

I'm guessing that Christian Wicca would be worshipping Jesus and Mary as the
God and the Goddess. That sounds like a great way for Christians who are
anti-catholic church to worship their Gods in not so strict a manner.

Vale,
Diana


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve,

>Welcome! Is it true you're thinking of joining us at Roman Days in June?

http://www.larp.com/legioxx/rdays.html
Is the above the correct link for the Roman Days info ? My father is once
again in the hospital in critical condition, but he is likely to hold on a
bit longer. If nothing happens before then, I am scheduled to go to NYC in
June. Maryland isn't so far away from NYC.

A few questions:
Is anyone going from the area of NYC or New Jersey that I can hitch a ride
with? If not, is Roman Days reachable by public transportation? On the
website there are only directions by car.
I see that on the site there is a list of hotels in the area. Where is
everyone else staying? Or does everyone camp out?

Minervina Iucundia Flavia said:
<I SHALL be at Roman Days in June, courtesy of the infinitely generous Q.
Fabius Maximus. (Alas, I am a po' college student.) Three cheers for
Fabius!
<Something tells me that I will Fabius' love slave for the weekend in
exchange for the airfare.

Hey what's this now Fabius? I thought I was your love slave? Oh that's
right, I'm not the love slave, I'm the sex slave and I am a poor college
graduate and not a poor college student... Ok then, there's no conflict....
:-))

Vale,
Diana Moravia

Greetings!

I'm reposting the Roman Days info I posted earlier. Diana Moravia, I know that
Merlinia Ambrosia Artori plans to be there and is coming from N.J.; otherwise,
we'd be willing to pick you up at the Lanham Metro stop if we can work out
schedules by phone or e-mail ahead of time.

We used to stay at the Red Roof Inn till it burned down a couple of years ago,
and we stayed at the Days Inn that year and found it much nicer for about the
same price. However, it's a popular weekend for graduations and so forth;
book early!

----------------

As those of you who've been around a while know, the fine folks at
Legio XX put on an annual "Roman Days" event in Maryland, and over
the years it's become a good place to meet your fellow Nova Romans as
well.

This year it's June 7 and 8 at the same location, the Marietta
Mansion in Glenn Dale, Md., not too far from Washington, D.C. Events
include military demonstrations, vendors, Roman cooking
demonstrations, a Roman fashion show, and children's activities. Full
details on the event are here: http://www.larp.com/legioxx/rdays.html

Cassius and I are attending as usual, and I've reserved a small block
of rooms for Nova Romans (and their friends!) at the nearby Days Inn
in Lanham, Md. They've promised us a maximum rate of $71.10 per night
(some nights may be less, depending on the kind of room you choose).

If you'd like to take advantage of this, call 1-800-325-2525 and
reserve the room using this confirmation number: 50428395.

Hope to see you there!

Patricia Cassia

Thank you very much for that summary, Quintus Lanius! You did an
excellent job of putting a complex historical situation into a few
words. A good refresher for those of us who knew about the conspiracy,
and a useful introduction for those of us who didn't. And now I'll go
to the movie not expecting to see togas!


-----
Patricia Cassia
Senatrix et Sacerdos Minervalis
Nova Roma . pcassia@...

Salvete, August Fathers! Merlinia Ambrosia here, with an idea!

At our little Taberna on the Wall event, one of the local SCA folk
went looking for something she'd seen, and found it, knowing what we
wanted. She sent it to me, and I, on to you for examination.
It isn't exactly what we want, but it's a start?


http://www.darkagescommunity.com

Valete!
-M.

Salve

I just took the test and got Mesopotamian Paganism as my number one choice.
Roman Paganism was number 9. Oddly enough, if you follow the link from
Roman Paganism it takes you to the SVR.

Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa

>From: "crunniuc" <crunniuc@...>
>Reply-To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
>To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Nova-Roma] Something Silly
>Date: Thu, 08 May 2003 19:03:34 -0000
>
>I found this "what kind of pagan are you" quiz on selectsmart and got
>Anglo Saxon Heathenry. There is Roman Paganism represented, but I got
>it very far down on my list.
>
>http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/select.php?client=pagantraditions
>

_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

G. Iulius Scaurus Gn. Salici Asturi salutem dicit.

Salve, Gn. Salix.

> > #25 Christian Wicca (I am I the only one who thinks this is as much
> > an oxymoron as "Jewish Nazism"?)
>
> It does sound quite complicated, yes. However, as someone quite
> familiar with Catholicism, I can assure you that such a thing is by
> no means impossible :-).

I understand that in some sociological circumstances (as opposed to
the official doctrine of the church) the virgin is regarded as somone
close to being part of the godhead, and there are period rumours of a
papal pronouncement of Mary as co-redemptrix (I doubt the Catholic
church will ever do this officially for a number of reasons).
Certainly in the folk religion of many largely Catholic areas there is
a veneration of the virgin which borders on worship of a goddess.
While a sociologist of comparative religion might speak of that sort
of thing as a kind of goddess-worship analytically analogous to Wicca.
The problem is that most Catholics and most Wiccans would find that
sort of analytical terminology extremely distasteful. The Catholics
would cite the prohibition of witchcraft in the Old Testament, the
Pauline denunciation of dabblers in magic, and the remorselessly
insistent characterisation of the triune god as male. The Wiccans
would recall their martyrs (even if the estimates of executions for
witchcraft before the emergence of Protestantism are grossly excessive
-- Protestants were the great witch-burners -- the visceral reaction
would usually be revulsion at a syncretistic association with
Christianity) and feel revulsion. At the level of coherent theology I
have great difficulty thinking that people who want to merge Wicca and
Christianity are being faithful to either tradition.

> (No offence meant towards our Catholic citizens; just a little joke
> :-) ).

Nor did I intend offence, but this sort of marginalised movement
doesn't seem to sit well with either mainstream Wicca or mainstream
Christianity.

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Salvete Omnes

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
NOVA ROMA INTERNATIONAL RALLY 2756 - Bologna [Italia]
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I'm proud to invite all of you
to the NOVA ROMA INTERNATIONAL RALLY 2756 , the
Internation Meeting of the Nova Roma citizens.
It will take place from 1st to 3th August 2003 in Bologna,
the ancient Roman Bonomia in Provincia Italia. The
Rally is open to all the citizens of Nova Roma,
their friends and families are all invited take part in
two days of exciting events, interesting classes and
funny Roman days.

You can find detailed informations at
http://aediles.novaroma.org/apulus/meeting
or contacting fraelov@... or mcserapio@...
or subscribing the official mailing list at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NovaRomanMeeting2003

:: The Program
During the Meeting the participants will meet
other citizens, visit the wonderful city, stay in
beautiful locations discussing Nova Roma and
Classical matters, assist with live demonstrations of military arts,
attend training camps like gladiatorial combats and
cooking, visit the wonderful ancient ruins in the
ancient Regio Augustea called Emilia and more!
The most important event will be the Bonomia
Village, an two day event in the garden of a
wonderful Renaissance's building. During this two
days you can assist with the meetings of
Magistrates, watch the various re-enactment shows,
listen to original Roman music, attend
classes and eat a Roman theme lunch in a natural
location lit by Roman torches.

You can find a detailed program at
http://aediles.novaroma.org/apulus/meeting/program.htm

:: Accomodation
The participants have the possibility to book a
suggested accomodation in a cheap and comfortable
residence. We have two residences, one in the centre
of the city [Piazza Maggiore] and one near the
University in a medieval building. There are flats
with 4, 6 and 8 beds, with bathroom, kitchen, air
conditioning, etc. The price is 35 Euro per person per
night. If you want resevate this residence, the deadline is 10th June
If you want a cheaper or more elegant accomodation
we give you a long list of suggested hotels.

Further informations at
http://aediles.novaroma.org/apulus/meeting/accomodation.htm

:: Bologna, the ancient Bonomia
Bologna is the capital of Italian and European
culture. Here the first University was founded and
here lived famous artists like Petrarca and Dante
Alighieri. It is a medieval and Renaissance city
with wonderful monuments, buildings and museums.
Bologna was founded by Etruscans under the name of Felsina during the
VI sec B.C.
In 189 B.C. Romans placed a latin colony in this area calling
it "Bononia".
Here there is the famous Via Emilia and
this is the land of Etruscans. In this area you can
visit the Roman imperial capital, Ravenna, and other
important Roman cities.
Today Bologna is the most interesting city in Italy
for cultural events. Every day you can find
museums, live music events, shows, expositions, etc.

Further informations at
http://aediles.novaroma.org/apulus/meeting/bologna.htm

:: How to arrive in Bologna
Bologna is in the centre of the Italy, near the
major italian cities like Milan (250 km),
Venice (100 km), Florence (100 km), Rome (250 km).
By car, Bologna is the cross of the most important highways of Italy.
It also is the centre of the rail network and it
has a good airport serving low-cost fights too
(like RyanAir and EasyJet).

:: Prices
We are sorry, but this event has a little
price, 38 Euro per person. Thie is the "ticket"
for the Bonomia Village because we need money to
organize the events, lend the the location, pay the
restaurant, give you something to drink during the
whole day etc.

:: Organization
The Rally 2756 is organized by the Cohors Aedilis Fr. Apulus Caesar
and by the Provincia Italia.
Thanks to Gens Solaria and the local re-enactors for the help.

So, if you want partecipe to the Rally, send the on-line form-mail at
http://aediles.novaroma.org/apulus/meeting/ or contact us privately.
Please, reservate your partecipation sinca June 2003
We'll give you other detailed informations abotu the Rally in the
next weeks.

We suggest you to subscribe the official mailing list at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NovaRomanMeeting2003 where we can
discuss about all of this points.

ENJOY THE RALLY 2756 !!!

Valete
Fr. Apulus Caesar
Senior Curule Aedile
Propraetor Provinciae Italiae

Salvete Omnes,
another festival is accomplished and we all thank Illustrus Curule
Aedile Gnaeus Equitius Marinus for his job.

Now it's the time to sum the points and update the lists.
The Floreales Ludi gave us the come back of Factio praesina and of
the best Champion essedum by Manius Constantinus Serapio.
In just one game the Greens have taken the same points of Whites and
now Albata and Praesina are first with 41 points.
Russata loose the second position and now it's 15 points far from the
firsts. Where is Veneta?

About the players Octavius Noricus is even in the first position but
the green Constantinus Serapio and Minucius Audens are trying to
conquer the higest place in the podium.
Now the player place-list give us only green and white players.
Cicatrix is trying to save the Russata positions.
Again, where is the Blues? Crassus is alone?

Further informations at http://aediles.novaroma.org/ludicircenses.htm

The members of each Factio choosen their own flag. They and other
news are publishing in the official websites of teh Factiones.
http://aediles.novaroma.org/praesina
http://aediles.novaroma.org/albata
http://aediles.novaroma.org/russata
http://aediles.novaroma.org/veneta

FACTIONES PLACE-LIST
---------------------------
1) ALBATA ... 41 points
2) PRAESINA .. 41
3) RUSSATA ... 26
4) VENETA .... 14


PLAYERS PLACE-LIST
---------------------------
1) Gn. Octavius Noricus .... 13 points
2) Mn. Constantinus Serapio . 10
3) M. Minucius Audens ....... 10
4) G. Vipsanius Agrippa ..... 10
5) M. Iulius Phillipicae .... 7

Valete
Fr. Apulus Caesar
Senior Curule Aedile

...tomorrow, so fellow Plebians, if you haven't voted already, you
are probably not going to.

However, if you change your mind, head on over to:

http://www.novaroma.org/cursus_honorum/voting/index.html

And if you are not particularily interested in this election anyway,
why not go ahead and vote for Gaius Popillius Laenas.

He is the last name on the list, so it's easy.

Vale!

-----Original Message-----
From : Gregory Rose <gfr@...>
Date : 10 May 2003 02:55:12

>
>> Boudiccan Rebellion
>> http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_507144.html?menu=
>
>This sounds like another opportunity for a movie to make a mockery of
>history. Of course, Boudicca must have had a “macho lover“ to lead
>the rebellion (Tacitus appears to have taken no notice of the chap,

Aaargh! The most salient point about Boudicca is that she /was/ a 'macho lover'. Ironically, they are repeating exactly the same misconception of relegating her to little woman status that caused the rebellion in the first place. Her husband had his own treaty from his own people but he was only her consort. Very likely Rome knew that but found pretending not to a good excuse to try and extend further North.

Caesariensis

“People who go around getting their panties in a knot when they allow
others to threaten their beliefs usually gain nothing but a sore ass...“
--Gwenius Maximus, 01/26/02

"Oh, go away and think for yourselves!".
"Master, tell us how to go away and think for ourselves". - 'Life of Brian'.




--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-----Original Message-----
From : Gregory Rose <gfr@...>
Date : 10 May 2003 02:55:12

>
>> Boudiccan Rebellion
>> http://www.ananova.com/entertainment/story/sm_507144.html?menu=
>
>This sounds like another opportunity for a movie to make a mockery of
>history. Of course, Boudicca must have had a “macho lover“ to lead
>the rebellion (Tacitus appears to have taken no notice of the chap,

Aaargh! The most salient point about Boudicca is that she /was/ a 'macho lover'. Ironically, they are repeating exactly the same misconception of relegating her to little woman status that caused the rebellion in the first place. Her husband had his own treaty from his own people but he was only her consort. Very likely Rome knew that but found pretending not to a good excuse to try and extend further North.
If there's earthquake at Paddington Station when it's released, they can look for her spinning in her grave allegedly under Platform 10.
Caesariensis

“People who go around getting their panties in a knot when they allow
others to threaten their beliefs usually gain nothing but a sore ass...“
--Gwenius Maximus, 01/26/02

"Oh, go away and think for yourselves!".
"Master, tell us how to go away and think for ourselves". - 'Life of Brian'.




--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-----Original Message-----
From : Gaius Vipsanius Agrippa <vipsaniusagrippa@...>
Date : 10 May 2003 12:19:24
Salve

>
>I just took the test and got Mesopotamian Paganism as my number one choice.
>Roman Paganism was number 9. Oddly enough, if you follow the link from
>Roman Paganism it takes you to the SVR.
>

It's a rather odd list. I can't see that many people turning to Lithuanian traditions unless they happen to be Lithuanian. On the other hand, where are Egypt and India or even Slav traditions? I can see very good reasons not to include Mexican tradition; planning permission is difficult for ziggurats and slaughtering people by the coachload with a nice rack of skulls to decorate the house liable to offend the neighbours. Lord Smoking Mirror anyone? I once played a priestess of Tlazolteotl (Filth goddess), a sort of murderous prosititute in Dungeons & Dragons.

Caesariensis


--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-----Original Message-----
From : Gregory Rose <gfr@...>
Date : 10 May 2003 12:30:24

>
>I understand that in some sociological circumstances (as opposed to
>the official doctrine of the church) the virgin is regarded as somone
>close to being part of the godhead, and there are period rumours of a
>papal pronouncement of Mary as co-redemptrix (I doubt the Catholic
>church will ever do this officially for a number of reasons).

Most of the Catholic saints are former gods. Bride/Brigitte whom Patrick refused to marry but became a nun instead is still as venerated as when she was Brighid and Paddy unheard of, (Love to know what motivated that tale), but turning Mary into the Goddess just conflicts too much with the Church's insistance that the whole thing is historical. You end up with two divine incarnations and they have already run into the complication that for Jesus to be immaculate, Mary must be too and for her, so must her mother St. Anne and the thing is never-ending.
I've always understood Christian Wicca to be a Wicca that accepts Jesus as a historical Great Initiate teaching a truer understanding of a god beyond gods than roaring old Jehovah. Less Wicca inside Christianity than Jesus as witch. It doesn't do a lot for the Wicca and completely undermines orthodox Christian belief. Jehovah's witnesses who see Jesus as the Archangel Michael and Muslimms, for whom he is the 2nd Great Prophet might go along but I doubt it.

Caesariensis


--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gnaeus Salix Astur"
<salixastur@y...> wrote:

> >
> > No offense taken honest, really. Pay no attention to that big

pole

> > surrounded by the wood. The ropes? Uhm, mountain climbing,
> > honest. Never mind those chants of "2... 4... 6... 8... who do
> > we incinerate?" That's just a little cheerleading practice,
> > honest.
> > <Evil Grin>
> >
> > Q. Cassius Calvus

> It is always nice to see the performance of pagan rituals, even if
> they belong to a different, slightly intolerant tradition ;-).

Let me tell you a little story. I live across the harbor from Salem,
Massachusetts. Once the home of very intolerant Puritans and forever
tainted with the Witchcraft Trials of 1692, Salem is now a "pagan
mecca." One can't swing a dead black cat without hitting a pagan in
Salem, except during tourist season when tourists outnumber residents
about 2-1 during the day and 10-1 during the Halloween season. My
niece happens to be a pagan and I do have pagan friends outside of
Nova Roma. I'm afraid monotheistic traditions do not hold a monopoly
on intolerance. To sum it up in two words, "witch wars."

Q. Cassius Calvus

Dear NOVA-ROMA-People,

Having been a member of your Group for some time now, (and reading
seriously most of your daily-messages), I can't help to gradually
getting more-and-more "confused", (maybe because of my lack-of-
knowledge)!

On one side I got nearly be drowned in a sea-of-Latin-names-of
Persons/Members); plus an overwhelming-abundance of Latin-Civil-
Servants like Consuls, Praetors, Censors etc.; and many "greetings"
like "Salve" etc. And talkings about "Elections" what-ever...

My humble-question is:
Could You be so kind as to explain to me AGAIN the REAL-AIM of Your
Group; as I don't understand, although being an Historian,
specialised in Ancient-Rome...


Kindest regards, Jachthondus.

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Caesariensis.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, me-in-@d... wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> From : Gregory Rose <gfr@l...>
> Date : 10 May 2003 12:30:24
> >
> > I understand that in some sociological circumstances (as opposed
> > to the official doctrine of the church) the virgin is regarded as
> > somone close to being part of the godhead, and there are period
> > rumours of a papal pronouncement of Mary as co-redemptrix (I
> > doubt the Catholic church will ever do this officially for a
> > number of reasons).
>
> Most of the Catholic saints are former gods. Bride/Brigitte whom
> Patrick refused to marry but became a nun instead is still as
> venerated as when she was Brighid and Paddy unheard of, (Love to
> know what motivated that tale), but turning Mary into the Goddess
> just conflicts too much with the Church's insistance that the whole
> thing is historical.

Please forgive me, Caesariensis; but I think that you are
exaggerating a little bit there. *Some* Catholic saints are former
Gods. Most Catholic saints are divinized dead people.

As for Mary being equated to Jesus, that would transform the Trinity
into a Quartet... The Fab Four or something like that :-).

(Once again, no offence meant :-) ).

> You end up with two divine incarnations and they have already run
> into the complication that for Jesus to be immaculate, Mary must be
> too and for her, so must her mother St. Anne and the thing is never-
> ending.

The funniest thing is that it all comes from a translation mistake.
Hieronimus (the translator of the "Vulgata") translated the Greek
word "parthenos" (maiden, young woman; probably a virgin, but not
necessarily so) into the Latin word "virgo" (virgin).

That's probably one of the most important translation mistakes in
History :-).

> I've always understood Christian Wicca to be a Wicca that accepts
> Jesus as a historical Great Initiate teaching a truer understanding
> of a god beyond gods than roaring old Jehovah. Less Wicca inside
> Christianity than Jesus as witch.

I have the feeling that anyone seriously considering that option will
be immediately labeled as "heretic" by the Catholic Curch.

> It doesn't do a lot for the Wicca and completely undermines
> orthodox Christian belief. Jehovah's witnesses who see Jesus as the
> Archangel Michael and Muslimms, for whom he is the 2nd Great
> Prophet might go along but I doubt it.

I think that none of those two groups sees magic (and thus Wicca)
under a favourable light.

CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Q. Cassi Calve.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "quintuscassiuscalvus"
<richmal@a...> wrote:

<<snipped>>

> Let me tell you a little story. I live across the harbor from
> Salem, Massachusetts. Once the home of very intolerant Puritans
> and forever tainted with the Witchcraft Trials of 1692, Salem is
> now a "pagan mecca."

I guess that it is quite natural for some people to consider Salem a
place of pilgrimage. Places of martyrdom have always been, even if I
think that most (if not all) of the people executed during the Salem
witch trials were actually Christians.

> One can't swing a dead black cat without hitting a pagan in
> Salem, except during tourist season when tourists outnumber
> residents about 2-1 during the day and 10-1 during the Halloween
> season. My niece happens to be a pagan and I do have pagan friends
> outside of Nova Roma. I'm afraid monotheistic traditions do not
> hold a monopoly on intolerance. To sum it up in two words, "witch
> wars."

That is true: intolerance is not limited to just certain religious
paths. Unfortunately, it is a quite common feature of human nature.

CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gnaeus Salix Astur"
<salixastur@y...> wrote:

> Salvete Quirites; et salve, Q. Cassi Calve.
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "quintuscassiuscalvus"
> <richmal@a...> wrote:
>
> <<snipped>>

<snipped again> <g>

> I guess that it is quite natural for some people to consider Salem

a

> place of pilgrimage. Places of martyrdom have always been, even if

I

> think that most (if not all) of the people executed during the

Salem

> witch trials were actually Christians.

Quite true about that. What many people do not realize is that what
is now Salem is only a small portion of what was Salem in 1692. Most
of the accused came from what is now Danvers. Danvers was very
fertile farmland back then and still has farms in the more outline
areas. What is now Salem was and is mostly rocky penisula. One of
the interesting features of the judicial system back then was that a
person convicted of witchcraft had their property confiscated. Hmmmm
nice fertile farm land over there.... There was more to it than that
but human greed played a big role as well as petty fueds between
neighbors and politics where church and state are one and the same.
Though one of the 19 that were hanged, Bridget Bishop, most likely
did practice a form of folk magic from physical evidence of poppet
dolls and such, but I hardly think she was astral projecting herself
to torment "innocent" children and having wild orgies in the woods
with demons and such. Her worse crime was being a strong willed
woman in an age when such was not appreciated.

Well this is way off Roman topic so better to let it go at that.

Q. Cassius Calvus

Salve Jachthondus

I am speaking as a Citizen of Nova Roma but I am speaking only for MYSELF and not for Nova Roma as a group.

As you have seen on our website Nova Roma:
" is an organization dedicated to the study and restoration of ancient Roman culture. From its legendary founding in 753 BCE to 330 CE, when it ceased to be the center of Imperial authority, Rome set the standard and laid the foundation for our modern Western civilization. Rome civilized the world, and we see the need for that divine mission to begin again."

I believe that the majority of Nova Romans would like to see a physical restoration somewhere in the world, A City-state governed under the Nova Roma Constitution ( and as close to the unwritten constitution of Ancient Rome as possible , given that 2000+ years have elapsed since the Republic fell). Some Nova Romans see this as just an administrative center, while I and others see us building the first NEW ROMAN CITY IN 2000+ years. Apartments , markets , temples, townhouses ,schools, a Senate house, libraries, a university etc . Some people would settle in Nova Roma as part of their retirement, others would come to help to set up schools or business or to bring the medical arts to the city. We might even let in a few ( very few ) advocates (lawyers) (GRIN). We would have immigrants just like any other place in the world.

Until that day we share, teach, study, show, and re-enact... our love of Rome and her history, we work as a community in the WWW and at person to person meetings like Roman Days in Maryland in early June or the NOVA ROMA INTERNATIONAL RALLY 2756 , that will take place from 1st to 3rd August 2003 in Bologna.
There is also another Nova Roma meeting in late June in Las Vegas Nevada, USA.

The City of Nova Roma would not have slavery, women would have equal rights, the State religion would be the Religio Romana but each and every citizen would be free to worship as they choose. We would build our new Rome on land that we bought and not taken in conquest.

We would build the worlds largest archaeological research center on Roman and Mediterranean civilizations. The Nova Roma Ministry of Archaeology would conduct or sponsor vast archaeology projects that would fill the Nova Roma museum of Roman History with thousands of artifacts from the Med ( underwater archaeology )and from other places our sponsored digs would go.
These artifacts would also be placed in the public spaces of our fair city.

This New Rome (Nova Roma) would have Latin as it's national language and we would work hard to reestablish Latin as a living language. We already have a national standard and some are working on a national Anthem. NONE of us sees this as EASY or just around the corner, but we have faith, after all Rome wasn't build in a day.

Again from our web site
"Also important is the Via Romana; a general revival of Roman culture, arts, and most especially what are known as the Roman Virtues. . These Virtues are what gave a small city on the banks of the Tiber the moral and practical strength to govern much of the world, and are most sorely lacking in our society today. By promoting Roman culture, we are in effect promoting nothing less than the revitalization of Western society. By practicing Roman crafts and arts, we more fully understand our own Western roots.

Nova Roma is more than a historical recreation society, although we are that. We are more than a pagan religious organization, although we are that, too. We are more than a classical studies group, but that falls within our purview as well. We are nothing less than a sovereign nation; an attempt to re-create the best of classical pagan Rome (with a few compromises to modern times)... and if we fall short of the goal of a physical Nova Roma then, the macro societies that we live in can only be better off with a group of people who practiced the Roman Virtues in their daily life and who shared their love and knowledge of Rome with others.

Just like the Rome of old:

"Our Republic is not the work of genius of one man alone, but of many. It was not created during the life span of one individual, but build up throughout the centuries ." Cato , in Cicero De Republic 2.2


Finally, the simply answer to your question is that NOVA ROMA ...IS A WORK IN PROGRESS

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
Citizen
Nova Roma
Fortuna Favet Fortibus







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "jachthondus" <rompy@x> wrote:

> Dear NOVA-ROMA-People,
>>>
> My humble-question is:
> Could You be so kind as to explain to me AGAIN the REAL-AIM of Your
> Group; as I don't understand, although being an Historian,
> specialised in Ancient-Rome...
>
>
> Kindest regards, Jachthondus.

Hello (Salve) Jachthondus,

I copied this text from our introduction to via Romana. I think it
explains the REAL-AIM of this group reasonably well:

The Via Romana is the Roman Way of life. It is the direct application
of Roman ethics, virtues, and philosophies in everyday life, and it
is one of the the goals of NOVA ROMA to promote the Via Romana among
its citizens. One of the cornerstones of the Via Romana are the
Virtues; those qualities which define the ideal state of being and
behavior of the Roman Citizen. While no one can ever completely and
perfectly embody the Virtues, they remain as the goal towards which
we strive, and serve as the benchmark against which we may measure
ourselves.

The Via Romana also includes the various philosophical schools that
were active in the historical Roman Empire. Chief among these were
the Stoics and the Epicureans, although various other, less well
represented, schools existed as well. Roman philosophy provides what
the Religio Romana does not (nor does it try to); a coherent moral
code for personal behavior. Thus, while all of us are Citizens of
NOVA ROMA, and most are practitioners of the Religio Romana to one or
another extent, the choice of personal philosophy allows the
individual to express his or her personal moral and cosmological
inclinations within the larger framework of Roman society and
religion. This separation of personal philosophy and religion is one
of the most healthy aspects of the Religio Romana, and one of the
reasons it is so uniquely suited for modern times.

Finally, the Via Romana, in the modern context, refers to the general
study and practice of Roman culture. As with all aspects of NOVA
ROMA, the extent to which any given Citizen indulges in this area is
up to his or her own inclination; but it is certainly encouraged.
This includes the learning and use of the Latin language, the study
and reenactment of Roman arts (including historical military
reenactment), the production of Roman drama, the study of Roman
history, and a wide variety of other pursuits. It is as part of the
Via Romana that Citizens are expected to take up Roman names for use
within our society. Similarly, each Citizen is considered to be a
member of one of the gentes (families); new citizens may either be
adopted by existing gentes or may form their own.

As with all things that make up the Via Romana, the emphasis is on
the practical application of these arts and this knowledge in our
everyday lives. We study Rome because we seek to emulate Rome; we
emulate Rome because we admire Rome.

A FEW OTHER POINTS

1 We would eventually like to get a piece of land and have a mini
nation somewhat like the Vatican. They will build Roman structures on
it and put our ideas into practice; maybe an ancient version of
biosphere.

2 My personal view is that Nova Roma also serves as a great meeting
place for exchanges of ideas, comdradeship and interaction that would
have not been possible 15 years ago. All of us that are members have
one thing in common, a fascination and passion for Ancient Rome. Here
there are novices, middle of the line and experts on Ancient Rome.
When I come here to read, learn, chat or take a course I know that
the others around this site share in my interests. In reality,
outside of NR I find little interest by my peers in Ancient Rome, a
Rome that must compete with dozens of sitcoms, scandals in the
government, who gets off what island, soap operas and the Simpsons.
Just like any other organizations, no matter how big, we do have
problems and differences sometimes and a minority of the people do
the majority of the interactions and work but work hard they do.


I hope this helps your inquiery; Others will respond to this post
soon.

Yours respectfully,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Joseph Kelly)

"Yours respectfully, Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Joseph Kelly)"


Hay Mr. Kelly shouldn't we be building a Nova Hibernia ( a big Celtic grin)

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus ( Timothy Paul Gallagher)





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete omnes,

I want to draw your attention to a good series of history lectures
that they show very early in the mornings on the Learning Channel.
The program is called " The Western Tradition" by Professor Eugene
Weber oe UCLA. It has been running off and on since the late 80's and
covers Ancient Egypt to the Cold War. I draw this to your attention
because his series of lectures that cover Ancient Rome are just
terrific. I'm trying to find and buy thi series on video (33 tapes)
but it seems to be just available for study courses for now. I'll
keep looking!

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

Ho Mr. Gallagher,

Agricola was wise to stick with trading with but not invading Hibernia
(though he said he could do it with 1 legion) Its said that God gave
the Irish whiskey so they'd never rule the world. No whiskey in those
days but strong drink I bet! Lucky Romans!

Oh, by the way - new historical research being done in the Vatican
suggests that Jesus Christ may really have come from Hibernia. Why?
Who but a Hibernian would be 30 years old, still single and working
at home with mom and dad!

If we're not made Consuls and twin dictators of NR we could take our
marbles, go and start Nova Hibernia. " Rather would I be chief of a
barbarian village than second man in Rome!" (Julius Caesar)

LOL,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus






Big Grin

Quintus Lanius Paulinus



--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Gallagher" <spqr753@m...>
wrote:

> "Yours respectfully, Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Joseph Kelly)"
>
>
> Hay Mr. Kelly shouldn't we be building a Nova Hibernia ( a big

Celtic grin)

>
> Vale
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus ( Timothy Paul Gallagher)
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave Omnes!

Hope everyone is well.
I paid my taxes on the 5th and I sent a message to the
main list stating so. I was wondering, though, when I
would expect to hear from someone that they got the
money and all is well. Also, who exactly handles the
taxes? I've forgot....

Also, I just watched the warrior challenge that pbs
played last week (I missed the first showing and taped
the second). It was good...I thought it was funny
that the one guy used their spongia for cleaning the
dishes....hope it wasn't dual use! It was a pity that
the bath reconstruction they visited wasn't a working
bath....I'd have wanted a complete job if I had been
in charge!



Call going out to Pompeia Cornelia Strabo! Are you
around? What's the scoop in the Sault?

Also, happy belated birthday Sulla! May all continue
to be well for you!

Valete!

=====
Decimus Antoninius Aquitanius Organbidexka

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com

Salve Romans

I just placed an article in the May Eagle on the Rally in Italy set for August 1-3 2003

If anybody has any other events, for the next several months , I would like to post them as well

Please send them ASAP
Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
Curator Differum
Fortuna Favet Fortibus


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave Jachthondus,

Let me try to answer your question, if you do not mind.

Nova Roma is many things to many people. In its broadest concept Nova Roma is a means to learn more about ancient Rome. A place where we can get together to learn together and to debunk inaccuracies (reference the archieves about how accurate Gladiator was) about ancient Rome. In that respect Nova Roma is not much different from any other email list (ie imperialrome2@...).

But, I am certain most of us will think Nova Roma is more than just that. We are in essence a re-creation (resurrection) of a Roman Society. With the express purpose to eventually acquire land to serve as a capital. The Declaration of Nova Roma states (http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/declaration_novaroma.html) that it is our purpose to acquire at least 108 acres of land. This land will be sufficient to develop a Forum, Administrative Offices and Temples to serve the Gods. It is our intent that we will be able to develop that land and with that bring back to the world the lighted candle that was once held by the ancients.

Til that time, Nova Roma has taken the steps to develop administrative (magisterial) offices along the lines of the ancients (during the Republic). Established the Senate and Comitia's and, in what I believe is the most important step...is that we have begin the steps to resurrect the Religio Romana and appoint knowledgable citizens whose duty is to re-establish the contact the ancients had with the Gods of Rome. In addition to those important steps Nova Roma has taken other positive steps as well, such has the establishement of Sodalitas, for the express realization that there are citizens who are not interested in politics, we now have separate lists that only deal with specific subjects (Military studies, culture, Cooking and drinking, Religio Romana studies).

I hope this answers your question. If anything is unclear please feel free to respond and I will do my best to clarify any ambiguity.

Sincerely,

Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix
Senator

----- Original Message -----
From: jachthondus
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 11:01 AM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Roman History.


Dear NOVA-ROMA-People,

Having been a member of your Group for some time now, (and reading
seriously most of your daily-messages), I can't help to gradually
getting more-and-more "confused", (maybe because of my lack-of-
knowledge)!

On one side I got nearly be drowned in a sea-of-Latin-names-of
Persons/Members); plus an overwhelming-abundance of Latin-Civil-
Servants like Consuls, Praetors, Censors etc.; and many "greetings"
like "Salve" etc. And talkings about "Elections" what-ever...

My humble-question is:
Could You be so kind as to explain to me AGAIN the REAL-AIM of Your
Group; as I don't understand, although being an Historian,
specialised in Ancient-Rome...


Kindest regards, Jachthondus.



























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To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

G. Iulius Scaurus Caesariensi salutem dicit

Salve, Caesariensis.

> Aaargh! The most salient point about Boudicca is that she /was/ a

'macho lover'. >Ironically, they are repeating exactly the same
misconception of relegating her to little >woman status that caused
the rebellion in the first place. Her husband had his own >treaty from
his own people but he was only her consort. Very likely Rome knew that

>but found pretending not to a good excuse to try and extend further

North.

I don't understand why you are claiming that Prasutagus was merely
Boudicca's consort. The best evidence suggests that, while women
could rule (most often in the absence of direct male heirs), late Iron
Age British society was patriarchal and tribes were usually ruled by
men (viz. Barry Cunliffe's _Iron Age Communities in Britain_), and the
modest numismatic evidence supports this contention (viz. John
Creighton's _Coins and Power in Late Iron Age Britain_). The account
of the revolt in Tacitus' _Annales_ -- "Rex Icenorum Prasutagus, longa
opulentia clarus, Caesarem heredem duasque filias scripserat, tali
obsequio ratus regnumque et domum suam procul iniuria fore" --
indicates that Prasutagus willed his kingdom to both the emperor and
his two daughters; his _daughters_ became queens of the Iceni by the
will, and the power of Boudicca probably arose from guardianship of
the heirs in tribal law. The case of Cartimandua of the Brigantes is
very like that of Prasutagus' daughters -- she inherited in the
absence of a male heir -- not Boudicca's. The words "heredem
scripserat" indicate that Prasutagus wrote a will in the Roman sense
(and that is evidence of a level of Romanisation that seems to have
been relatively among British client kings in the south). The pretext
for the procurator to despoil Prasutagus's heirs was the fact that
under Roman law a woman could not exercise tutela over heirs (this was
reinforced by the Senatus consultum Velleianum in 46 CE) and the
emperor, by virtue of being the other heir, could assume tutela over
Prasutagus's daughters, which thereby gave him absolute power over the
entire inheritance. With that legal nicety Decianus Catus could do
whatever he pleased with the emperor's authority -- with disasterous
consequences.

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

G. Iulius Scaurus S.P.D.

Avete, Quirites.

Here's a link to "Roman Ball Games":

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/w/x/wxk116/romeball.html

The site is a creation of Dr. Wladyslaw Kowalski, a Research Associate
at the Department of Architectural Engineering, Pennsylvania State
University, who has also created "Roman Board Games" site:

http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/w/x/wxk116/roma/rbgames.html

Valete, Quirites.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Ok all, the below is an invite to the NR meeting that I have in Gallia every
2 months and the link to gens Moravia in case Jachthondus needs a Gens :-)

Beste Jachthondus,

Wij zullen een klein NR vergadering hebben op 25 mei in Tongeren België. U
bent altijd welkom om binnen te springen! Meestals hebben wij slechts 5 of 7
personen. Wij drinken een paar consumpties en chatten een beetje. Dus u moet
niks doen behalve uw glimlach brengen :-) En over een pintje of een cola, ik
kan u zeker een uitlegging geven over Nova Roma en de functies van de
verschillende mensen.

Ik ben ook antwoordelijk voor de Pagan Federatie in België dus de NR
vergadering is in samenwerking met de PF. U kunt de details vinden over de
vergadering op mijn Pagan Federation webstek. Voor informatie in het
Nederlands, http://www24.brinkster.com/paganfedbe/index.html en daarna click
'Open Activities".

Als u wilt een bewoner worden binnen Nova Roma, en ben opzoek voor een Gens,
u bent altijd welkom in mijn gens (Gens Moravia). 3 van onze 6 bewoners zijn
vanuit Vlaanderen. U kunt meer informatie over ons vinden op
http://www.gensmorvia.org

Groetjes,
Diana Moravia Aventina
Tribunus Plebis
http://www.gensmoravia.org


Salve everyone,


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >
> > Most of the Catholic saints are former gods. Bride/Brigitte whom
> > Patrick refused to marry but became a nun instead is still as
> > venerated as when she was Brighid and Paddy unheard of, (Love to
> > know what motivated that tale), but turning Mary into the Goddess
> > just conflicts too much with the Church's insistance that the whole
> > thing is historical.
>
> Please forgive me, Caesariensis; but I think that you are
> exaggerating a little bit there. *Some* Catholic saints are former
> Gods. Most Catholic saints are divinized dead people.
>

Which are given the atributes of a former God and are celebrated the day
of the major celebration of the former God.
Of course this is only true of the saints from antiquity/early middle
age which represent a minority of saints, but are also the most
worshipped saints.

> As for Mary being equated to Jesus, that would transform the Trinity
> into a Quartet... The Fab Four or something like that :-).
>
> (Once again, no offence meant :-) ).
>
> > You end up with two divine incarnations and they have already run
> > into the complication that for Jesus to be immaculate, Mary must be
> > too and for her, so must her mother St. Anne and the thing is never-
> > ending.
>
> The funniest thing is that it all comes from a translation mistake.
> Hieronimus (the translator of the "Vulgata") translated the Greek
> word "parthenos" (maiden, young woman; probably a virgin, but not
> necessarily so) into the Latin word "virgo" (virgin).
>
> That's probably one of the most important translation mistakes in
> History :-).
>

This is not necessarely a translation "mistake". The virgin born saviour
is a common myth of humanity, present in most religions. This always
good propaganda.

Manius Villius Limitanus

> > I've always understood Christian Wicca to be a Wicca that accepts
> > Jesus as a historical Great Initiate teaching a truer understanding
> > of a god beyond gods than roaring old Jehovah. Less Wicca inside
> > Christianity than Jesus as witch.
>
> I have the feeling that anyone seriously considering that option will
> be immediately labeled as "heretic" by the Catholic Curch.
>
> > It doesn't do a lot for the Wicca and completely undermines
> > orthodox Christian belief. Jehovah's witnesses who see Jesus as the
> > Archangel Michael and Muslimms, for whom he is the 2nd Great
> > Prophet might go along but I doubt it.
>
> I think that none of those two groups sees magic (and thus Wicca)
> under a favourable light.
>
> CN·SALIX·ASTVR·T·F·A·NEP·TRIB·OVF
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> Nova-Roma-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>

--
Michel Loos <loos@...>

Salve Illustrus Paulinus,

thank you very much for your help, in the official website you can
find other informations about the Rally in Italy and I'll send you
other news.

Vale
Fr. Apulus Caesar

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Gallagher" <spqr753@m...>
wrote:

> Salve Romans
>
> I just placed an article in the May Eagle on the Rally in Italy set

for August 1-3 2003

>
> If anybody has any other events, for the next several months , I

would like to post them as well

>
> Please send them ASAP
> Vale
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> Curator Differum
> Fortuna Favet Fortibus
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Dear NOVA-ROMA-Friends,

In the first place I want to thank All-of-You for your kindness,
together with Your answers/comments on my "delicate question"!

You certainly did help me to understand Your Group much better; like
You, (on Your turn), seem to have understood My-Personal-approachment
to Roman-History also!

No, I am not looking/longing for some STATE, where one could live
together under the most-ideal Roman-rules-and-laws,as I am a Musician
next to an Historian; and my Musician-ship would make me to
a "Dissident" anyway, in what-ever Community, I fear!...

Nero would have "loved me" without doubts; but I would have been
so "wise" as to shut my mouth, and JUST make MUSIC together with him!

(Why should one discuss items outside of one's own circle-of-Friends?

Greetings to You-All, from Jachthondus.

Salvete Quirites!

I am going to Berlin for a few days (14th of May to 18th of May) and
less then 14 days later (31th of May to 8th of May) I am going to
Rhodes and then there are a month of exams to work with. This will
mean that I will be ockupied or busy for parts of this month. I hope
that it will not be too inconvenient to all Quirites. ;-)

By the way, a late Congratulation to Illustrus Senator Lucius
Cornelius Sulla Felix!
--

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Senior Consul et Senator
Propraetor Thules
Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
Civis Romanus sum
************************************************
Cohors Consulis CFQ
http://www.insulaumbra.com/cohors_consulis_cfq/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

Salve Consul Fabi Quintiliane,

Have a safe and happy trip! All the best.

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
<christer.edling@t...> wrote:

> Salvete Quirites!
>
> I am going to Berlin for a few days (14th of May to 18th of May)

and

> less then 14 days later (31th of May to 8th of May) I am going to
> Rhodes and then there are a month of exams to work with. This will
> mean that I will be ockupied or busy for parts of this month. I

hope

> that it will not be too inconvenient to all Quirites. ;-)
>
> By the way, a late Congratulation to Illustrus Senator Lucius
> Cornelius Sulla Felix!
> --
>
> Vale
>
> Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
> Senior Consul et Senator
> Propraetor Thules
> Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
> Civis Romanus sum
> ************************************************
> Cohors Consulis CFQ
> http://www.insulaumbra.com/cohors_consulis_cfq/
> ************************************************
> Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> "I'll either find a way or make one"
> ************************************************
> Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
> Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

Ave,

Thank you very much Consul. Good luck on your trips.

Vale,

Sulla

----- Original Message -----
From: Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Titus Labienus Fortunatus ; Conclavis Praeparatio Cohors Consulis
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 8:15 AM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Away for two trips


Salvete Quirites!

I am going to Berlin for a few days (14th of May to 18th of May) and
less then 14 days later (31th of May to 8th of May) I am going to
Rhodes and then there are a month of exams to work with. This will
mean that I will be ockupied or busy for parts of this month. I hope
that it will not be too inconvenient to all Quirites. ;-)

By the way, a late Congratulation to Illustrus Senator Lucius
Cornelius Sulla Felix!
--

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Senior Consul et Senator
Propraetor Thules
Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
Civis Romanus sum
************************************************
Cohors Consulis CFQ
http://www.insulaumbra.com/cohors_consulis_cfq/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete, omnes.

I received this to the webmaster-addy. Feel free to encourage him. :)

Valete, Titus Octavius Pius.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kristoffer From wrote:

> I received this to the webmaster-addy.
> Feel free to encourage him. :)

Salvete, omnes.

*mutters about Yahoo* Message below.

Valete, Titus Octavius Pius.

-------------

henrique.romana @ netcabo.pt wrote:

> Hi!
> Soon i will do a Tattoo with a Roman
> Female Gladiator. The problem is that
> i dont have any nice picture of such
> character in order to show to my tattooer.
> Please, if you have any good picture/image
> could you send it to me I would be very
> thankful!
> Best Regards,
> Henrique Romana

On Sun, May 11, 2003 at 05:15:02PM +0200, Caeso Fabius Quintilianus wrote:

> Salvete Quirites!

Salve, Caeso Fabius Quintilianus!

> I am going to Berlin for a few days (14th of May to 18th of May) and
> less then 14 days later (31th of May to 8th of May) I am going to
> Rhodes and then there are a month of exams to work with. This will
> mean that I will be ockupied or busy for parts of this month. I hope
> that it will not be too inconvenient to all Quirites. ;-)

For the moment, I can only envy you; my sailing plans include the Med
(and perhaps an exploration of Germany via the canals), but that's
pretty far off in the future. Enjoy your trip!


Vale,
Caius Minucius Scaevola
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Caelum, non animum mutant, qui trans mare currunt.
The sky, and not his soul, changes the one who runs across the sea.
-- Horace, "Epistulae"

Salvete Amici!

I have contacted our Scipio and I got this answer. So my friends
let's just pray to Goddess Fortuna and he will soon be back. ;-)

"Salve Amice,

I am still alive and mostly well!!
As I have said one month ago, I was not available for a while. My job
is doing fine but
the process to find an apartment in Paris is long and difficult.
Furthermore, my family
is still in Frankfurt and they will stay overthere until I find something.
My back is not doing well, I will see an expert on Monday. It seems
that I will need a
surgery.
For the time being, do not expect much from me. I am very sorry for
the inconvenience. Be
sure that I will come back as soon as possible.
I am very pleased and honored for your support!!

Valete,

Sextus Apollonius Scipio"

--

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Senior Consul et Senator
Propraetor Thules
Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
Civis Romanus sum
************************************************
Cohors Consulis CFQ
http://www.insulaumbra.com/cohors_consulis_cfq/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

Forward.

Vale,

Sulla

___

> ================================================================
> explorator 6.2 May 11, 2003
> ================================================================
> Editor's note: Depending on your mail software, some urls may
> wrap (especially those from the Telegraph) which will require
> you to rebuild the url at your end; if you get a 'file not
> found', check to see if the url wrapped on you. Most urls should
> be active for at least eight hours from the time of publication.
>
> For your computer's protection, Explorator is sent in plain text
> and NEVER has attachments. Be suspicious of any Explorator which
> arrives otherwise!!!
> ================================================================
> ================================================================
>
> Thanks to Arthur Shippee, Michael Oberndorf, Keith Armstrong,
> Joseph Lauer, Trevor Watkins, Luke Kirkwood, Louis A. Okin, Susan Jaslow,

Shiela Winchester, Helena Jaeschke,Hernan Astudillo, Mike Ruggeri, Yonatan
Nadelman, John McMahon,Mark Elliott, Leanne Archer, W. Richard Frahm, Dave
Sowdon, and Paul Cowie for headses

> upses this week (as always hoping I have left no one out)
>
> n.b. 1: This week I had to use a number of email programs as I
> was trying to figure out an email problem I was having (turned out
> to be my anti-spam program); as a result, I may unintentionally
> have left out a 'heads up' acknowledgement.
>
> n.b. 2: Happy Mothers Day to all the mothers out there, redneck
> and otherwise!
>
> ================================================================
> ================================================================
> AFRICA, EUROPE, AND ASIA
> ================================================================
> Fungus is threatening the petroglyphs at Lascaux (is this really
> news?):
>
> http://www.opinionjournal.com/la/?id=110003457
>
> The Sorbonne will continue its dig in the Sinai:
>
> http://www.uk.sis.gov.eg/online/html9/o080523n.htm
>
> A Thracian gold wreath is on display in Sofia:
>
> http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=22244
>
> ... and excitement is building about a pending dig in the
> Halka Bunar area:
>
> http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=22202
>
> Athens new subway turned up piles of artifacts:
>
>

http://www.athensnews.gr/athweb/nathens.print_unique?e=C&f=13011&m=A06&aa=1&eidos=S

>
> A rather ornate Roman bridge once spanned the Tyne, it appears:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/bhho
>
> The vikings were apparently responsible for introducing ironing to

Scotland (evil!):

>
> http://tinyurl.com/b2j4
>
> The latest on the Ayodhya dig:
>
>

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/comp/articleshow?msid=45593923

>
> ================================================================
> THE AMERICAS
> ================================================================
> Archaeologists believe they have found the site of Werewocomoco,
> which, of course, is getting much press attention as the village
> whence came Pocahontas and/or her father:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/07/national/07INDI.html
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3009217.stm
> http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2003-05/cowa-so1050603.php
> http://start.earthlink.net/newsarticle?cat=6&aid=D7QSBQP80_story
>

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2003/05/08/MN224987.DTL

>

http://www.sunspot.net/bal-te.powhatan07may07,0,6063582.story?coll=bal-home-headlines

>
> Drought in Arizona has helped to reveal a Salado site:
>
> http://www.msnbc.com/news/907855.asp
> http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/text/2003/may/05/050509544.html
>
> The Peoria Journal Star has a feature on the Tampica Mounds:
>
> http://www.pjstar.com/news/topnews/g172585a.html
>
> The reburial of a child who was a slave has some interesting reading:
>
> http://www.hometownannapolis.com/cgi-bin/read/2003/05_09-07/TOP
>
> A rural slave jail from Kentucky will be part of the National
> Underground Railroad Freedom Center:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/06/national/06SLAV.html
> ================================================================
> ALSO OF INTEREST
> ================================================================
> An item of interest (perhaps) to those who research the Etruscans:
>
>

http://www.agi.it/english/news.pl?doc=200305061148-0087-RT1-SST-0-NF11&page=0&id=agionline-eng.oggitalia

>
> It's National Archaeology Week down under (or up over, depending
> on your point of view -- nice poster for art teachers who want
> an example of rhythm):
>
> http://www.archaeologyweek.com/
>
> John Kluge has just given the humanities a huge shot in the arm
> (and/or pocketbook):
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/08/national/08KLUG.html
>
> Some news on the efforts to repair the bulge in Temple Mount:
>
>

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/A/JPArticle/ShowFull%26cid=1052362483494

>

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/A/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1052362486494

>
> Ha'aretz has an interview with Israel Finkelstein:
>
>

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=291264&contrassID=2&subContrassID=14&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

>
> ... and the Washington Post has an interview with underwater
> archaeologist Susan Langley:
>
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27364-2003May7.html
>
> The Lindisfarne Gospels are returning to Holy Island, sort of:
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/england/tyne/3017903.stm
>
> A pair of Romanian astronomers claim to have pinpointed the exact
> time of Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection:
>
> http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_778195.html
>
> Oetzi is now claimed to be a "Stone Age Rambo":
>
> http://www.observer.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,949144,00.html
>
> Another 'let's look for Viking DNA in the UK' research project
> is underway:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/bhfo
>
> Mystery stone faces in Massachusetts:
>
>

http://www.boston.com/dailynews/130/region/Ancient_artwork_or_modern_hoax:.shtml

>
> A large number of Aborigine remains were repatriated this week:
>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-2637861,00.html
>
> First UK Education Secretary Charles Clarke was denigrating Classics;
> now he's turned to medievalists (nice list of the degrees held by
> cabinet members in this one):
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/education/3014423.stm
> http://politics.guardian.co.uk/publicservices/story/0,11032,953166,00.html
> cf: http://politics.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,9115,953113,00.html
>
> The UK's Channel 4 caused a bit of controversy this week when it
> used the Uffington Horse as a sort of publicity stunt to
> advertise 'Big Brother':
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/tv_and_radio/3000243.stm
> http://www.observer.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,949147,00.html (interesting

neologism in this one)

> ================================================================
> MAGAZINES AND JOURNALS
> ================================================================
> Ancient Egypt Magazine:
>
> http://www.ancientegyptmagazine.com/issue17.htm
>
> Antiquity 77 (March 2003):
>
> http://antiquity.ac.uk/CurrentIssue/currentindex.html (TOC only)
>
> Arethusa 36.1 (Winter 2003):
>
> http://www.press.jhu.edu/journals/arethusa/toc/are36.1.html

(abstracts/MUSE)

>
> Bulletin of the History of Medicine 77.1 (Spring 2003)
>
>

http://muse.jhu.edu/journals/bulletin_of_the_history_of_medicine/toc/bhm77.1.html
(abstracts/MUSE)

>
> Cambridge Archaeological Journal 12.2 (October 2002):
>
> http://tinyurl.com/bhez (abstracts)
>
> Classical Quarterly 52.2 (December 2002):
>
> http://www3.oup.co.uk/clquaj/current/ (TOCS and claimed abstracts)
>
> Greece and Rome 50.1 (April 2003):
>
> http://www3.oup.co.uk/gromej/current/ (TOCS and claimed abstracts)
>
> Kadmos 41 (2002):
>
> http://www.degruyter.de/journals/kadmos/kadmos41.pdf (TOC)
>
> Minerva (May/June 2003):
>
> http://www.minervamagazine.com/ (scroll down for the new content)
>
> Mnemosyne 56.2 (March 2003):
>
>

http://gessler.ingentaselect.com/vl=11601038/cl=40/nw=1/rpsv/cw/brill/00267074/v56n2/contp1-1.htm
(TOC/abstracts)

>
> Papers from the Institute of Archaeology 13 (2002):
>
> http://www.ucl.ac.uk/archaeology/pia/cvol.html (TOC/abstracts)
>
> TAPA 131.1-2 (Autumn, 2002):
>
>

http://muse.jhu.edu/journals/transactions_of_the_american_philological_association/toc/apa132.1.html
(abstracts/MUSE)

> ================================================================
> ON THE WEB
> ================================================================
> Richard Benkin, "The Modern Destruction of Temple Mount":
>
> http://www.bibleinterp.com/articles/Modern_Destruction.htm
>
> Charles Isbell, "More Comments on the Davies-Dever Exchange":
>
> http://www.bibleinterp.com/articles/More_comments.htm
>
> The James Ossuary is the subject of a Skeptical Inquirer article:
>
> http://www.csicop.org/si/2003-03/bonebox.html
> ================================================================
> NEW ONLINE BOOKS
> ================================================================
> The Characters of Theophrastus (trans. Jebb.):
>
> http://www.eudaemonist.com/biblion/characters/
> ================================================================
> CRIME BEAT
> ================================================================
> One of the steles at the centre of the Shultz case was returned
> to Egypt this week:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/08/international/middleeast/08ARTI.html
>
> ... along with other items:
>
> http://www.uk.sis.gov.eg/online/html9/o100523o.htm
>
> Egyptian police seized close to two hundred 'Islamic dynasty'
> coins this week:
>
> http://web.latercera.cl/lt/Articulo/0,4293,3255_5726_31065213,00.html
> (article in Spanish)
> ================================================================
> AT ABOUT.COM
> ================================================================
> Ancient History Guide N.S. Gill has a feature on the Circus Maximus:
>
> http://ancienthistory.about.com/library/weekly/aa030903a.htm
>
> Archaeology Guide Kris Hirst has a review of Robert F. Boszhardt's *Deep

Cave Art in the Upper Mississippi Valley*:

>
> http://archaeology.about.com/cs/rockart/a/deepcaveart.htm
> ================================================================
> BOOK REVIEWS
> ================================================================
> Adam Nicolson, *God's Secretaries: The Making of the King James
> Bible*:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/08/books/08MASL.html
> ================================================================
> EXHIBITIONS
> ================================================================
> Art of the First Cities: The Third Millennium From the
> Mediterranean to the Indus:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/09/arts/09KIMM.html
> ================================================================
> CLASSICIST'S CORNER
> ================================================================
> Another Bogdanos-has-a-classics-degree piece:
>
>

http://www2.ocregister.com/ocrweb/ocr/article.do?id=38687§ion=NEWS&subsection=AMERICA_AT_WAR&year=2003&month=5&day=11

>
> An interesting double major:
>
>

http://www.courier-journal.com/localnews/2003/05/11ky/met-5-uk05110-7494.html

>
> Political comments from an LSU classics prof:
>
> http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/index.ssf?/base/news-0/105263430749480.xml
>
> I'm not sure whether this opinion piece is endorsing Classics or not:
>
> http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/democrat/news/opinion/5817958.htm
>
> Cambridge appears to know how to do fundraising for Classics:
>
> http://w3.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge/story.asp?StoryID=18962
>
> Anyone else find this choice of commencement speaker strange? (not
> Panetta ... scroll down to the person talking to the ancient
> history types):
>
> http://www.oaklandtribune.com/Stories/0,1413,82~1726~1380260,00.html
>
> Hmmm ... didn't we see this as the future of Classics a decade ago?:
>
> http://www.hno.harvard.edu/gazette/2003/05.08/19-nagy.html
>
> There's a shortage of Latin teachers in Texas:
>
> http://web.dailytimes.com/story.lasso?wcd=5705
>
> Peter Jones:
>
>

http://www.spectator.co.uk/article.php3?table=old§ion=current&issue=2003-05-10&id=3087

>
> Akropolis News in Classical Greek:
> http://www.akwn.net/
>
> Radio Finland's Nuntii Latini
> http://www.yle.fi/fbc/latini/trans.html
>
> Radio Bremen's Der Monatsrückblick - auf Latein

http://www.radiobremen.de/online/latein/

>
> U.S. Weather in Latin:
> http://latin.wunderground.com/
>
> ================================================================
> OBITUARIES
> ================================================================
> Edward A. Dowey (Theologian):
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/08/obituaries/08DOWE.html
>
> Geoffrey S. Kirk (Classicist):
>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/obituaries/story/0,3604,949461,00.html
> ================================================================
> REPEATS
> ================================================================
> Earliest Writing:
>
> http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_5-5-2003_pg6_18
>
> Language Follows the Plough:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/06/science/06LANG.html
> http://www.iht.com/articles/95527.html
>
> Mummy of Ramses I Returned:
>
> http://web.latercera.cl/lt/Articulo/0,4293,3255_5726_30716564,00.html

(Spanish)

>
> ================================================================
> IRAQ
> ================================================================
> The interesting story this week (and not purely of archaeological
> interest) was what was found during the search for a seventh century copy

of the Talmud:

>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/07/international/worldspecial/07FIND.html
>
> More reports that artifacts were actually safely stored away
> prior to the conflict:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/06/international/worldspecial/06MUSE.html
> http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=528232003
>
> ... but also more reports that we might not ever know how much
> was actually stolen:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/arts/entertainment-iraq-usa-exhibit.html
>
> ... and also more reports about organized gangs doing the
> looting:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/international/AP-Iraq-Looted-Art.html
>
> More reports on things being recovered (although we aren't getting news of

'specifics', other than 'only 38 articles are

> missing'):
>
> http://wcbs880.com/siteSearch/terror_story_118164331.html
> (somewhat out of date)
> http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=2700378
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/08/international/worldspecial/08CUST.html
> http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/05/07/sprj.nilaw.iraqi.artifacts/
>
> The St. Louis Post-Dispatch seems skeptical of lots of things (I think
> they mean 'eludes' in the headline, though):
>
> http://tinyurl.com/bhhe
>
> ... and more reports that Marines and the officials of the
> Baghdad museum just can't seem to get along:
>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,950071,00.html
>
> The New York Times had a nice piece on the illicit antiquities
> trade in the region:
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/05/international/worldspecial/05LOOT.html
>
> The opinion pieces continue:
>
> http://www.edinburghnews.com/opinion.cfm?id=526652003
> http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/2003/637/op11.htm
>
> Francis Deblauwe's 'Iraq War and Archaeology' site:
>
> http://cctr.umkc.edu/user/fdeblauwe/iraq.html
>
> ================================================================
> OTHER SOURCES OF ARCHAEOLOGICAL NEWS
> ================================================================
> Archaeologica:
>
> http://www.archaeologica.org/NewsPage.htm
>
> Archaeology Magazine's Newsbriefs:
>
> http://www.archaeology.org/magazine.php?page=0305/newsbriefs/index
>
> Bible and Interpretation Breaking News:
>
> http://www.bibleinterp.com/news.htm
>
> CBA Newsfeed:
>
> http://www.britarch.ac.uk/newsfeed/index.html
>
> CBA Archaeolblog:
>
> http://www.britarch.ac.uk/archaeoblog/
>
> Michael Ruggeri's Ancient America and Mesoamerica News:
>
>

http://community-2.webtv.net/@HH!35!F6!26C030D734B7/Topiltzin-2091/AncientAmericaand/

>
> Mirabilis.ca (blog):
>
> http://www.mirabilis.ca/archives/cat_history_archeology.html
>
> Texas A&M Anthropology News Site:
>
> http://www.tamu.edu/anthropology/news.html
>
> ================================================================
> EXPLORATOR is a weekly newsletter representing the fruits of
> the labours of 'media research division' of The Atrium. Various
> on-line news and magazine sources are scoured for news of the
> ancient world (broadly construed: practically anything relating
> to archaeology or history prior to about 1700 or so is fair
> game) and every Sunday they are delivered to your mailbox free of
> charge!
> ================================================================
> Useful Addresses
> ================================================================
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> by direct posting or snagging from a usenet group or some other
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> ================================================================
> --
> Libertas inaestimabilis res est.
>

-----Original Message-----
From : Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@...>
Date : 11 May 2003 01:49:38

>
>
>Please forgive me, Caesariensis; but I think that you are
>exaggerating a little bit there. *Some* Catholic saints are former
>Gods. Most Catholic saints are divinized dead people.
>

Well yes, and tha maybe why the present Pope is so anxious to canonise even more of them. Just because Rome ruled that all the really popular ones never existed hasn't stopped anyone from invoking them.

>
>The funniest thing is that it all comes from a translation mistake.
>Hieronimus (the translator of the “Vulgata“) translated the Greek
>word “parthenos“ (maiden, young woman; probably a virgin, but not
>necessarily so) into the Latin word “virgo“ (virgin).
>

I'm not at all sure that every Virgo was necessarily Intacta either! In fact I rather think not since that would imply no need to specify Intacta. The translation of Almah into Parthenos is even less likely and the worst of it is that Isaiah was almost certainly referring to a girl his king had just married and ensured the succession.

>I have the feeling that anyone seriously considering that option will
>be immediately labeled as “heretic“ by the Catholic Curch.
>

Luckily, Wiccans are more tolerant than Catholics, though it's remarkable how tolerant Jesuits can become of traditional belilefs, especially when they find American Evangelicals muscling in! For some odd reason there has been more liking for Catholics than other sects with Wiccans, a sort of feeling that they may have got it wrong but at least they've got it. And Mary helps of course.

I came out quite alien to how I feel, though the Roman gods came near the top. I used to be Wiccan but over the years I've drifted more to support Thelema and Gnosticism.



--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-----Original Message-----
From : Gnaeus Salix Astur <salixastur@...>
Date : 11 May 2003 01:49:38

>
>
>Please forgive me, Caesariensis; but I think that you are
>exaggerating a little bit there. *Some* Catholic saints are former
>Gods. Most Catholic saints are divinized dead people.
>

Well yes, and tha maybe why the present Pope is so anxious to canonise even more of them. Just because Rome ruled that all the really popular ones never existed hasn't stopped anyone from invoking them.

>
>The funniest thing is that it all comes from a translation mistake.
>Hieronimus (the translator of the “Vulgata“) translated the Greek
>word “parthenos“ (maiden, young woman; probably a virgin, but not
>necessarily so) into the Latin word “virgo“ (virgin).
>

I'm not at all sure that every Virgo was necessarily Intacta either! In fact I rather think not since that would imply no need to specify Intacta. The translation of Almah into Parthenos is even less likely and the worst of it is that Isaiah was almost certainly referring to a girl his king had just married and ensured the succession.

>I have the feeling that anyone seriously considering that option will
>be immediately labeled as “heretic“ by the Catholic Curch.
>

Luckily, Wiccans are more tolerant than Catholics, though it's remarkable how tolerant Jesuits can become of traditional belilefs, especially when they find American Evangelicals muscling in! For some odd reason there has been more liking for Catholics than other sects with Wiccans, a sort of feeling that they may have got it wrong but at least they've got it. And Mary helps of course.

I came out quite alien to how I feel, though the Roman gods came near the top. I used to be Wiccan but over the years I've drifted more to support Thelema and Gnosticism.
Caesariensis



--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

-----Original Message-----
From : Gregory Rose <gfr@...>
Date : 11 May 2003 05:00:50

>
>I don't understand why you are claiming that Prasutagus was merely
>Boudicca's consort. The best evidence suggests that, while women
>could rule (most often in the absence of direct male heirs), late Iron
>Age British society was patriarchal and tribes were usually ruled by
>men (viz. Barry Cunliffe's _Iron Age Communities in Britain_), and the

Usually but not necessarily invariably. The Picti appear to have been matrilineal. What Is usually suggested is that Prasutagas came of a patriarchal tribe, but Boudicca's Iceni were matriarchal one since she is the one in direct succession and he the stranger. So he had no authority within tribal law to will anything anywhere. That is the start of the clash.

Caesariensis.


--
Personalised email by http://another.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve, Consul

Just a quick note before you leave - did you receive my email dated May 6
about participating in the outreach program?

Vale,

G. Lanius Falco


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sorry for the belated message but as far as the flag goes I got it in the
mail last week and thanks for clarifying the status of my tax payment.
:-)

L Porticus Brutus

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yelbrim Skrain Bodak
Intelligence/Communications
DCS Ravek / Marnak, 7th Order

________________________________________________________________
The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
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VICESIMA QUARTA - NEWSLETTER
MAY 2003
LEGION XXIV MEDIA ATLANTIA
Defending the Frontiers of Ancient Rome
in the Mid-Atlantic Province of North America


Gallio Velius Marsallas
George W. Metz Praefectus / Commander
13 Post Run - Newtown Square PA 19073
legionxxiv@... 610-353-4982
www.legionxxiv.org

John Ebel, Summa Palus, Lead Gladiator
Box 2146 - East Hampton, NY 11937
631-329-2430 home 800-926-2306 office
gladius1@...

Avete et Salutatio Commilitones

ADVENAE - (Newcomers)
Bruno Bado "Brunus Velius Badus" has joined our NovaRoma
Gens Velius. He is a Farmacologist and a true Roman from the
"Mother Country", in Milan Italy. His interests cover most all the
aspects of ancient Rome - religio, politics, culture, latin, reenactment
and history.
We extend to Brunus a welcome into Legion XXIV and NovaRoma.

John Hill from Woodbridge NJ has expressed interest in joining
with us. Being from Central New Jersey, and having previous
reenactment experience, he would be a valuable and welcome addition.

88888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888

ROMAN DAYS ARE COMING ! - ALL ROMAN ! - ALL DAY !
The following is taken from the Legion XX Website and tells all.
Roman Days, is sponsored by our allied Legion XX, and is a display of
ancient military and domestic living history. It is the Twentieth Legion's
own attempt to get as many Romans together in one place as possible.
We will be joining Legion XX and several other groups to mass a total
of fifteen or more soldiers and at least a dozen civilians.
There are merchant booths and an ongoing cooking display.
Activities include tactical drill demonstrations, educational displays
(writing, architecture, etc.), and a fashion show.
Children's activities included making mosaics, writing in Greek, "Bean
the Barbarian", and learning how to march like a soldier. Celts, Greeks,
and other ancient types are also welcome. Civilians, teachers, wargamers.
If you have any interest in ancient history, please come! Be a participant
or just come and talk to everyone about our mutual passion.
Maximus and the Ludus will be on putting several gladiatorial lectures and exhibition fights during the day.
Remember that you do NOT need to be a reenactor or have period clothing to participate! Come and have fun!
The event is open to the public 10 AM to 4 PM, and admission is $5 per person. and free to reenactors in period attire. It is held at Marietta Mansion in Glenn Dale, MD (directions below). If you have any questions, needs, or problems before or during the event, contact Matthew Amt (Quintus) (301-362-3574, mamt@...) or Susan Wolfe, the Site Manager (301-464-5291).

FRIDAY, June 6 Arrival and set-up, general hobnobbing

SATURDAY, June 7
10 AM, Open to the Public
11 AM, Full muster and Opening Remarks
11:30, Kids' Cohort
12 Noon, Lunch--Gladiatorial Show
1 PM Massed Tactical and Drill Demo
1:30, Kids' Cohort
2 PM, Fashion Show
3 PM Evolution of the Roman Soldier
4 PM Close to the Public

SUNDAY, June 8
10 AM, Open to the Public
11 AM Olympic Competition--Armor Race, Pilum Throw, Hamata Toss, Wrestling, various ball games, etc.
11:30 Drill and Kids' Cohort
12 Noon, Gladiatorial Show
1 PM Massed Tactical and Drill Demonstration
1:30 Kids' Cohort
2 PM, Fashion Show
3 PM, Closing parade
4 PM, Close to the public

Arrive and set up on Friday, or Saturday morning. You may camp at the site Friday, Saturday, and Sunday night.
Parking space for the public is available on the grass near the gravel lot and access road. Participants are encouraged to park in the lower field (follow the access road to the bottom).

Participants may camp in period or modern tents--the latter should either be set up out of sight on the lower field or simply taken down during public our hours. There are a number of hotels within a few miles, mainly on Rt. 450 near the Beltway. There will be a large pavilion canopy and a number of smaller pop-up flies for sun and/or rain protection. Participating Legio XX Members will be issued the usual eats, but other participants should supply their own food, or contact Merlinia about her meal plan. Commander Gallio will have some rations for Legion XXIV participants. There will also be a hot dog and snow cone vendor present. There are stores, restaurants, and fast food places within a couple miles, farther west/north along Rt. 193, or near the Beltway.

This is one of the principal outings for Legion XXIV and Legion XX. Make every effort to attend and PLEASE let the Commander know if you are coming, so he can advise Optio Quintus of Legion XX on how many to expect from our unit.

8888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888

QUEST at Settmour Swamp --- May 24 & 25

The SCA Barony of Settmour Swamp has again invited Legion XXIV to participate in their annual Memorial Day Weekend Gathering and Quest. This has always been a fun time, SCA fighting and trials, an evening campfire gathering, story telling, singing and good fellowship. The "Quest" on Sunday is a contest of groups trying to solve a puzzle by finding and gathering clues, much like an Easter Egg Hunt. The Barony has always made the Legion welcome.

As this a non-public event, there is fee of $9 dollars per adult per day.
$5 dollars per day per child. Children under 3 attend free.
A Society wide non-member surcharge is now in effect for adults. This charge is tacked on to your total site fee. Feast Fee is $6. Include Feast reservations with site reservations, sent to the address below.

Send Reservations to:
John Pyrich
180 West Hanover Ave.
Morristown, NJ 07960-2801 (Please use entire zip code+4 digits)
973-267-4818
Directions are posted below.

8888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888

PM JUNIOR ANTHROPOLOGISTS CAMP

"First Call" for the Penn Museum's Classical Week Summer Camp. Meera Patanker is coordinating the UPM's "Anthropologists in the Making" Summer Camp Program for 8 to 13 year old campers during the "Ancient Empires of Greece and Rome" session, which is from 7/14 - 7/18. She says that this session is generally the first one to fill-up.

We have been requested to set-up a legionary and gladiatorial
encampment for one of the days. Jeff Crean and Owen Hutchins attended
last year and were a real highlight... the kids were wide-eyed for days after
meeting them! The Museum is flexible on the specific day of the week.
Please! - Let me know, ASAP, which "week" day any of you can spare
during the week of July 14 thru 18 to take part in this worthwhile endeavor
for the kids, who are always among our most ardent admirers and possible
future classical reenactor prospects. The UPM was very good and
supportive of us in March and now it is our turn to support them.
Check out the event at http://www.museum.upenn.edu/new/edu/kids/summercamp.shtml

With my six scuta and the ones you would bring, we could make a nice size testudo and a gladiatorial bout would really get the kids wound-up!
Our Summa Palus Maximus has given his ascent to be there.
Please get back to me on this - yes or no - and dates you are available?
Let's do this for the kids!

88888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888

FROM THE POST of our Summa Palus John "Maximus" Ebel ---
Ave to all Military and Infamia members of the Ludus Magnus Gladiatores!
I have ordered a Greek hoplite ash shaft, spear head, and butt cap, which
will be assembled and ready for our Hoplomachus fighter, Gaius of Macedonia.
Now we'll get to see the real Greek style!

Aulous of Antioch (Al Barbato) has a nifty surprise for everyone, which shall
remain undisclosed until "Roman Days."

Contact with the Collegium Gladiatorium in Hungary is going great guns.
Thanks to our esteemed Brother Aulous of Antioch, we are in contact with
them and their Opifex, a gentleman named Gustav Garas.
I will provide an update on my communications with this European group
at "Roman Days." I am certain that you will all be very pleased at their
reaction to us, and the width and breadth of our Unit's presence and
exposure WORLDWIDE (Yes, Gallio, I did shout that one out with pride)
due to the efforts of our Esteemed Praefectus Commander with the
development and maintenance of our Legio XXIV/Ludus Magnus website.

By the way, in the Roman Reenactor's links section of cyber-space,
guess which Unit is getting the most hits and been rated the best website?
US!, that's who!!!! BIG URAHHHHH!!!!

Get in shape, Gladiatores . . . our public awaits us in the fair provincia
Media Atlantia. This year, Roman Days sponsor, Cmdr. Quintus (Matt Amt) of
Legio XX has us slated for a 12:00 noon show lasting one full hour.
I want to have a preliminary presentation, followed by at least 4 different-style
engagements, with commentary by Senator Audens, our esteemed Procuratore.
A "high noon" performance means vigorous engagement at the peak of the
sun's rays and mid-day heat . . in June, in Maryland, that could be very intense.
Bring lots of water and drinks like "Gator Ade" and "Yoo Hoo" for energy and
electrolyte replacement. Heatstroke is no joking matter, gfladiatores.
I have been leveled by it twice, and it is no picnic. If you are stricken with it,
you will spend the rest of the weekend in a motel bed recovering with the chills
and shakes. Hydrate!!! Get Some Fat Off and Practice your Moves and do some Cardiovascular Work. Many a skilled combatant has been laid low on
a field of engagement, arena-oriented or otherwise, by such a debilitating
condition. Succumb to it, and your carcass will be processed in the
spoliarium and cut up for lion food. Cave!! Cave!!

As the event in June approaches, please contact me to note your intention to
attend "Roman Days." I remain,

Your Most Humble? and Obedient Servant,

Maximus Mercurius Gladius, Summa Palus

Ludus Magnus Gladiatores Reenactor's Group,
attached to Legio XXIV, Media Atlantia

DIRECTIONS to Marietta Mansion: 5626 Bell Station Rd., Glenn Dale, MD 20769. 301-464-5291. The Site Manager is Susan Wolfe. From I-95/495, the Capital Beltway, take Exit 20 onto Rt. 450 East, go 4 miles, turn left on Rt. 193, then left onto Bell Station Rd. and left again into Marietta. OR Exit Baltimore Parkway Rt 295 south, two left turns onto Rt 193 and go east about 4 miles to the Bell Station Road and right into the Mansion Site.



Red Roof Inn
9050 Lanham Severn Road (Rt. 564)
Lanham, MD 20706
Inn Phone: (301) 731-8830
Inn Fax: (301) 731-4610
For reservations call
1-800-RED-ROOF
Days Inn Legion XXIV and NovaRoma Headquarters.
9023 Annapolis Road (Rt. 450)
Lanham, MD, 20706
301-459-6600
Fax: 301-459-6002
Toll Free Reservations: 1-800-DAYS INN (1-800-329-7466)

Holiday Inn--Greenbelt NASA/Goddard
7200 Hanover Dr.
Greenbelt, MD 20770
800-280-4188

Directions to Settmour Swamp:
The site is located on the Neshanic Station Fire Dept. picnic
grove, corner of River Rd and Elm St, Neshanic Station NJ.

Consult www.mapquest.com using "River Rd and Elm St, Neshanic Station NJ" as the search argument.

Take Rt. 206 to county Rd 514 [Amwell Rd] in Hillsborough.
If you are coming from the north turn right onto Rt 514, if you are
coming from the south turn left.

Stay on Rt 514 for about 8 miles until you come to a 3-way intersection at a
large white Church.

Turn right onto Rt 567 [River Rd]. A mile or so down the road turn left and
go across a white metal girder bridge (Elm St).
The site is just across the bridge on the right.
Rt 206 can be reached from routes I-287 and US-22 from the
north and from routes I-95/295, and I-195 from the south.

FROM ROUTE 202 NORTHBOUND (from Flemington area):
About 5+ miles from Flemington Circle. Turn right on Pleasant Run Road. In about 2 1/2 miles, the road becomes River Road. Make the next right on Elm Street, cross the white metal girder bridge, the site is just across the bridge, on the right.

FROM ROUTE 202 SOUTHBOUND (from Somerville Circle):
Turn left at the traffic light onto Old York Road, then right onto South Branch Road (County Route 567). At the T-intersection, turn left to continue on South Branch Road. After about 4 miles, turn left onto Route 629/Pleasant Run Road. (In about 1/2 mile, the road number will change back to Route 567.) Make the next right on Elm Street, cross the white metal girder bridge, the site is just across the bridge, on the right.

Travel Inn provides budget rates and is on the right side of Rt 202, one mile north of the Flemington Mall. 908-782-2883. It is about 5 miles from Neshanic Station.

Thanking you for your interest in Legion XXIV,

I manere in Viresium et Honorare
I remain in Strength and Honor

(take your pick)
Tuus in Sodalicio Romanae Republica
Yours in the Comradeship of the Roman Republic

Tuus in Sodalicio Romanae Imperi
Yours in the Comradeship of the Roman Empire

Gallio / George



DIRECTIONS to Marietta Mansion: 5626 Bell Station Rd., Glenn Dale, MD 20769. 301-464-5291. The Site Manager is Susan Wolfe. From I-95/495, the Capital Beltway, take Exit 20 onto Rt. 450 East, go 4 miles, turn left on Rt. 193, then left onto Bell Station Rd. and left again into Marietta


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, me-in-@d... wrote:

> -----Original Message-----
> From : Gregory Rose <gfr@i...>
> Date : 10 May 2003 02:55:12
>
>>
> "People who go around getting their panties in a knot when they

allow

> others to threaten their beliefs usually gain nothing but a sore

ass..."

> --Gwenius Maximus, 01/26/02
>
>

Not me Caesariensis. I wear the silky cling-free thong type which are
in vogue these days. Can't get them into a knot no matter what people
say to annoy me. I don't mean to sound strange but sometimes I like
to get in touch with my femimine side.

LOL - Quintus Lanius Paulinus

>
>
>
> --
> Personalised email by http://another.com
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

G. Iulius Scaurus Caesariensi salutem dicit.

Salve, Caesariensis.

Carsariensis scriptsit:

> Usually but not necessarily invariably. The Picti appear to have

been matrilineal. What Is usually suggested is that Prasutagas came
of a patriarchal tribe, but Boudicca's Iceni were matriarchal one
since she is the one in direct succession and he the stranger. So he
had no authority within tribal law to will anything anywhere. That is
the start of the clash.

I am curious about the evidence on which you assert that the Iceni
were matrilinear. The numismatic evidence suggests that rulership
among the Iceni was patrilinear. The first inscribed Iceni coin,
dated to the beginning of first century CE, bears the name CAN DVRO.
Circa 25 CE Iceni coins appear beaing the name ANTED[IOS], the Roman
client king with whom are also associated coins inscribed with the
tribal name (ICEN). By 45 CE rivals to Antedios began to issue coins,
AESV[NOS] and SAENV[VAX]. This numismatic evidence may point to the
origins of the Icenian war of 47 CE (Tacitus, Annales, xii.13).
Coinage of Prasutagus appears shortly thereafter bearing the
inscription SUB RI PRASTO ESICO FECIT (under king Prasutagus Esico
made it) and imitating Roman iconography. A nice photograph of the
coin with this inscription can be found at:
http://www.unc.edu/courses/art111/celtic/catalogue/boudica/coins.html
Jonathan Williams' contention that the die was flawed, i.e., the RI
should be read as ESU, and identification of the king's name as
IISVPRASV of the Corieltauvi has not been generally accepted by
numismatists and historians.

There is no inscriptional evidence of coins issued by Boudicca, and
the normal-face/horse types sometimes assigned to the Boudiccan revolt
(R.D. Van Arsdell, ÒThe Coinage of Queen Boudicca,Ó Numismatic
Circular 95 (1987)) are found in hoards some of which are as likely to
have occurred during the Claudian invasion and its aftermath. Even if
the Field Baulk deposit occurred in connection with the Boudiccan
revolt, there is no good reason to assume that all the coins found
there were minted in connection with the revolt. They are likely to
be of earlier provenance (and rather finer than one would expect with
rapid production of coinage to sustain a rebellion) and are associated
with the boar/horse type, of which type the coin with the inscription
CAN DVRO is an example. The normal-face/horse type of Iceni coins
features a moustached male profile on the obverse, which seems to ill
accord with the independent coinage of a queen of the Iceni.

BODVOC is a name inscribed on Dobunnic coins toward the end of the
first century BCE, and he is thought to have been the leader of the
northern Dobunni. There is reason to believe that the expanded form
of his name was Bodvoccus. It is speculative, but not unreasonable,
to suppose a relationship between a name found among the Dubonni and
the name of Prasutagus' wife. A connection to an element of the
Dubonnic nobility may explain the participation of some of the Dubonni
in the revolt of 60CE (the appearance of the name ANTED[...] in coins
of the Dobunni from early first century CE may also suggest an
alternative hypothesis that Bodvoc was a name shared with the Iceni).
I also do not dismiss out of hand the suggestion that Boudicca was
from the ruling family of the Trinovantes, which would help to explain
that tribe's ready participation in the revolt. While royal marriages
across tribes is little attested in the sparse evidence from Iron Age
Britain, there is good evidence of it occurring among the Gauls.

There doesn't seem to me to be much literary or numismatic evidence
that Prasutagus was just the consort of a sovereign Boudicca, but I'd
be glad to read evidence to the contrary.

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory Rose" <gfr@i...> wrote:

> G. Iulius Scaurus Caesariensi salutem dicit.
>
> >
> I am curious about the evidence on which you assert that the Iceni
> were matrilinear. The numismatic evidence suggests that rulership
> among the Iceni was patrilinear. The first inscribed Iceni coin,
> dated to the beginning of first century CE, bears the name CAN DVRO.
> Circa 25 CE Iceni coins appear beaing the name ANTED[IOS], the Roman
> client king with whom are also associated coins inscribed with the
> tribal name (ICEN). By 45 CE rivals to Antedios began to issue

coins...snip for space,

>>
> G. Iulius Scaurus

Salve G. Iulius Scaurus,

Wow, do you know your stuff or what! I think my time might be better
spent listening than talking when you have the floor. Great work!

Respectfully,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

LOL!!!!

Wow..this is something I would have expected to see on the Back alley. :)

Vale,

Sulla

----- Original Message -----
From: Quintus Lanius Paulinus (Michael Kelly)
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003 7:37 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: test / two upcoming movies to look forward to!


--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, me-in-@d... wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> From : Gregory Rose <gfr@i...>
> Date : 10 May 2003 02:55:12
>
>>
> "People who go around getting their panties in a knot when they
allow
> others to threaten their beliefs usually gain nothing but a sore
ass..."
> --Gwenius Maximus, 01/26/02
>
>
Not me Caesariensis. I wear the silky cling-free thong type which are
in vogue these days. Can't get them into a knot no matter what people
say to annoy me. I don't mean to sound strange but sometimes I like
to get in touch with my femimine side.

LOL - Quintus Lanius Paulinus
>
>
>
> --
> Personalised email by http://another.com
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

G. Iulius Scaurus Q. Lanio Paulino salutem dicit.

Salve, Q. Lani.

> Wow, do you know your stuff or what! I think my time might be better
> spent listening than talking when you have the floor. Great work!

Thank you for the kind words, but I would much rather expand the
conversation about these things than incline others to silence. Many
years ago I studied with Eric Birley who instilled a love for things
Romano-British in me, and the bulk of what we know about the history
of early Roman Britain comes from numismatics, epigraphy, and
archaeology, since the literary sources are sparse and often coloured
by the authors' views on internal Roman politics.

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

G. Iulius Scaurus L. Cornelio Sullae Felici salutem dicit.

Salve, L. Corneli.

> LOL!!!!
>
> Wow..this is something I would have expected to see on the Back

alley. :)

We tend to forget that, at least according to the Forma Urbis, most
Romans did live on back alleys :-).

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory Rose" <gfr@i...> wrote:

> G. Iulius Scaurus L. Cornelio Sullae Felici salutem dicit.
>

Salvete gentlemen,

That proverb has lingered on our postings for a while so I couldn't
resist. Alas I have been on this remote location in our North West
Territories for a month now; moccasins begin to look like high heels!
Ah, perhaps I'm getting bushed but my relief is schedualed to arrive
on the 14 th. Mead and cold beer awaits my arrival and will surely
help to clear my head.

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

> Salve, L. Corneli.
>
> > LOL!!!!
> >
> > Wow..this is something I would have expected to see on the Back
> alley. :)
>
> We tend to forget that, at least according to the Forma Urbis, most
> Romans did live on back alleys :-).
>
> Vale.
>
> G. Iulius Scaurus

G. Iulius Scaurus S.P.D.

Avete, Quirites.

The discussion today about coins of the Iceni and Boudicca's revolt
suggested to me that some might be interested in a link to the Oxford
Celtic Coin Index:

http://athens.arch.ox.ac.uk/coins/ccindex.htm

This site, maintained by Dr. Philip de Jersey, provides an excellent
introduction to Iron Age British coins and also includes a link to the
Celtic Coin Index Online, a searchable database with images of coins
in the index.

Valete, Quirites.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Salve Honorable G. Lanius Falco!

Yes, I recieved it and I will answer You soon.

>Salve, Consul
>
>Just a quick note before you leave - did you receive my email dated May 6
>about participating in the outreach program?
>
>Vale,
>
>G. Lanius Falco

--

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Senior Consul et Senator
Propraetor Thules
Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
Civis Romanus sum
************************************************
Cohors Consulis CFQ
http://www.insulaumbra.com/cohors_consulis_cfq/
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

Salus et Fortuna,

A recent "saint" of the Roman Catholic church is a relative: Padre Pio.

He is (was) a cousin of my maternal grandfather (a descendant of the Horati), who sincerely believes
that his left leg was healed by the Padre's "laying of hands."

=========================================
In Amicus sub Fidelis
- Piperbarbus Ullerius Venator

I am Asatrú. I practiced Roman Catholicism.
Thereby hangs the difference I think.

Salve Illustrus Consul et Amice,

have a nice trip in Germany. Berlin is wonderful and I think you'll
like it (when I went in Berlin, I was reading the phanta-political
romances by Harris ...).

Please, can you confirm your partecipation to the Rally 2756 and of
your friends? Thank you again and I wait for you in Bologna! :-)

Vale bene
Fr. Apulus Caesar


--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
<christer.edling@t...> wrote:

> Salvete Quirites!
>
> I am going to Berlin for a few days (14th of May to 18th of May)

and

> less then 14 days later (31th of May to 8th of May) I am going to
> Rhodes and then there are a month of exams to work with. This will
> mean that I will be ockupied or busy for parts of this month. I

hope

> that it will not be too inconvenient to all Quirites. ;-)
>
> By the way, a late Congratulation to Illustrus Senator Lucius
> Cornelius Sulla Felix!
> --
>
> Vale
>
> Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
> Senior Consul et Senator
> Propraetor Thules
> Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
> Civis Romanus sum
> ************************************************
> Cohors Consulis CFQ
> http://www.insulaumbra.com/cohors_consulis_cfq/
> ************************************************
> Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> "I'll either find a way or make one"
> ************************************************
> Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
> Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

Avete omnes,

having read this message, I've begun a research on major Italian
newspapers to see if this news was true or not. I believe that at the
moment there's no mobilization at all in Italian architectural and
archaeological world, probably because this danger does not exist.
As some of you may know, I met less than a month ago (together with
other Italic citizens) D.ssa Irene Iacopi, chief of the Archeological
area of Palatine hill (and Roman Forum) about the Magna Mater
project. During this meeting nothing was said about something wrong
in the hill. D.ssa Iacopi also added that the works of restoration of
the south western side of the hill are almost completed and the site
was to be reopened later (before summer).
I have contacted also Professor Patrizio Pensabene of Rome
University "La Sapienza", he being the archeologist who's been
following the restoration in that area for the past 25 years, and he
didn't mention the fact. Instead he proposed us some important ways
of collaboration with Soprintendenza Archeologica, which will be
communicated to you by our Senior Aedile later as more information
and agreements are gained!


Valete bene

Marcus Iulius Perusianus
--------------------------------------------------------------
Legatus Internis Rebus et Scriba ad historiam Provinciae Italiae
Scriba Aedilis Historicus Primus
Scriba Curatoris Differum
--------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.geocities.com/m_iulius
http://italia.novaroma.org
http://italia.novaroma.org/fac
--------------------------------------------------------------
AEQVAM MEMENTO REBVS IN ARDVIS SERVARE MENTEM

> --------------------------------------
> GLGL FRS0808 4 HAS Italy Architecture Mobilisation to save the
> Palatine, the hill that saw the birth of Rome.
>
> ROME, May 8 (AFP) - Italian archaeologists and ecologists mobilise

to

> halt the collapse of the Palatine, the hill that saw the birth of

Rome

> and requires an annual budget of 25 million Euros to maintain it.
>
> The hill, located between the Tiber and the Forum, dominates the
> capital and the remnants of the Circus Maximus. It is reknown for

the

> ruins of many imperial residences, temples to Venus and Magna Mater,
> and columns consecrated to the victories of Roman arms.
>
> However, it has weakened with the passing of the centuries and the
> threat of collapse is such that all archaeologists' excavations have
> been deferred.
>
> "The Region Lazio [Latium] must intervene," Angelo Bonnelli, head of
> the group of Greens [head of the parliamentary Green fraction?],
> asserted Thursday in a communique.
>
> "We are in the process of elaborating a regional legal project to
> immediately protect the Palatine and the central archaeological

zone,

> for which an annual funding of 25 million Euros is earmarked," he
> detailed.
>
> Mr. Bonnelli has also announced his intention to lay a bill before

the

> European Parliament in order to allocate funds for the most

important

> restoration projects and excavations on the hill.
> --------------------------------------
> Valete.
>
> G. Iulius Scaurus