Salve Livia Cornelia Hibernia et al

Yes it is a bit "heavy" for a female hand so I will ask about one for females that is somewhat downsized.
And yes the Romans rings were a simple iron band and we will try to fine a composite material to make some of the rings less expensive . Having said that, It needs to be remembered that we are 28th century Nova Romans and not re-enactors although some citizens do re-enact. This would be a distinctive Nova Roma citizenship Ring.

As yesterday was my second anniversary of citizenship I can't wait for us to get and adopt OUR ring.

Thanks for reminding me of the female aspect of the ring. I should have thought of it myself but didn't

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

----- Original Message -----
From: Livia Cornelia Hibernia
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:51 AM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Nova Roma Ring


Salve Tiberius Galerius

First, I for one really appreciate your continuing
efforts to find an acceptable Citizenship ring.

It is a very nice ring, but it is also very expensive.
It also looks to be a bit large for a female hand.

Also, were not the Citizenship rings in antiquity just
a simple iron band? Something more on the lines of a
band with perhaps a space for "S.P.Q.R." would be more
like the original. Also there should be one 'model' that
is done in a less expensive medium, such as the so-called
"German Silver", which is an alloy of silver and nickel
(a lot of Western belt buckles are made of this alloy and
they look almost as good as Sterling at less than half the
price).

Vale
Livia Cornelia Hibernia

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Gallagher" <spqr753@m...>
wrote:
> Salve Romans
>
> I found a ring company that I thought might be able to make our
Nova Roma Ring that we have talked about from time time. Today I was
looking at the Carroll collection on line and guess what they already
have a Roman style ring called the Centurion. You can look at it for
yourself at
>
> http://www.carrollcollection.com/Centurion_Ring.htm
>
>
> I am also going to inquire if they can make one with the SPQR in
the middle instead of the Eagle.
>
>
> Well what do you think?
>
> Vale
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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a siple Iron band


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve F. Galeri,

Thules Academy gives a course in Latin also. Your idea is really good
though because you can only improve on a language with lots of
practice. As G. Iulius Scaurus says, most people have to have
dictionaries and conjugation tables at their side when reading or
composing Latin letters. It would be great to evolve far enough along
that their use would be minimal. Also I discovered that Latin is a
good core language. It would make French, Spanish, Italian,
Portuguese easier to learn. Also we have those noun declensions.
Allah be praised that they were dropped from Spanish and French
hundreds of years ago; however noun declensions are a reality in
German (I think Scandanavian) and most Eastern European contries. A
few German teachers told me that in teaching English students, all
are full of pee and vinegar when they start German classes. The first
few weeks they get a false illusion that they've got the cat by the
tail and will master the language in a few months until..... noun
declensions. More often than not, many disappear from the course soon
after.

It helps to have some motivation to learn, continue and keep up with
a language. With French or Spanish, a girlfriend from those cultures
does wonders. In our case we cannot time travel and bring back sexy
Romamas or Romanos for the girls so your idea of list lessons,
articles and assignments would be very good and motivating.

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@a... wrote:
> F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus Fal S.P.D.
>
> Once again another sign of the Apocalypse has come about with me
agreeing with Senator Drusus. English is indeed the 21st century
equivalent of Greek as the international language. However, it has
recently been discussed privately among several citizens (including
myself) that we should take advantage of the classicists among our
citizens to encourage a new program published on the mainlist.
> Instead of the study of Latin being limited to one of the sodalites
or individuals using a wide number of sources, perhaps NR should
consider a daily (or thrice-weekly) posts of Latin language
instruction on the mainlist. This course could be planned and
executed by a group of volunteers using a few classic works from the
period of 100 BC-100 AD. Everyday a short section of Latin grammar
and reading could be put onto the mainlist to improve the overall
Romitas of our citizens; much as the Curule Aedile is doing with the
calendar and festivals. Within a year, it would enable most of the
citizens and socii who follow the main list & the course of
instruction assiduously to communicate with each other directly in
the language of Rome.
> Since many citizens would be learning or re-learning Latin from a
common source, it would result in a sort of on-line dialect of Nova
Roma. Furthermore, if the Latin is also spoken aloud as one learns
it (yes, I do realize that our own macronational dialects will
influence this) it will allow personal communication on those
occasions when a citizen of America Austrorientalis meets a citizen
from Thule but they do not share either spoken English or Swedish.
> I pray to Mercurius that this plan meets with the approval of the
people of the Republic. Vale.

Salvete Quirites; et salve, Pompeia.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "pompeia_cornelia"
<scriba_forum@h...> wrote:

> ---Salve Salix Astur Consul et Salve Pomponia Fabia Vera:
>
> First of all, Consul, I am glad you took my lighthearted, humourous
> example regarding the use of slang in the spirit with which it was
> intended. Humour doesn't always convey as well as one would like
> electronically.
>
> And to the issue of Latin and Greek roots of words, to which Fabia
> has also alluded, it makes me think about why on earth Latin is not
> a required study in secondary schools. I know where I live it is
> not. Granted English is widely used everywhere, but if knowing
> Latin is a gateway to even basic comprehension of other languages,
> it sure should be a 'must', nonne?

That was precisely the reason why Latin used to be considered a must
in the education of a cultured person. Alas, time change, and so do
educative theories. But perhaps we can contribute to make them change
again :-).

> English and German have their common components too. It is often
> easy for me to clue in to key words when reading a website in
> German, now that I think of it.

That is because both English and German have a common root. They both
are derived from the dialect spoken by the peoples of Central and
Northern Europe in the Early Middle Ages.

S.V.B.E.E.V.
CN.SALIX.T.F.A.NEP.OVF.ASTVR

Slave,
As for the "female" hand, some of us females have rather large hands. I actually usually wear men's rings as most rings designed for the "delicate female hand" make my hands look even worse.

Claudia Fabia Calpurnia

May the forces of evil become confused
on the way to your house.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen Gallagher" <spqr753@...>
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 10:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Nova Roma Ring


> Salve Livia Cornelia Hibernia et al
>
> Yes it is a bit "heavy" for a female hand so I will ask about one for females that is somewhat downsized.

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to his cousin, the Honorable Tribune T. Galerius Paulinus. S.P.D.

The Rosetta Stone program looks good, cousin. Perhaps the quarterly subscription could be purchased by the Republic and could be accessed onto the mainlist. The recent thread on the Latin version of the Oath of Office demonstrates that we do have sufficient classicists in the Republic to do this project in house without having to invest any of the Republic's funds. If there is sufficient response from the active citizenry that this project is a worthy endeavor, perhaps one of the consuls will put it before the Senate so that the monies can be budgeted into the Rosetta Stone or the materials that our classicists would need to work it up.
It would certainly be a significant accomplishment for NR if a majority of the active citizens became not only competent in basic Latin communication but fluent.
I wish you the very best and remember that following the festival of Parentalia next month, the family should have the traditional dinner on-line together.

Your cousin.
Vale.

Actually, cousin, I like the Eagle and believe we should just have SP and QR engraved on each side of the eagle OR get SPQR engrave on each side of the eagle OR get SPQNR engraved on both sides of the eagle. That is a really, really good looking ring and well worth the money.

F Gal Aur Sec Fal

Gnaeus Salix Astur wrote:

> I think that you'd have more chances to get the message through to me
> if you spoke 17th century Mandarin than with that kind of slang ;-).

I don't suppose anyone happens to speak Chinese? I've just this afternoon
bought a "teach yourself" book for Mandarin...

Livia

Salvete,

Just to phrases in Cantonese:

Nay ho ma - How are you?

Nay ho lang - You are pretty.

That's about it.


Quintus Lanius Paulinus




-- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Gaia Fabia Livia" <livia@s...>
wrote:

> Gnaeus Salix Astur wrote:
> > I think that you'd have more chances to get the message through

to me

> > if you spoke 17th century Mandarin than with that kind of slang ;-

).

>
> I don't suppose anyone happens to speak Chinese? I've just this

afternoon

> bought a "teach yourself" book for Mandarin...
>
> Livia

Salvete!

I think it mete to reflect upon the nature of these arguments, and
seek the root of their cause. Pride. Each person loves his mother
tongue, and though the ideal language for a Roman society should be
Latin, there is a business need to speak English.

A business need.

Not a social one.

Thus, I would welcome conversations in any vernacular, especially if
it furthers my experience in the simple pleasures one may take from
diversity. We should not be so remiss, however, as to allow
ourselves to create a praesidium linguae, so parochial as to
segregate provinces; rather, sharing, trade, commerce should be the
rule.

Along the base of the linguistic chasm runs the river of knowledge
and experience from which we all draw sustenance.

That being so, why should we not delight in our individually unique
perspectives, and thus grow, share, live, and love together as a
people ... regardless of the Spoken Word?

Let all citizens rejoice in the subtle nuances each brings to the
great stream of communication, and in that fete do hereby proclaim
an end to the War of Words!

Valete!
Q. Valerius Callidus

Salve Senator Q. Fabi Maxime.

>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, QFabiusMaxmi@a...
> wrote:
>
> > Salvete.
> > Well, People, guess what. The cista is open.
> > And look, Iulius writes English as well Apulus, oh
> joy.

I consider this pure discrimination, even racism. Here
in Belgium we have the same ridiculous 'language
battle'... I did not come to Nova Roma to hear these
kind of things. Shame on you. Be more tolerant!

And if I'm not wrong, your last line quoted here
misses an "as" in order to be correct in English.

Optamo tibi bene valere

=====
Tiberius Apollonius Cicatrix
----------
Paterfamilias Gentis Apolloniae
Scriba Propraetoris Galliae
**HORVM OMNIVM FORTISSIME SVNT BELGAE**

________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping"
your friends today! Download Messenger Now
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/download/index.html

Lucius Equitius Cincinnatus Augur Quiritibus salutem dicit

Salvete Omnes

I want to thank everyone who sent their well wishes, public and private.
The doctors were very pleased with their work, which is good news for me ;-)
They also were happy that my bones were in such good condition and that I
tolerated the operation well. These first days of recovery are difficult,
but
then my body did take a good beating.
I was sent home yesterday and I've been 'catching up'... slowly today.
It's pleasant to know that there are friends out there who care. Until I can
thank you all in person accept this post in stead.

About the Language flap on the list, Again.
I was fortunate to be able to live in Italia for a far too short a time. I
really did have a wonderful time and made many friends because I went out to
get to know them, their language, customs,etc. I even made a few "howlers"
too, They'd have good laugh and would say something along the lines of, "No,
I really don't think your grandma's a whore. I think you mean....." They
really appreciated the effort I think. Anyway, I always came away feeling
welcome and people often went out of their way to assist me. Let's show our
citizens the same hospitality.

Now back to my comfy couch....

Valete, Cincinnatus



Message: 16
Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 18:22:02 -0000
From: "g_iulius_scaurus" <gfr@...>
Subject: L. Equitius Cincinnatus Augur has been injured

G. Iulius Scaurus S. P. D.

Salvete, Quirites.

I have been informed by L. Equitius Cincinnatus Augur's wife that he
broke his hip in a kendo class on Saturday and underwent surgery to
repair the injury on Sunday. He's expected to have to be off his
feet for a minimum of six weeks. Prayers for his swift and full
recovery would be deeply appreciated.

Valete.

G. Iulius Scaurus


________________________________________________________________________

> G. Iulius Scaurus

What dreadful news! Gratias for passing this on, I will pray
earnestly for his comfort and recovery.

--
Julilla Sempronia Magna

________________________________________________________________________


That is nasty, L. Equitius will certainly be in my prayers. Wasn't
he wearing his body armour? That kendo stick can pack a big wallop!
vale Fabia Vera

________________________________________________________________________


Salve

I pray that the illustrious L. Equitius Cincinnatus Augur has a speedy
recovery.

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
________________________________________________________________________


Salve Iulius Scaurus

OH! That's awful! I shall pray to Aesculapius for his speedy recovery.

Bene Vale
Livia Cornelia Hibernia

________________________________________________________________________


Salve Gai Iuli Scaure,

Ouch! I am sorry to hear of L. Equitius Cincinnatus injury. Tomorrow, I
shall make an offering to Minerva Medica on his behalf. . If you are in
touch with him, please convey my best wishes and hopes for a speedy
recovery. I went through knee suegery a few years ago, and know just
unpleasant being stuck on cruches for weeks can be!!


Vale Bene,

C. Minucius Hadrianus
Minerva Templi Sacerdotes

> ---Salvete Omnes:
>
> Ouch is right. I hope all goes well. He is young and is active,
> factors in his favour. I've never had the distinction of fracturing
> anything major, but I know that a sprained wrist can bring more agony
> than I ever anticipated, so I feel for anyone whose broken a large
> bone, or a bone(s) so central to mobility as the hip bones.
>
> Po
>

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Hash: SHA1

PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@... wrote:
| ...when a citizen of America Austrorientalis
| meets a citizen from Thule but they do not
| share either spoken English or Swedish.

Salve, F. Galeri Aureliane Secunde.

As an aside, all citizens of Thule speak English, to varying degrees of
fluency, but all well enough to, say, hold up their end of a
conversation, or read a book. You'll probably find that those swedes, in
particular, who would be considered fluent in their speech, adopt a
british accent and vocabulary. Chips are served hot, usually with fish.

Of course, there is no such thing as a british accent, as the Queen's
English is the proper way English should be pronounced, but you get my
meaning. ;)

Vale, Titus Octavius Pius.

- --

"Qui desiderat bellum, praeparet bellum." - Vetinari
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F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to T. Octavius Pius. Salve.

You will have to pardon me as I am only an ignorant provincial from Tennessee and was unaware of the linguistic accomplishment of the modern Swede. Like so many of the men of my land, we get most of our ideas about the Swedes from certain types of adult movies (ha-ha, but I digress). Still, it would certainly be a benefit if more Nova Romans were competent in Latin. Vale.

Okie-dokie. It has been a long thread about the linguistic deficits or chutzpah surpluses of the various folks involved herein. How abouts we declare a moritorium on further citizen-bashing for the time being. Afterall, a number of ya'll took the same oath that I did that included an implication that we would all work together for the good of the Republic.
Now, there is a current thread that discusses the possibility that a Universal Latin Instruction on the main list might be a good idea to improve communication. If we all get the same Latin instruction, it would certainly be a levelling influence and create some commonalities among our international organization. After all, Nova Roma can never have enough competent speakers of Latin.
Of course, those of you that wish to continue the current course can tell me "Desiste!"

F Gal Aur Sec Fal

Salvete!

I have completed the Domus Ludus website and YahooGroup!! I made these
both initially for my personal use, but have decided to share it with
anyone homeschooling and/or practicing the Religio Romana. The site is
extensive - including the Roman Virtues and over 300 Aesop�s Fables!! It
is a good source of free homeschooling ideas and resources.

Please feel free to take a look and let me know what you think:

http://www.geocities.com/cas_the_author/DomusLudus/

The YahooGroup is also ready. It�s URL is

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DomusLudus/


This site and Group do go along with the Sodalis Familiaris group at

http://www.geocities.com/cas_the_author/sodalis/


And in case you haven�t been there in a while there is also the Temple of
Juno

http://www.geocities.com/cas_the_author/temple/


I have been working quite hard on these. The Temple site is not
complete. I have not added my visions for the Roman Family. I continue
to work on it and someday might get the green light to add it to the
Temple.

I am well. The genetic tests on the baby have come back absolutely
wonderfully!! Now we wait until May when we can finally meet face to
face!!

Pax,
Crys
(aka Seia Silvania Atia)

Rose Abebi (meaning we asked for her and we got her) due May 20,2004
(repeat cesarian)
She will be duckling #3!!
Scriptor's Notes http://scriptor.diary-x.com/
Rose's Page http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/4/4rose/


________________________________________________________________
The best thing to hit the internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
Surf the web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!

Salve Illustris Franciscus Apulus Caesar!

I have no power to beg your pardon in the name of anyone of Gens
Fabia. I can only assure You that not all of us are rude and badly
brought up.

You probably already know that some of the Fabii value You highly! To
me You are a man of honor and I am happy to call You a close friend!
I also must state that I am proud and happy that You dedicate your
valuable time to Nova Roma. Please continue to do so!
--

Vale

Caeso Fabius Quintilianus
Censor, Consularis et Senator
Proconsul Thules
Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
Civis Romanus sum
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

Salve Claudia Fabia

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Paula Drennan" <dragonpink@s...>
wrote:

> Slave,
> As for the "female" hand, some of us females have rather large
> hands. I actually usually wear men's rings as most rings designed
> for the "delicate female hand" make my hands look even worse.

I also have rather large hands. I well know what you mean
about "femmie" rings; they are so small and delicate that they just
make my hand look that much bigger! Even if there is a female
version of the ring I would probably still get the male version.
However, there are, I'm sure, many female Citizens who would rather
the smaller version.

I'm also sure that there are many Citizens of both genders who would
rather a less expensive model too.

Bene Vale
Livia Cornelia Hibernia

Salvete Omnes,

Thank you for the reminder of why I washed my hands of the sordid
politics in Nova Roma!

Days worth of Personal Insults attempting to intimidate a Senator and a
Consular for daring to state a viewpoit that fails to meet Nova Roma's
Politically Correct standards.

Time to go on Index mode so I can delete your disgusting garbage with
one mouse click.

L. Sicinius Drusus

Salve civies,

I have been reading for some time all of the posts concerning
language and speaking and wished to express my views if all will
permit me to do so. I am reminded of what the great statesman
Winston Churchill said "naturally I am biassed in favour of boys
learning English; and then I would let the clever ones learn Latin
as an honour, and Greek as a treat" while read these postings. As an
avid reader I have developed a natural love for my native language
of English and personally feel that it is an artform to which one
must strive to perfect and not to freely throw about as a toy; this
applies also to your native language whatever that might be. One of
the biggest problems in our world is that of poor education of our
children. They are being passed through school as if they were just
another number and most could not tell you the differance between a
noun or an adjective much less read a sentence properly. Cicero also
once said that the definition of a good orator or for that matter of
rhetoric itself is "a good man speaking well". We all share a dual
citizenship so to speak, one to our country of our birth but also to
Nova Roma and as good citizens of our native countries we do all we
can to strengthen it so why not do the same in NR? No I am not
saying we all must speak fluet Latin in three months or else but I
am merely proposing the idea that we need to better ourselves in the
areas of Rome and that goes for each and every one of us. A good
classical education has always benefited anyone who undertook it.
Many great men and women often found there solace in it and history
is full of quotes and ideas which originated from the study of Latin
and virtues of Rome. Just a little something ot think about as I
hope that if you have not yet then please join me on my journey of
perfecting my knowledge of the classics, Latin, as well as my native
tongue. You will find yourself a better citizen in the end.
Vale,
Publius Glaerius Cicero
Brandon W.

Salve Cus

I looked at their website and we can contract to do an organization on-line classes. the powers that be can look in to how much it would cost and each person who joins the class could pay a percent of the cost which would mean no cost to the NR treasury.

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

----- Original Message -----
From: PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@...
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] English, Latin, and Universal Latin Instruction


F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to his cousin, the Honorable Tribune T. Galerius Paulinus. S.P.D.

The Rosetta Stone program looks good, cousin. Perhaps the quarterly subscription could be purchased by the Republic and could be accessed onto the main list. The recent thread on the Latin version of the Oath of Office demonstrates that we do have sufficient classicists in the Republic to do this project in house without having to invest any of the Republic's funds. If there is sufficient response from the active citizenry that this project is a worthy endeavor, perhaps one of the consuls will put it before the Senate so that the monies can be budgeted into the Rosetta Stone or the materials that our classicists would need to work it up.
It would certainly be a significant accomplishment for NR if a majority of the active citizens became not only competent in basic Latin communication but fluent.
I wish you the very best and remember that following the festival of Parentalia next month, the family should have the traditional dinner on-line together.

Your cousin.
Vale.




Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

AVETE CIVES NOVAE ROMAE

Both candidates proved to be extremely skilled and dedicated to Nova
Roma. Were I one of you I would have a lot of doubts while choosing
who I would elect!
Still, last year I was Quaestor, and I served as a Quaestor assigned
to a Curule Aedile. That is exactly the same position our two
candidates are running for. For that very reason, I think I have an
idea of what this Quaestor could deal with during the forthcoming
months. ;-)
With due respect toward Diana Octavia, I think Lucius Iulius Sulla
would better suit this position.
We already worked toghether in the various fields of the activity
within last year aedilician staff. Your trust would simply allow
Iulius Sulla to carry on with the job he already started in an
excellent way.
I invite all of you to vote for Lucius Iulius Sulla!

OPTIME VALETE
Manivs Constantinvs Serapio

Salve Romans


For those who are interested and can come, We will be holding a dinner in honor of one of our Consuls the Honorable Gn. Equitius Marinus on Friday January 30th 2004 in Frederick, Maryland. Drinks and dinner will start at 7:00 pm at
Venuti's Ristorante
Fine Italian Cuisine
16 East Patrick Street

Frederick, Maryland 21701
Phone: 301-668-2700 Fax: 301-668-0921
e-mail: venutis@...
Hours: Sun - Thursday 11-10 Fri & Sat 11-11


I have made a reservation for 10 if we have more who show an interest I will up the number

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete,

Has anyone else here ever noticed that the History Channel seems rather
biased about Roman subjects? No matter what show they air with any kind of Roman
content, all the talk about Rome seems very disparaging.

Words such as "brutal" "cruel and "unjust" are used as qualifiers in almost
any sentence in which Romans are mentioned. Whenever the very occasional
positive point about Rome is mentioned, it seems to be instantly qualified with
sentences like: "Whenever you think about the good things about Roman
civilization, you must also think of the incredible cruelty of their Games and slavery."

Their voice-over tagline to advertise a recent show about Roman Emperors:
"They turned a Democracy into a Brutal Dictatorship!"

Meanwhile, during "Barbarian week," it seems that even the Huns, Visigoths
and Mongols get better treatment. The word "cruel" does get used for each of
them, but there seemed to be many more positive qualifying words such as "brave,"
"resourceful," "honorable," etc.

Is this all in my head, or has anyone else noticed this? I don't think I've
*ever* seen a completely positive bit about Rome on the History channel where
they didn't go out of their way to vilify Roman civilization.

If I'm not imagining this, perhaps Nova Roma could do something about it...

Valete,

Marcus Cassius Julianus
Senator


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the Nova-Roma
group.

File : /Academic Festivus.jpg
Uploaded by : kaeso_maximius_tiberius <Legion_XXI@...>
Description : Academic festival at U of C

You can access this file at the URL

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/files/Academic%20Festivus.jpg

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit

http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files

Regards,

kaeso_maximius_tiberius <Legion_XXI@...>

Salvete,

I do not get the History Channel from the US but we get the Canadian
History channel owned by Alliance Atlantis which I believe is
partially or more American owned. They don't do enough on the Romans
in my opinion but they usually show programs from A&E and the British
made documentaries from Gladiatrix to a good one on the Teutoburg
Wald archeology. Fortunately, from what I see we tend to get a more
balanced objective view on everything and I cannot remember leaving a
program on Rome to the crusades with any bad taste in my mouth. The
last program I saw, they were only critical of the destruction of the
beautiful mosaic floors in old Roman sites in Turkey that are to or
have been flooded by a hydroelectric project.

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, cassius622@a... wrote:
> Salvete,
>
> Has anyone else here ever noticed that the History Channel seems
rather
> biased about Roman subjects? No matter what show they air with any
kind of Roman
> content, all the talk about Rome seems very disparaging.
>
> Words such as "brutal" "cruel and "unjust" are used as qualifiers
in almost
> any sentence in which Romans are mentioned. Whenever the very
occasional
> positive point about Rome is mentioned, it seems to be instantly
qualified with
> sentences like: "Whenever you think about the good things about
Roman
> civilization, you must also think of the incredible cruelty of
their Games and slavery."
>
> Their voice-over tagline to advertise a recent show about Roman
Emperors:
> "They turned a Democracy into a Brutal Dictatorship!"
>
> Meanwhile, during "Barbarian week," it seems that even the Huns,
Visigoths
> and Mongols get better treatment. The word "cruel" does get used
for each of
> them, but there seemed to be many more positive qualifying words
such as "brave,"
> "resourceful," "honorable," etc.
>
> Is this all in my head, or has anyone else noticed this? I don't
think I've
> *ever* seen a completely positive bit about Rome on the History
channel where
> they didn't go out of their way to vilify Roman civilization.
>
> If I'm not imagining this, perhaps Nova Roma could do something
about it...
>
> Valete,
>
> Marcus Cassius Julianus
> Senator
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus!

While this idea has merit, Cousin Flavi, allow me to suggest that such a programme would be better suited to the Latinitas List.
Just as not all Citizens practice the Religio, it is also true that not all are interested in learning Latin. Therefore the Main List may not be the most appropriate venue for this venture.
This project would be right at home on the Latinitas List, so may I suggest it be started there? Then, if your volunteers stick with it and assemble a good course, perhaps later we could consider "re-running" it on the Main List.
At least on the Latinitas List you would find plenty of willing volunteers to try it out on!

Vale
~ Servius Equitius Mercurius Troianus

-----Original Message-----
From: PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@...
Sent: Jan 22, 2004 10:29 AM
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Nova-Roma] English, Latin, and Universal Latin Instruction

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus Fal S.P.D.

Once again another sign of the Apocalypse has come about with me agreeing with Senator Drusus. English is indeed the 21st century equivalent of Greek as the international language. However, it has recently been discussed privately among several citizens (including myself) that we should take advantage of the classicists among our citizens to encourage a new program published on the mainlist.
Instead of the study of Latin being limited to one of the sodalites or individuals using a wide number of sources, perhaps NR should consider a daily (or thrice-weekly) posts of Latin language instruction on the mainlist. This course could be planned and executed by a group of volunteers using a few classic works from the period of 100 BC-100 AD. Everyday a short section of Latin grammar and reading could be put onto the mainlist to improve the overall Romitas of our citizens; much as the Curule Aedile is doing with the calendar and festivals. Within a year, it would enable most of the citizens and socii who follow the main list & the course of instruction assiduously to communicate with each other directly in the language of Rome.
Since many citizens would be learning or re-learning Latin from a common source, it would result in a sort of on-line dialect of Nova Roma. Furthermore, if the Latin is also spoken aloud as one learns it (yes, I do realize that our own macronational dialects will influence this) it will allow personal communication on those occasions when a citizen of America Austrorientalis meets a citizen from Thule but they do not share either spoken English or Swedish.
I pray to Mercurius that this plan meets with the approval of the people of the Republic. Vale.




Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Nova-Roma-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Great minds think alike...

I was thinking of the traditional Roman plaque, you know the one with
the "clipped in" corners. I know it has a name, just can't think of
it...

TAS

-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Gallagher [mailto:spqr753@...]
Sent: Thursday, 22 January, 2004 10:11
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Nova Roma Ring


Salve


That is exactly what I have asked the company .

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

Bronze would be inexpensive, and historically authentic. Magnesium
bronze polishes to a golden sheen and does not tarnish quickly.

-TAS

G. Iulius Scaurus S. P. D.

Salvete, Quirites.

Here's a link to "Cassiodorus":

http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/jod/texts/cassbook/toc.html

This site provides an electronic text of James O'Donnell's
groundbreaking study of the life and works of Cassiodorus along with
new bibliographical material since the book's original publication in
1979.

Valete.

G. Iulius Scaurus

G. Iulius Scaurus S. P. D.

Salvete, Quirites.

Today is ante diem X Kalendae Februarii; the day is comitialis.

Tomorrow is ante diem IX Kalendae Februarii; the day is comitialis.

Valete.

G. Iulius Scaurus
Aedilis Curulis, Flamen Quirinalis et Pontifex

SALVETE CIVES ROMANI

So, let's start with "Interview the Expert"!

For our first monthly theme, I have the pleasure to present you:
Prof A. Poliseno, philosopher and classicist. He graduated many
years ago in Roma in Philosophy, Classical Literature and Theology;
he has many publications about ancient philosophy and literature,
and some other about modern philosophy; during his life he has been
working for the University of Pisa, untill some years ago, when he
decided to dedicate himself to philosophical and introspective
studies, retiring. I have had the pleasure of meeting him several
times, and I can say he is a really kind and wise person.

Last month's theme was a military one (prof Brizzi about military
tactics from Zama to Marius), and some Italici Cives told me it was
too specific.
For this reason, I with Prof Poliseno decided to select a more
generical argument.

Prof Poliseno this month will answer to our questions about a
philosophycal theme:

"Stoicism in Ancient Rome"

So, go ahead with your questions! What you have to do is write your
questions to me (21aprile@..., iulius@...).

BENE VALETE
L IUL SULLA
Italia
Accensus Consulis

In a message dated 1/22/04 7:09:28 PM Pacific Standard Time,
cassius622@... writes:

> Has anyone else here ever noticed that the History Channel seems rather
> biased about Roman subjects? No matter what show they air with any kind of
> Roman content, all the talk about Rome seems very disparaging.
>
> Their voice-over tagline to advertise a recent show about Roman Emperors:
> "They turned a Democracy into a Brutal Dictatorship!"
>
> Is this all in my head, or has anyone else noticed this? I don't think I've
> *ever* seen a completely positive bit about Rome on the History channel
> where
> they didn't go out of their way to vilify Roman civilization.
>
> If I'm not imagining this, perhaps Nova Roma could do something about it...
>
>

As some who has written for the channel, and worked on their projects, the
Romans are fascinating to the HC people. Because they were superstitious, yet
used the scientific method,
civilized, they depended on law, yet used that same law to enslave thousands.
Learned,
yet enjoyed blood sports. Peaceful, yet were enraged killing machines when
they had to be.

That is the way the history channel's viewers like to look at Romans. And
the channel obliges. By the way the special you described, does tell how the
Principate snuffed out what little democracy the Romans had left. So of course
buzz words were used to attract viewers.

In the Hannibal special I worked on, one line I demanded removed from the
teaser,
"On the other side of the Alps lay the Romans, reviling in every sort of
cruelty, enjoying all matters of vice. Hannibal's freedom loving men, fell on
them like a lion takes a lamb."
As I explained in to the VP of programing in NYC:
" First you are describing the Rome of the late Republic, and not the II
Punic War.
Second, Barca was just as oppressive to the Spanish and Africans that opposed
his family's rule, as the Romans were to those who opposed theirs.
These are two Western European super powers, clashing to see who will
maintain control of Mare Nostrum, not Hannibal setting the Socii free. A free Socii
fit well into Hannibal's plans though it wasn't out any love for the
Italians. He wanted the free Italians to hem Rome in, so they no longer were a
superpower."
So they agreed to change the teaser. I am now waiting to see what they come
up with next.

So Marcus Cassius, they are using rhetoric to sell shows, and the writers are
following the guidelines. If any other way was better to attract viewers,
they would use that. But sensationalism does sell.

Coming next week: Roman blood sports, Entertainment or Crowd Control?

Q. Fabius Maximus


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve Senator Drusus,
what insults?? Nobody here insulted your dear Senator and Consular.

If you want to be disgusted, you have to be disgusted for your
friend Senator and Consular!
Everybody read that he wrote, everybody here read his calumniae
against me. Everybody here read that he accused me to "urinate on my
senatorial toga" and everybody read that he guess that I don't speak
in public or in Senate. Everybody read one reason of the nova
roman "sordid politics" is the offenses of people like your friend
Senator and Consular. Everybody read his injuries against me, a
citizen, a senator and an elected Magistrate. Everybody here read
that he hurted the title of Senator and the same Senatus too. And
everybody now know what kind of man is your friend Senator and
Consular.

Senator Drusus, this is not a political opposition, this is a
personal offense and injury!!!

Delete all the messages but not the message at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/message/19872 because the
citizens mustn't forget the words of your Consular and Senator.

Drusus, try to be disgusted for the most important things, try to be
disgusted for what this kind of man is doing and saying.

Thank you!

Vale
Fr. Apulus Caesar
Senator, Tribunus et Propraetor ... with "a damaged dignity and
reputation" (Lex Salicia Poenalis, par. XIV)



--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Sicinius Drusus" <drusus@b...>
wrote:

> Salvete Omnes,
>
> Thank you for the reminder of why I washed my hands of the sordid
> politics in Nova Roma!
>
> Days worth of Personal Insults attempting to intimidate a Senator

and a

> Consular for daring to state a viewpoit that fails to meet Nova

Roma's

> Politically Correct standards.
>
> Time to go on Index mode so I can delete your disgusting garbage

with

> one mouse click.
>
> L. Sicinius Drusus

Salve,

I agree that the History Channel "advertising tag line" I referred to was
pure sensationalism to hype the upcoming show on Roman emperors. I'm also glad
you were able to get them to remove the outrageous line you mentioned.
"Hannibal's freedom loving men?" Sheesh.

It seems that the real issue isn't sensational advertising lines, but the
rhetoric that the History Channel uses within the shows. There are plenty of
"hype" words that could be used without continually painting the Romans as being
ten times more brutal and cruel than any civilization around them. Its
inaccurate, and probably isn't doing the modern Roman community any good. We have
enough people believing the culture we're based on is oppressive without the
History Channel convincing new folks.

Do you believe the History Channel might reexamine their policies toward
ancient Rome if contacted in a positive way? It would be good to remind them that
there are a lot of people out there who know what's accurate and what isn't...
and who don't watch their channel just so they can make Rome look like really
impressive "bad guys."

Valete,

Marcus Cassius Julianus


Q. Fabius writes:

So Marcus Cassius, they are using rhetoric to sell shows, and the writers are
following the guidelines. If any other way was better to attract viewers,
they would use that. But sensationalism does sell.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete,

For those interested, ever increasing amounts of spam have forced me to change my email address. I can now be reached at iuniussilanus@....

danedwardsuk@... will be kept for the time being to ensure smooth transition :-)

Valete

Decimus Iunius Silanus
Propraetor Britanniae


---------------------------------
Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve Deci,

You have my sympathy. I'll be oing the same thing in the near future.
My server mentioned to me that you get spam from the various websites
you visit that detect your settings. I have another account which I
only use for tranmitting email to oil companies from the field, never
visting websites with it and my spam is zero in 3 years.

The sad thing is that if you continue to visit sites for research etc
you will be back to square one with regards to spam in several months.

Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus




--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Danny Edwards <iuniussilanus@y...>
wrote:

> Salvete,
>
> For those interested, ever increasing amounts of spam have forced

me to change my email address. I can now be reached at
iuniussilanus@y...

>
> danedwardsuk@y... will be kept for the time being to ensure smooth

transition :-)

>
> Valete
>
> Decimus Iunius Silanus
> Propraetor Britanniae
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends

today! Download Messenger Now

>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to S. Equitius Mercurius Troianus. Salve.

I think you have missed the point of my post all together, cousin. This idea on Universal Latin Instruction has less to do with those who are interested in Latin or are already proficient in it than it has to do with encouraging development of better communication and increased Romitas. While I am sure there are many citizens and socii that are lukewarm in their interest in anything outside of one or two aspects of Rome, it is important that those who are passionate about Nova Roma and the culture of Old Rome should study and embrace all aspects that would increase our Romitas.
Think of this idea as being like Civics is to an American high school student (of course, you may not be of an age to remember Civics). The course taught civic obligation, responsibility, privileges, and how the American system worked. You can't really be expected to understand the ins and outs of the American system unless you speak/understand the American-English language. Well, I feel much the same way about Latin as an integral part of being a good Nova Roman. Personally, I think that some of the sodalites isolate certain members from really getting into the overall society of NR by restricting them to only one topic of interest. Be well.

A Fan Letter I recived this morning.

Gee, Wonder why I'm so disgusted with Nova Roma's sleazeball politics?

Drusus

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: You really should wash your hands of it.
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2004 10:39:18 -0500
From: PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@...
To: drusus@...



F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to Senator L. Sicinius Drusus. Salve.

You really should wash your hands of NR politics because you are not very good at it. You continue to inflame people by your one-sided viewpoints combined with a double-standard that you apply to everyone not in your party. You should really understand that part of the reason the Boni lost out in the last election was due to your incendiary speeches about political thuggery, intimidation, conspiracy, and the many insinuations and innuendoes you made about every commentary that didn't agree with your's was politically motivated. The number of votes you received should have demonstrated that most active Nova Romans do not agree with you, Senator, and find you a bucolic, sarcastic individual who they do not want as a magistrate. Sometimes a commentary that criticizes or disagrees with someone is a reaction to an insult, slander, lie, or just a poor attitude and has nothing to do with the politics of an organization.

In this most recent case, Senator Q. Fabius Maximus screwed the pooch by publicly criticizing a new Senator's linguistic abilities. This showed the same bigotry and narrow-mindedness that many Old Romans demonstrated after C. Iulius Caesar opened the Senate to Celts and other non-Italians. The odd thing about all this is that while I believe that QFM screwed up, I still respect him and like him. I feel much the same way about Diana Octavia. In fact, I want you to know that I resigned from the Consular Cohors of CFQ not because of anything that you ever posted to or about me on the mainlist but because I did not want CFQ's bid for Censor to be hurt by our public feuding but also because of some things that were posted by QFM and Diana. However, my original inclination to vote for them as Censor and Consul was destroyed because of their support for you, Senator. I felt that anyone who would support you and agree with your posts showed great loyalty to a friend but incredible poor judgement. I could not support any candidate who placed friendship and political alliance above good sense, good manners, and service to the Republic. You may not remember but I never placed a list of who I was supporting on the main list, except for the individual posts about my cousin, Tiberius Galerius Paulinus, and G. Modius Athanasius. The reason was that it took me a long time to choose between CFQ and QFM for Censor and between the choices for Consul. I want you to realized that Diana Octavia lost my vote almost exclusively based on your public behavior and her support of you. You might want to consider this during any future elections.

I am aware that we like despise each other and that will not change. It is my strong opinion that Nova Roma would be a better place if you would get out of it and never come back. However, I am not foolish enough to believe that you are ever going to leave. You really should consider staying away from elections because unless 75% of the active membership drops over dead or you get a personality transplant, you will never be elected to any magistracy. May the Gods grant you everything that you have coming to you. Vale.

Salve Romans FYI

I am forwarding this e-mail from Mike Carroll who is the designer of the Centurion Ring

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

----- Original Message -----
From: MIKE CARROLL
To: Stephen Gallagher
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 8:54 AM
Subject: Re: membership ring


Tim, I am able to modify the Centurion ring by
deleting the "bowtie' just below the eagle's feet and
inscribing the capital letters SPQR in a, I'm
guessing, times new roman typeface. That would be the
least expensive route.

In order to recreate the SPQR, surrounded by wreath
logo as seen on your website, we would need to carve
an entirely new ring. A more costly direction.

Regarding metals; I can only offer casting in sterling
silver, 10, 14 or 18 karat gold.

Regarding sizing; we are also capable of making
smaller versions of the ring.

If you have any additional questions, don't hesitate
to call or email. Mike

--- Stephen Gallagher <spqr753@...> wrote:
> Dear Mr. Carroll
>
> Please take a look at our web site
> http://www.novaroma.org/main.html you will see our
> flag with the SPQR in the middle of the gold wreath.
> we would like something like this either the SPQR
> near the bottom of the
> ring. Or in the middle of the Laureate put without
> the Eagle Just the Wreath and the SPQR. These would
> be large letters like a signet ring almost.
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Tim Gallagher
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: MIKE CARROLL
> To: Stephen Gallagher
> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 4:42 AM
> Subject: Re: membership ring
>
>
> Dear Mr Gallagher, Thank you for your interest in
> my
> eagle ring collection. In order for me to give an
> accurate answer please define what you mean when
> referring to "the SPQR". Do you mean inscribed
> letters, a logo, or something else? It is possible
> to
> make certain modifications to either of those
> rings
> but I'm not quite sure what you have in mind. Mike
> Carroll
>
> --- Stephen Gallagher <spqr753@...> wrote:
> > Hi
> >
> > I am doing research on a membership ring for a
> group
> > ( about 2000 members) who loves everything
> Roman.
> > I was wondering if your Centurion ring can be
> > modified to include the SPQR near the bottom of
> the
> > ring. If this can not be done, can a ring be
> made
> > similar to your Laureate with the SPQR in the
> middle
> > instead of the Eagle?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks for you time
> >
> >
> > Tim Gallagher
> > spqr753@...
>
>
> =====
> Mike Carroll
> United States Eagle Rings
> http://www.eaglerings.com
> or - http://www.carrollcollection.com
> 16144 Port Clinton Rd.
> Prairie View, IL 60069
> 847-821-1333
> mike@...
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool.
> Try it!
> http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/
>


=====
Mike Carroll
United States Eagle Rings
http://www.eaglerings.com
or - http://www.carrollcollection.com
16144 Port Clinton Rd.
Prairie View, IL 60069
847-821-1333
mike@...

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it!
http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve Quinte Lani,

> My server mentioned to me that you get spam from the various

websites you visit that detect your settings. I have another account
which I only use for tranmitting email to oil companies from the
field, never visting websites with it and my spam is zero in 3 years.
<

Unfortunately, this was an email address that I use exclusively for
Nova Roma business. I have never used it anywhere else. I'm still
getting over 30 spam mails per day - mostly encouraging me to use
Viagra!!!!

Someones been talking ;-)

Vale

Decimus Iunius Silanus

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus S.F.D.

Senator Drusus failed to mention that his sole private response to
my private post was a strongly worded suggestion that my cranium was
up my alimentary canal. I have placed two other private emails to
him but considering this action by the Senator, I expect that the
citizenry will be reading them both very shortly.
I cannot suggest strongly enough that those citizens who consider
this person their friend to help him understand how badly he is
behaving and the damage he is doing to others by association. Vale.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Sicinius Drusus" <drusus@b...>
wrote:

> A Fan Letter I recived this morning.
>
> Gee, Wonder why I'm so disgusted with Nova Roma's sleazeball

politics?

>
> Drusus
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: You really should wash your hands of it.
> Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2004 10:39:18 -0500
> From: PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@a...
> To: drusus@b...
>
>
>
> F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus to Senator L. Sicinius Drusus.

Salve.

>
> You really should wash your hands of NR politics because you are

not very good at it. You continue to inflame people by your one-
sided viewpoints combined with a double-standard that you apply to
everyone not in your party. You should really understand that part
of the reason the Boni lost out in the last election was due to your
incendiary speeches about political thuggery, intimidation,
conspiracy, and the many insinuations and innuendoes you made about
every commentary that didn't agree with your's was politically
motivated. The number of votes you received should have
demonstrated that most active Nova Romans do not agree with you,
Senator, and find you a bucolic, sarcastic individual who they do
not want as a magistrate. Sometimes a commentary that criticizes or
disagrees with someone is a reaction to an insult, slander, lie, or
just a poor attitude and has nothing to do with the politics of an
organization.

>
> In this most recent case, Senator Q. Fabius Maximus screwed the

pooch by publicly criticizing a new Senator's linguistic abilities.
This showed the same bigotry and narrow-mindedness that many Old
Romans demonstrated after C. Iulius Caesar opened the Senate to
Celts and other non-Italians. The odd thing about all this is that
while I believe that QFM screwed up, I still respect him and like
him. I feel much the same way about Diana Octavia. In fact, I want
you to know that I resigned from the Consular Cohors of CFQ not
because of anything that you ever posted to or about me on the
mainlist but because I did not want CFQ's bid for Censor to be hurt
by our public feuding but also because of some things that were
posted by QFM and Diana. However, my original inclination to vote
for them as Censor and Consul was destroyed because of their support
for you, Senator. I felt that anyone who would support you and
agree with your posts showed great loyalty to a friend but
incredible poor judgement. I could not support any candidate who
placed friendship and political alliance above good sense, good
manners, and service to the Republic. You may not remember but I
never placed a list of who I was supporting on the main list, except
for the individual posts about my cousin, Tiberius Galerius
Paulinus, and G. Modius Athanasius. The reason was that it took me
a long time to choose between CFQ and QFM for Censor and between the
choices for Consul. I want you to realized that Diana Octavia lost
my vote almost exclusively based on your public behavior and her
support of you. You might want to consider this during any future
elections.

>
> I am aware that we like despise each other and that will not

change. It is my strong opinion that Nova Roma would be a better
place if you would get out of it and never come back. However, I am
not foolish enough to believe that you are ever going to leave. You
really should consider staying away from elections because unless
75% of the active membership drops over dead or you get a
personality transplant, you will never be elected to any
magistracy. May the Gods grant you everything that you have coming
to you. Vale.

Salvete,

What always gets my goat is how inaccurately equipped Roman Legionaries
always seem to be in these shows. Television and Hollywood seem obsessed
with putting Romans in leather armor and/or cheesy "greek" style
helmets. Where's the Lorica Segmentata or Lorica Hamata? It is
especially galling to see these errors in educational programming. The
only time they seem to avoid this problem is when they use re-enactors
with thier own kit.

Valete,

C. Minucius Hadrianus

Tribunus Franciscus Apulus Caesar Omnibus S.P.D.

The Senate is convened by the Consul Gnaeus Salix Astur.

This session shall last from half past noon in Rome (12:30 CET), a.d.
XV Kal. Februarii (January 20th) until until half past noon in Rome
(12:30 CET), a.d. IX Kal. Februarii (January 24th).

Voting will take place starting at half past noon in Rome (12:30
CET), a.d. IX Kal. Februarii (January 24th) lasting until dusk in
Rome (17:20 CET), a.d. V Kal. Februarii (January 28th).

Following the Roman calendar, all the days of the voting period are
dies comitiales.

The Agenda of the current session is the following:

----------

I. Approval of the Lex Labiena de Iure Civium, presented to the
Comitia
Centuriata a.d. IV Idus Decembris anno MMDCCLVI (December the 8th
2003)
by the consul T. Labienus Fortunatus and approved by the Comitia
Centuriata a.d. VIII Kal. Ianuariis (December the 25th).
This proposal is a Constitutional amendment, and it needs 2/3 of the
votes of the Senate to be approved.

----------

II. Approval of the Lex Labiena de Gentibus, presented to the Comitia
Centuriata a.d. IV Idus Decembris anno MMDCCLVI (December the 8th
2003)
by the consul T. Labienus Fortunatus and approved by the Comitia
Centuriata a.d. VIII Kal. Ianuariis (December the 25th).
This proposal is a Constitutional amendment, and it needs 2/3 of the
votes of the Senate to be approved.

----------

III. Approval of the Lex Fabia Labiena de Iure Augurum, presented to
the Comitia Centuriata a.d. IV Idus Decembris anno MMDCCLVI (December
the 8th 2003) by the consul T. Labienus Fortunatus and approved by
the
Comitia Centuriata a.d. VIII Kal. Ianuariis (December the 25th).
This proposal is a Constitutional amendment, and it needs 2/3 of the
votes of the Senate to be approved.

----------

IV. Approval of the Lex Labiena de Obnuntiatione, presented to the
Comitia Centuriata a.d. IV Idus Decembris anno MMDCCLVI (December the
8th 2003) by the consul T. Labienus Fortunatus and approved by the
Comitia Centuriata a.d. VIII Kal. Ianuariis (December the 25th).
This proposal is a Constitutional amendment, and it needs 2/3 of the
votes of the Senate to be approved.

----------

V. Approval of the Lex Fabia de Civitate Minorum, presented to the
Comitia Centuriata a.d. XII Kal. Decembris anno MMDCCLVI (November
the
20th 2003) by the consul Q. Fabius Quintilianus and approved by the
Comitia Centuriata a.d. III Non. Decembris (December the 3rd).
This proposal is a Constitutional amendment, and it needs 2/3 of the
votes of the Senate to be approved.

----------

VI. Appointment of a new propraetor for the Provincia of America
Austrorientalis.

----------

For further information, please contact the Tribunes Plebis at
tribunes@...

Valete
Fr. Apulus Caesar
Tribunus Plebis

Salve,
You might go try Fastmail.FM(www.fastmail.fm). They have four levels
of membership and offer Anti-Spam and Anti-Virus protection. They also
have outstanding support. They have POP3 mail but, IMAP is their main
feature(they do have webmail also). Check them out.


Gnaeus Cornelius Lentulus

--
AIM: KSDeist

In a message dated 1/23/04 8:25:40 AM Pacific Standard Time,
drusus@... writes:

> In this most recent case, Senator Q. Fabius Maximus screwed the pooch by
> publicly criticizing a new Senator's linguistic abilities. This showed the
> same bigotry and narrow-mindedness that many Old Romans demonstrated after C.
> Iulius Caesar opened the Senate to Celts and other non-Italians. The odd thing
> about all this is that while I believe that QFM screwed up, I still respect
> him and like him. I feel much the same way about Diana Octavia. In fact, I
> want you to know that I resigned from the Consular Cohors of CFQ not because
> of anything that you ever posted to or about me on the mainlist but because I
> did not want CFQ's bid for Censor to be hurt by our public feuding but also
> because of some things that were posted by QFM and Diana. However, my
> original inclination to vote for them as Censor and Consul was destroyed because of
> their support for you, Senator. I felt that anyone who would support you
> and agree with your posts showed great loyalty to a friend but incredible poor
> judgement. I could not support any candidate who placed friendship and
> political alliance above good sense, good manners, and service to the Republic.

I think at this point you should mention you are a former political analysist
and campaign manager. You were also very good at it. You also as a Roman,
treasure
friendship, above all else except when it comes to Laws. Then no one is
above the law.

>
> I am aware that we like despise each other and that will not change. It is
> my strong opinion that Nova Roma would be a better place if you would get out
> of it and never come back. However, I am not foolish enough to believe that
> you are ever going to leave. You really should consider staying away from
> elections because unless 75% of the active membership drops over dead or you
> get a personality transplant, you will never be elected to any magistracy.
> May the Gods grant you everything that you have coming to you. Vale.
>

Surely you don't despise Secundus? He just has his own brand of Romanitas.
I'd call him misinformed.
He is pretty smart otherwise. He's is a Harvard man, and I have had many
interesting conversations with him.

As for CFQ, I continue to play the role of the long suffering Paterfamilias.
My disciplining him was taken in that vein.
Fabius


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

By our aedilician imperium and in accordance with the wishes of Factio
Russata, we appoint Senator and Tribunus Plebis Fr. Apulus Caesar to
be Dominus Factionis Russatae for the consular year of Cn. Salix Astur
and Gn. Equitius Marinus.

Given on ante diem X Kalendae Februarii in the consulship of Cn. Salix
Astur and Gn. Equitius Marinus.

G. Iulius Scaurus
Aedilis Curulis

M. Iulius Perusianus
Aedilis Curulis

F. Galerius Aurelianus to Senator Q. Fabius Maximus. Salve.

While I appreciate some to the very nice things that you have
written about me, Senator, I have to let you know that you may have
me confused with another member of my family or someone else in the
Republic. See below.

-- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, QFabiusMaxmi@a... wrote:

> In a message dated 1/23/04 8:25:40 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> drusus@b... writes:
>
>
> > In this most recent case, Senator Q. Fabius Maximus screwed the

pooch by

> > publicly criticizing a new Senator's linguistic abilities. This

showed the

> > same bigotry and narrow-mindedness that many Old Romans

demonstrated after C.

> > Iulius Caesar opened the Senate to Celts and other non-

Italians. The odd thing

> > about all this is that while I believe that QFM screwed up, I

still respect

> > him and like him. I feel much the same way about Diana

Octavia. In fact, I

> > want you to know that I resigned from the Consular Cohors of CFQ

not because

> > of anything that you ever posted to or about me on the mainlist

but because I

> > did not want CFQ's bid for Censor to be hurt by our public

feuding but also

> > because of some things that were posted by QFM and Diana.

However, my

> > original inclination to vote for them as Censor and Consul was

destroyed because of

> > their support for you, Senator. I felt that anyone who would

support you

> > and agree with your posts showed great loyalty to a friend but

incredible poor

> > judgement. I could not support any candidate who placed

friendship and

> > political alliance above good sense, good manners, and service

to the Republic. [NOTE: I wrote this section. FGAS.]

>
> I think at this point you should mention you are a former

political analysist

> and campaign manager. You were also very good at it. You also as

a Roman,

> treasure
> friendship, above all else except when it comes to Laws. Then no

one is

> above the law. [NOTE: F. Galerius Aurelianus' is a former

substitute history teacher, state guard officer, and park ranger.
Currently, I am a government bureaucrat and own/operate a tobacco
store & online business. I have never been a professional political
analyst or campaign manager. Perhaps Senator L. Sicinius Drusus'
made these accomplishments but if he was a campain manager I hope
that his candidate did better than Senator Drusus did in the last
election. FGAS]

>
> >
> > I am aware that we like despise each other and that will not

change. It is

> > my strong opinion that Nova Roma would be a better place if you

would get out

> > of it and never come back. However, I am not foolish enough to

believe that

> > you are ever going to leave. You really should consider staying

away from

> > elections because unless 75% of the active membership drops over

dead or you

> > get a personality transplant, you will never be elected to any

magistracy.

> > May the Gods grant you everything that you have coming to you.

Vale.

> >
>
> Surely you don't despise Secundus? He just has his own brand of

Romanitas.

> I'd call him misinformed.
> He is pretty smart otherwise. He's is a Harvard man, and I have

had many

> interesting conversations with him. [FGAS is almost positive that

he and Senator Drusus do despise one another. FGAS is a graduate of
Rhodes College in Memphis, TN; perhaps Senator Drusus went to
Harvard? I do not consider myself misinformed but I do take
exception to Senator Drusus referring my posts to the praetor with
the suggestion that I am harassing him electronically when (a) this
is my first off-list post to him; (b) he has never asked that I
should not write him off-list and hasn't done so now; (c) he did not
post his private response to me along with the body of my post; (d)
I have done him no physical injury to himself or his property
although I may consider it at some point in my imagination.]

>
> As for CFQ, I continue to play the role of the long suffering

Paterfamilias.

> My disciplining him was taken in that vein.
> Fabius
>

Ah well, there are the Fabii for you. They are all full of beans.

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus Fal

>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave

Of course, releasing in public a private mail is just the ultimate
breech of netiquette, a behavior that many would consider disgusting and
a sort of political act as well in these days.

So, Quintus Fabius Maximus attack the Italians not being bale to speak a
perfect English (maybe seeing in them the reflection of his own
inability of speaking Italian and wanting to remove them from his sight?
That would be already a better reason, more human than the simple
racism, chauvinism and bigotry that he shows in this as in many other
matters) and his only supporter on the mailing list turns to showing
private mails in an attempt to divert the contempt his protégé has
rightly earned towards someone else, which might even be abstractly a
legitimate move, but by using means that are worth of contempt as well.
Funny.

I'm not exactly sure who is in charge of the mailing list, yet wouldn't
be time to draw an official mailing list policy (I volunteer for writing
it, alone or with others), make it public (and, with yahoo options, have
it sent monthly to the list) and then, once known the law, the offenders
of single persons and whole groups and nations of cives be rightly
expelled?

Vale Bene

Domitius Constantinus Fuscus
Pater Gentis Constantiniae
Aedilis Urbis Ad Interim

-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: L. Sicinius Drusus [mailto:drusus@...]
Inviato: venerdì 23 gennaio 2004 17.06
A: nova-roma@yahoogroups.com
Oggetto: [Nova-Roma] [Fwd: You really should wash your hands of it.]

A Fan Letter I recived this morning.

Gee, Wonder why I'm so disgusted with Nova Roma's sleazeball politics?

Drusus

A. Apollonius Cordus to Consul Cn. Salix Astur,
Tribune Franciscus Apulus Caesar, and all citizens and
peregrines, greetings.

First of all, many thanks to you, Tribune, for posting
the agenda.

Secondly, a question for the presiding consul: I
notice that both the lex Labiena de gentibus and the
lex Fabia de civitate minorum are due to be voted upon
in this session.

Since both laws propose, among other things, to amend
the same section of the constitution, may I ask your
opinion as to what the constitution will end up saying
if both laws are ratified? Will the relevant clause
read as amended by the lex Labiena, or as amended by
the lex Fabia, or both?

My thanks in advance.

________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping"
your friends today! Download Messenger Now
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/download/index.html

Salve Apollonius Cordus,

> First of all, many thanks to you, Tribune, for posting
> the agenda.

Thank you very much, Apollonius, this is only my duty as Tribune :-)

Vale
Fr. Apulus Caesar

Salve Constantinus Fuscus,

> Of course, releasing in public a private mail is just the ultimate
> breech of netiquette, a behavior that many would consider

disgusting and

> a sort of political act as well in these days.

I agree with you, Fuscus. The intentional publication of a received
private message is banned to all the generic rules of the netiquette.
And I think too this is a very bad political act typical of "sordid
politics".

> So, Quintus Fabius Maximus attack the Italians not being bale to

speak a

> perfect English (maybe seeing in them the reflection of his own
> inability of speaking Italian and wanting to remove them from his

sight?

> That would be already a better reason, more human than the simple
> racism, chauvinism and bigotry that he shows in this as in many

other

> matters) and his only supporter on the mailing list turns to

showing

> private mails in an attempt to divert the contempt his protégé has
> rightly earned towards someone else, which might even be

abstractly a

> legitimate move, but by using means that are worth of contempt as

well.

> Funny.

No comment because I think to be a gentleman.

> I'm not exactly sure who is in charge of the mailing list, yet

wouldn't

> be time to draw an official mailing list policy (I volunteer for

writing

> it, alone or with others), make it public (and, with yahoo

options, have

> it sent monthly to the list) and then, once known the law, the

offenders

> of single persons and whole groups and nations of cives be rightly
> expelled?

Rules about the official policies for the Main mailing list exist,
you can see the Edictum Praetorium at
http://novaroma.org/tabularium/edicts/praetor-2003-01-30.html
I suggest you to read the Lex Salicia Poenalis too at
http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/leges/2003-10-08-ii.html from
paragraph XIII. I know that you're an advocat and you could check if
someone here could be judged for one of this crimes.

Vale
Fr. Apulus Caesar

Salvete,

Domitius Constantinus Fuscus wrote:

> I'm not exactly sure who is in charge of the mailing list,

The Praetors are.

> an official mailing list policy

We have one. It is reposted every month. You can read it at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/files/

See the link "List Guidelines, Main List" there.

Valete,

-- Marinus

In a message dated 1/23/04 1:08:17 PM Pacific Standard Time,
domcosfus@... writes:

> So, Quintus Fabius Maximus attack the Italians not being bale to speak a
> perfect English (maybe seeing in them the reflection of his own
> inability of speaking Italian and wanting to remove them from his sight?
>

Except I know many native Italians who speak excellent English. I certainly
would never complain about them.
Gentlemen, what you fail to comprehend here is that NR INC. is an American
company, the board members should be able to speak and understand our language
in common.
And quite enough about private e-mails being made public, Yahoo did it, no
fault of mine, I never intended it to be public. I apologized to the People for
wasting their time and bandwidth. And unless you want to go after Yahoo, I
suggest the matter be put
to rest.

Q. Fabius Maximus




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In a message dated 1/23/04 12:30:52 PM Pacific Standard Time,
Patrick.Owen@... writes:

> FGAS is a graduate of Rhodes College in Memphis, TN;
>
>

Salvete
And you are. I confused you with another Secundus who is from Harvard. Both
are fine institutions, and I have a lot of friends living in Memphis who went
to Rhodes. But I still stand by the fact your excellant erudition and well
reasoned arguments were being equal to the former. Hence the mistake.

Valete
Q. Fabius Maximus


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete omnes,

i HAVE to reply:

Quintus Fabius Maximus wrote:

> Except I know many native Italians who speak excellent English. I

certainly

> would never complain about them.

This is the matter that all the italians have to speak a perfect
english..... Sorry, but i don't understand the connection.....

> Gentlemen, what you fail to comprehend here is that NR INC. is an American
> company, the board members should be able to speak and understand our

language

> in common.

You said " SPEAK AND UNDERSTAND", not "SPEAK A PERFECT ENGLISH": so where
is the problem?
I hope that you understood me, I'm Italian and maybe you can't....

I know that NR is founded in America, and I know that I have to speak in
English: for me there are no problems (also if my English is very poor), and
I think that everybody understand Italians: if they don't, they ask to
explain... WHERE IS THE PROBLEM????

SORRY, BUT I THINK THAT NOVAROMA IS A WORLD STRUCTURE BORN IN USA, FOR
PEOPLE FROM ALL THE WORLD.

Valete omnes

Sempronia Solaria Messalina

Ave

Sometimes, senator, you made me wonder what kind of people form the
senate of Nova Roma, and although I'm sure you are not the standard,
sure you are fueling the image of the higher-ups of the micronation
being terribly chauvinistically US-centric, which is a pity.

But anyway...

"Gentlemen, what you fail to comprehend here is that NR INC. is an
American
company, the board members should be able to speak and understand our
language in common."

Now, the constitution reads " We, the Senate and People of Nova Roma, as
an independent and sovereign nation, herewith set forth this
Constitution as the foundation and structure of our governing
institutions and common society.".... an independent and sovereign
nation. Now, much could be debated on how realistic the statement is,
yet until it stays as such, that is the first, basic rule about all of
us here should abide.

Now, either this is an independent "body" (nation, organization,
structure, as you prefer) and thus by logical consequence not an
"American company" (which I actually would belittle us all, but once
again shows your narrow-mindness), or we aren't, and thus the
constitution means nothing, lacking its very basis.

Now, I believe you more than anyone else, being a senator, should stand
by the constitution and defend it and instead you are a senator who
publically deprives the constitution of its meaning, and the republic of
its very nature, making it a mere American association which allows some
non Americans to join as a gracious act. I do not know what your fellow
senators think, but if we were for real a nation as our constitution
claims, your words would be ground for a high treason trial.


"And quite enough about private e-mails being made public, Yahoo did it,
no
fault of mine, I never intended it to be public."

Actually, no, your friend L. Sicinius Drusus did, not yahoo, but I guess
you do not actually read properly the mails you receive. Even if, Yahoo
by itself couldn't take a mail from your mailbox and forward it over a
mailing list.. at least I hope, because otherwise the thought would be
disturbing :)

"I apologized to the People for wasting their time and bandwidth."

That's the point, you apologize over the mailing list *not* for the load
of insults you have dropped over a number of citizens, not for the
derogatory tone used towards the ones who should instead be praised for
their efforts, not for having planted the seeds of a future, worse,
struggle between the Americans and the non Americans cives (or if you
prefer, between the native English speakers and the ones who are not),
not for the number of questionable or downright atrocious statements you
made, but for having wasting people's time and bandwidth.

Now, while it *could* be discussed (and I will not) if downloading your
posts is a waste of bandwidth and reading them a waste of time, and in
that case you would had rightly apologized towards the more than 600
people of the list you indirectly abused, that still wouldn't exempt you
from the apologizes you should present to the ones you directly
insulted.

For the moderators of thelist, given that Quintus Fabius Maximus has
repeatedly violated the edictum in relation at the points IV, V first
bullet, V fifth bullet, V sixth bullet, acted against point XI, wouldn't
be the case to finally *use* the, already indulgent, provisions reported
at point XII? I'd surely pray the praetors to do so. Over the last 6
weeks, most of the most flamish threads over the mailing list have been
originated by the, at best, sarcastic posts of our senator, who
distinguishes himself as being the greatest enemy of the Concordia
civium and one of the greatest case of tensions in the republic.

I find it hard to accept that in an electoral competition the candidates
to questorship have been acting in a substantially correct way among
each other while an external causes the greatest confusion and the
direst tensions (funnily enough, eventually hurting the position of the
very candidate he supports).


Domitius Constantinus Fuscus
Pater Gentis Constantiniae
Aedilis Urbis Ad Interim

Salve Domiti Constantine;
Maximus is talking about his email to Quintus Lanius. Now I
examined that, it was a reply to Lanius's email, wherein Maximus made
that remark about Senator Fr. Apulus. Now Quintus Lanius's email is
not a yahoo address, and Senator Maximus was replying to a previously
written letter; he either at his email outbox pressed 'reply to
sender' or typed in Quintus Lanius's address, so I do not see how
Yahoo was involved in this. In fact, Senator Maximus would have had
to type in the ML address. So the question of accident from a logic
point of view seems improbable.
vale Fabia Vera,

> "

And quite enough about private e-mails being made public, Yahoo did
it,

> no
> fault of mine, I never intended it to be public."
>
>

Salvete Quirites,

Domitius Constantinus Fuscus wrote:

[quite a lot, but I wish only to address this that he wrote, addressing
Quintus Fabius Maximus]

> Sometimes, senator, you made me wonder what kind of people form the
> senate of Nova Roma, and although I'm sure you are not the standard,
> sure you are fueling the image of the higher-ups of the micronation
> being terribly chauvinistically US-centric, which is a pity.

In fact, nothing could be further from the truth, Domiti Constantine.
Our Senate includes Europeans, South Americans, and Canadians. Of our
current elected magistrates, one of the two Censors is a Swede, one of
the two Consuls is a Spaniard, one Praetor is Austrian while the other
is Brazilian, one Curule Aedile is Italian while the other is an
Oxford-educated gentleman now living in the US. I could continue through
the Tribunes and the Plebian Aediles and the Quaestors, but I hope you
take my point. Only 13 of our 24 Senators are residents of the United
States. Our Senate represents the international nature of Nova Roma's
population, as does our elected government.

Senator Fabius Maximus has some very firm ideas about what Nova Roma
ought to be. Some, though by no means a majority, of the Senate
agree with him. Many others do not.

Valete,

--
Gnaeus Equitius Marinus

> Of course, releasing in public a private mail is just the ultimate
> breech of netiquette, a behavior that many would consider disgusting and
> a sort of political act as well in these days.

Absolutely true. Today, L. Sicinius Drusus has crossed the line and
grossly exceeded the bounds of acceptable behavior.

Praetores, I request that he be placed on moderated status on all Nova Roma
mailing lists.


--
Marcus Octavius Germanicus.
http://www.graveyards.com/
Anything worth doing is worth doing to excess;
moderation is for monks. - Heinlein

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 QFabiusMaxmi@... wrote:

> And quite enough about private e-mails being made public, Yahoo did it, no
> fault of mine, I never intended it to be public.

Really.

Forgive my ignorance, but I'm just a simple country sysadmin. There are
some intricacies of mail routing and header analysis that I'm not familiar
with - after all, I've only been managing mail servers for about eight years,
and that certainly isn't time enough to learn everything there is to know
about them.

For instance, it is certainly possible that there are invisible imps lurking
in various servers that intercept mail and send it somewhere else in order to
cause maximum embarassment! Stranger things exist!

I suppose it must be the imps that caused this to happen then:

Received: from n31.grp.scd.yahoo.com (n31.grp.scd.yahoo.com [66.218.66.99])
by nyarlathotep.cynico.net (8.12.10/8.12.2) with SMTP id i0LMuiHk046090
for <hucke@...>; Wed, 21 Jan 2004 16:56:44 -0600 (CST)

...The end of its trip was Yahoo, just like any other list message; but what
of the beginning? Skipping down a bit:

Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36)
by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2004 21:53:27 -0000
Received: from Qfabiusmaxmi@...
by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r4.12.) id r.1eb.17b0e239 (3940)
for <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>; Wed, 21 Jan 2004 16:53:15 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <1eb.17b0e239.2d404ecb@...>

We see here that it came from AOL's mail server, not Yahoo's. This message did
not originate on Yahoo's server - indeed, it should not have passed through Yahoo's
server at all - it should have gone directly from imo-d04.mx.aol.com to the MX
host of datanet.ab.ca.

X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10708
X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 205.188.157.36

As we see here, it didn't come from Yahoo's web-to-mail gateway; I've examined
plenty of those messages, and they look very different.

No, you simply chose "Reply" instead of "Forward" or "Reply to Sender" or
somesuch. An accident, yes; the fault of Yahoo, no. Unless it was the imps.

Vale, Octavius.

--
Marcus Octavius Germanicus.
http://www.graveyards.com/
Anything worth doing is worth doing to excess;
moderation is for monks. - Heinlein

Salve, A. Apolloni.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "A. Apollonius Cordus"
<a_apollonius_cordus@y...> wrote:

> A. Apollonius Cordus to Consul Cn. Salix Astur,
> Tribune Franciscus Apulus Caesar, and all citizens and
> peregrines, greetings.
>
> First of all, many thanks to you, Tribune, for posting
> the agenda.
>
> Secondly, a question for the presiding consul: I
> notice that both the lex Labiena de gentibus and the
> lex Fabia de civitate minorum are due to be voted upon
> in this session.
>
> Since both laws propose, among other things, to amend
> the same section of the constitution, may I ask your
> opinion as to what the constitution will end up saying
> if both laws are ratified? Will the relevant clause
> read as amended by the lex Labiena, or as amended by
> the lex Fabia, or both?
>
> My thanks in advance.

A good question, A. Apolloni :-).
Given that the lex Labiena was approved by the Comitia *after* the
Lex Fabia, I think that it should have precedence over it. However,
both must be presented to the Senate, since both have been approved
by the Comitia.

S.V.B.E.E.V.
CN.SALIX.T.F.A.NEP.OVF.ASTVR

Salvete Quirites.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Domitius Constantinus Fuscus"
<domcosfus@f...> wrote:

> Sometimes, senator, you made me wonder what kind of people form the
> senate of Nova Roma, and although I'm sure you are not the standard,
> sure you are fueling the image of the higher-ups of the micronation
> being terribly chauvinistically US-centric, which is a pity.

I would like to make a couple of ideas clear:

(a) The statements of senator Q. Fabius Maximus do not necessarily
reflect the feelings or thoughts of the Senate of Nova Roma, of the
Republic of Nova Roma, or of any of her citizens, safe senator Q.
Fabius Maximus himself. He does *not* speak in the name of the Senate
or of the Republic.

(b) Some of the members of the Senate of Nova Roma are not citizens
of the United States of America.

(c) If you want any action brought against senator Q. Fabius Maximus
for his last statements, you should present a petitio actionis to the
praetores, as defined by the Lex Salicia Iudiciaria and the Lex
Salicia Poenalis:
http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/leges/2002-11-24-iii.html
http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/leges/2003-10-08-ii.html

Thank you for your attention.
S.V.B.E.E.V.
CN.SALIX.T.F.A.NEP.OVF.ASTVR

Salve Domitius Constantinus Fuscus

> I find it hard to accept that in an electoral competition the

candidates

> to questorship have been acting in a substantially correct way

among

> each other while an external causes the greatest confusion and the
> direst tensions (funnily enough, eventually hurting the position

of the

> very candidate he supports).

Given that, as you quite rightly say, neither candidate for quaestor
has involved themselves to any detriment in the current debate, it
is unnecessary for you to create that link here. Further, I consider
it totally inappropriate for you to attempt to tie this issue
directly to a candidate you clearly do not support, even by
insinuation.

Leave the race for quaestor out of this. It has no place here.

Vale

Decimus Iunius Silanus

F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus S.P.D.

With respect to the gentle citizens that have stepped up on the matter of
Senator Drusus posting my private email to him on the mainlist, it should be
realized that there is no official policy in Nova Roma that prevents him from this
course of action. In truth, the record of his communications on the mainlist
speak for themselves in regard to his long history of errors in good taste,
grammar, spelling, sentence structure, good sense, discretion, and apparent
mental stability. In fairness to the Senator, I have also slipped up in the
areas of good taste and judgment occasionally on the ML by letting his bellicose,
brutish, bucolic, and banal behavior drive me into a battle of wits with
someone who I am now convinced may not be in full possession of his faculties.
Despite assurances from a respected member of the Senate that Senator Drusus has
been a political analyst and campaign manager in the past and is an
intelligent individual, it is obvious to anyone that has followed his paranoid,
hostile, and conspiratorial-minded posts over the last several months that there may
be something not-quite right with him. I have had e-conversations with
several past and present magistrates concerning some course of action into
restraining some of his outbursts but there is nothing in the current leges that would
allow the Senate to restrain one of their members who may be losing their
ability to discriminate between reality versus possible delusions, as long as that
person stays within the bounds of the rules regarding the ML and the leges
governing behavior.
I hope that those of you who are aware of the growing problem will give this
person all the leeway that can be mustered and be as tolerant as you can
regardless of some of his posts. Sometimes you just cannot help, work with, or
engage in logical dialog with an individual whose grip on even a
social-educational organization's reality is tenuous at best. I intend to just let any
further public posts from this individual to me just slide by as I would the wind in
the trees. However, I will publicly request that he not engage in any
private electronic communication with me in the future unless it is related to my
position as a rogator. Even in that case, I would prefer if he runs it through
the Senior Rogator or the Praetors so that there will not be any
misunderstandings. I would also like to apologize to him for my earlier private posts
since I did not realize (at the time) that he may not be fully cognizant of his
current situation and the manner in which he presents himself both on the ML and
in private communications. I pray that Salus and Apollo grant him all that
is necessary for both his physical and psychological good health in the
future. Valete.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve Praetori,

While I am still new to NR and also just a just plebian I totally
agree with what M. Octavius Germanicus has proposed concerning L.
Sicinius Drusus. I was quite disturbed by what I saw while reading
the messages for the day when I saw he had postd a private email and
that is not because F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus is my cousin in
NR but because it is a breach of trust and courtesy. I propose L.
Sicinius Drusus be put on moderated status to think about what he
has done. Drusus you have disappointed me.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Marcus Octavius Germanicus
<hucke@c...> wrote:

>
>
> > Of course, releasing in public a private mail is just the

ultimate

> > breech of netiquette, a behavior that many would consider

disgusting and

> > a sort of political act as well in these days.
>
> Absolutely true. Today, L. Sicinius Drusus has crossed the line

and

> grossly exceeded the bounds of acceptable behavior.
>
> Praetores, I request that he be placed on moderated status on all

Nova Roma

> mailing lists.

>
> I would like to make a couple of ideas clear:
>
> (a) The statements of senator Q. Fabius Maximus do not necessarily
> reflect the feelings or thoughts of the Senate of Nova Roma, of the
> Republic of Nova Roma, or of any of her citizens, safe senator Q.
> Fabius Maximus himself. He does *not* speak in the name of the

Senate

> or of the Republic.
>
> (b) Some of the members of the Senate of Nova Roma are not citizens
> of the United States of America.
>
> (c) If you want any action brought against senator Q. Fabius

Maximus

> for his last statements, you should present a petitio actionis to

the

> praetores, as defined by the Lex Salicia Iudiciaria and the Lex
> Salicia Poenalis:
> http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/leges/2002-11-24-iii.html

Salvete omnes,

Our Consul has put the cards on the table here. I think if we look at
the arguments over the last several days we can see that most of the
citizens in Nova Roma, in all offices and all services overwhelmingly
are not in agreement with the arguments of Senator Q. Fabi Maximi.

Nova Roma and the Roman culture came from a country we now call
Italy, or at least that is what I learned in geography. Therefore in
my opinion we should always highly respect that fact and give respect
and courtesy to the language, culture and people there from ancient
times and to this day. This courtesy should also be extended to all
the former countries of the empire, especially from America since the
Romans new nothing of its existence (so far as we know). I do not
hear the Italians complaining that what the hell is Rome got to do
with America and why don't we speak at least Latin or Italian which
is closer to the language of ancient Rome than ours. Now I know NR
was founded and started in New England but there have been other
groups and reenactors who have been active in Europe for quite some
time as well. I gave two posts about languages so before so I will
not repeat myself. If something on a high government level has to be
put in high English, there are enough people here who can lend a
little time proof reading.


As for point C, I do not think this should be used except under dire
circumstances. I think in situations such as being a net predator,
sexual harrasment, stealing, physical threats to life and limb or
blantently breaking an oath, then by all means. For personal attacks
at elections, insults, arguments and like the situation we are
discussing then I say think hard...and very hard about it. There is
always room for apologies and making up later. I will bet my denari
that more often than not, the person who is going to face prosecution
will just say #### it, chow, resign and unsubscribe from the list
before we even get to first base with the trial. In the end,the legal
commitee has wasted its time, the plaintiff gets no satisfaction and
NR has lost a citizen and his or her great talents.


Regards,

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

>

http://www.novaroma.org/tabularium/leges/2003-10-08-ii.html

>
> Thank you for your attention.
> S.V.B.E.E.V.
> CN.SALIX.T.F.A.NEP.OVF.ASTVR

Salve Domitius Constantinus Fuscus,

<I find it hard to accept that in an electoral competition the candidates
<to questorship have been acting in a substantially correct way among
<each other while an external causes the greatest confusion and the
<direst tensions (funnily enough, eventually hurting the position of the
<very candidate he supports).

Why does this have anything even slightly to do with me? I did not agree with Q Fabius Maximus
comments on the Italian's English at all and even stated so publicly. In my opinion the urinate
comment was simply a stupid thing to say whether it was posted here by accident or not.

Salve F. Galerius Aurelianus Secundus,

<I cannot suggest strongly enough that those citizens who consider
<this person their friend to help him understand how badly he is
<behaving and the damage he is doing to others by association.

Association? Again, same question: Why does what Drusus or Q Fabius say have anything even
slightly to do with me? (I'm assumin but could be wrong that the reference also included me
running for Quaestor). There is just way way too much of drawing lines on the floor between
'sides' in Nova Roma.

Has anyone considerd for one moment that just *maybe* I base my political opinions on what *I*
think and not on who proposes what?

Salve Silanus,

<Leave the race for quaestor out of this. It has no place here.

Ah, fine words of wisdom from our newest Senator! Thank you Silanus!

Valete,
Diana Octavia Aventina

Salvete Quirites,

My internet service provider is having problems. I was unable
to connect to the net from early yesterday evening until this
morning, and it's possible my service will be interrupted
again during the weekend.

I will read all Nova Roma posts once I see them. It just may
take some time.

Valete,

Gn. Equitius Marinus

G. Iulius Scaurus P. Fabiae Verae Atticae salutem dicit.

Salve, P. Fabia Vera.

> Maximus is talking about his email to Quintus Lanius. Now I
>examined that, it was a reply to Lanius's email, wherein Maximus made
>that remark about Senator Fr. Apulus. Now Quintus Lanius's email is
>not a yahoo address, and Senator Maximus was replying to a previously
>written letter; he either at his email outbox pressed 'reply to
>sender' or typed in Quintus Lanius's address, so I do not see how
>Yahoo was involved in this. In fact, Senator Maximus would have had
>to type in the ML address. So the question of accident from a logic
>point of view seems improbable.
>

As a matter of fact, I know how the transmission error occurred because
I've done it myself. If you are in the browser reading the list and
click on the sender's name, it goes as a private email to the sender.
If you click on the subject header, it goes to the list. Perhaps Q.
Fabius accidentally clicked on the header when he meant to click on the
sender's name.

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

>
>

Diana Octavia Aventina wrote:

> Association? Again, same question: Why does what Drusus or Q Fabius
> say have anything even slightly to do with me?

Nothing, of course. You did not endorse or condone anything they
have said. That mud just won't stick.

> There is just way way too much of drawing lines on the floor between
> 'sides' in Nova Roma. Has anyone considerd for one moment that just
> *maybe* I base my political opinions on what *I* think and not on
> who proposes what?

While there are "sides" here, it's clear from Diana's recent name change
that she is certainly no follower of LSD/QFM - and should not be held
accountable for their acts.

Citizens, I urge you to vote for Diana Octavia for Quaestor. As a Tribune,
her performance was exceptional, and we can expect similar outstanding
work in any magistracy she holds. Do not be distracted by the sideshow;
vote for the candidates based upon their proven skills, which Diana has
in abundance.

Valete, Octavius.

--
Marcus Octavius Germanicus.
http://www.graveyards.com/
Anything worth doing is worth doing to excess;
moderation is for monks. - Heinlein

G. Iulius Scaurus Gn. Equitio Marino salutem dicit.

Salve, Gn. Equiti amice.

>In fact, nothing could be further from the truth, Domiti Constantine.
>
>Our Senate includes Europeans, South Americans, and Canadians. Of our
>current elected magistrates, one of the two Censors is a Swede, one of
>the two Consuls is a Spaniard, one Praetor is Austrian while the other
>is Brazilian, one Curule Aedile is Italian while the other is an
>Oxford-educated gentleman now living in the US.
>

Actually, research fellow of Trinity, Cambridge, not that other place...
A matter of little importance to your point, but some matters of
principle must be firmly asserted :-).

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

G. Iulius Scaurus F. Galerio Aureliano Secundo salutem dicit.

Salve, F. Galeri Aureliane.

>Once again another sign of the Apocalypse has come about with me agreeing with Senator Drusus. English is indeed the 21st century equivalent of Greek as the international language. However, it has recently been discussed privately among several citizens (including myself) that we should take advantage of the classicists among our citizens to encourage a new program published on the mainlist.
>Instead of the study of Latin being limited to one of the sodalites or individuals using a wide number of sources, perhaps NR should consider a daily (or thrice-weekly) posts of Latin language instruction on the mainlist. This course could be planned and executed by a group of volunteers using a few classic works from the period of 100 BC-100 AD. Everyday a short section of Latin grammar and reading could be put onto the mainlist to improve the overall Romitas of our citizens; much as the Curule Aedile is doing with the calendar and festivals. Within a year, it would enable most of the citizens and socii who follow the main list & the course of instruction assiduously to communicate with each other directly in the language of Rome.
>Since many citizens would be learning or re-learning Latin from a common source, it would result in a sort of on-line dialect of Nova Roma. Furthermore, if the Latin is also spoken aloud as one learns it (yes, I do realize that our own macronational dialects will influence this) it will allow personal communication on those occasions when a citizen of America Austrorientalis meets a citizen from Thule but they do not share either spoken English or Swedish.
>I pray to Mercurius that this plan meets with the approval of the people of the Republic. Vale.
>

While I, too, agree with L. Sicinius' proposal to teach ESL in the
Academia Thules, I think your notion for the dissemination of Latin
literary skills in NR is extremely optimistic. It takes roughly three
years of university-level instruction for those with no significant
secondary preparation in Latin to master grammar, syntax and vocabulary
well enough to read Latin literature with some ease and another year or
two of work to gain reasonable composition skills. That's three hours a
week of classroom instruction (plus another 8-12 hours of homework and
outside reading per week) for six semesters to gain a reasonable reading
knowledge of the language and another two-four semesters for composition
skills. As head of the Latin programme in the Academia Thules, I am
designing precisely such a curriculum which will commence at the
introductory level in mid-February (Dis volentibus). It's going to be
at least four years before we have our first crop of students who read
Latin as well as an average undergraduate Latin major.

Vale.

G. Iulius Scaurus

A. Apollonius Cordus to Consul Cn. Salix Astur and all
citizens and peregrines, greetings.

Thank you for your prompt reply.

> Given that the lex Labiena was approved by the
> Comitia *after* the
> Lex Fabia, I think that it should have precedence
> over it. However,
> both must be presented to the Senate, since both
> have been approved
> by the Comitia.

I'm inclined to agree that that's the proper course of
action.

The result, then, would be that part of the lex Fabia
would be undone; I wonder whether either you or your
colleague are considering re-introducing the relevant
parts of that law if necessary?

I should stress, incidentally, that I don't want to
imply that you were wrong to place both these items on
the same agenda: the mistake had already been made
before this year began, and you've acted entirely properly.

________________________________________________________________________
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G. Iulius Scaurus wrote:

> While I, too, agree with L. Sicinius' proposal to teach ESL in the
> Academia Thules, I think your notion for the dissemination of Latin
> literary skills in NR is extremely optimistic. It takes roughly three
> years of university-level instruction for those with no significant
> secondary preparation in Latin to master grammar, syntax and vocabulary
> well enough to read Latin literature with some ease and another year or
> two of work to gain reasonable composition skills. That's three hours a
> week of classroom instruction (plus another 8-12 hours of homework and
> outside reading per week) for six semesters to gain a reasonable reading
> knowledge of the language and another two-four semesters for
> composition skills. As head of the Latin programme in the Academia
> Thules, I am designing precisely such a curriculum which will commence
> at the
> introductory level in mid-February (Dis volentibus). It's going to be
> at least four years before we have our first crop of students who read
> Latin as well as an average undergraduate Latin major.

And I thought, since he has recently told us he wasn't at Oxford, that I
might shed a little light on the Oxford approach to such matters.
Students who come to Oxford with no prior knowledge of Latin are required
to attend a two-week summer school before the beginning of their
studentship when they will do 2 or 3 hour-long classes per day for two
weeks, as well as some supplementary study of Roman culture and history.

In the first term, Monday to Friday, there will be daily hour-long Latin
classes (which start from the beginning again just for the benefit of
anyone who missed the summer schools), and by the end of this term (eight
weeks) it is expected that they are at A-level standard in their reading.

They then begin composition classes, and further (original text based)
reading classes, in the following term.

Within three terms (one year) it is expected that the student can read and
compose Latin fluently, and there is a similar programme for Greek (though
it is not possible to take the two simultaneously).

I'm not suggesting that the Academy course you're preparing should be
formed along these lines, or even that the Oxford course always acheives
its desired effects, but thought it might be interesting to have an
alternative perspective.

Livia

A. Apollonius Cordus to all citizens and peregrines,
greetings.

I'd like to join the growing ranks of those who are
asking everyone to drop this unfortunate discussion.
I'll try briefly to explain why I think no one can
profit from its continuance.

Senator Maximus himself has nothing to gain from
continuing the debate: he is not making any friends as
far as I can see; he has made his point, such as it
is; and he risks being forced into a position of
defending himself against charges of deceit and
conspiracy, which is never a good position to occupy
regardless of whether one is innocent or not. Finally
he is causing acute embarrassment to at least two of
his gentiles that I know of and ought now to show some
sensitivity to their concern for the good reputation
of the Fabii.

Senator Drusus, too, will gain nothing from further
argument: his support for Senator Maximus' point about
language is already well known, and he will hardly
want to be dragged into pointless slanging matches
with other citizens, since this is precisely the sort
of thing he declared he wanted to avoid when he
announced his withdrawal from political life.

Iulius Sulla and Tribune Caesar have no reason to
continue the argument, for it is abundantly clear that
they have a good deal of public sympathy already and
are unlikely to win any more by further argument; in
fact they seem to have come to this conclusion
themselves and already withdrawn from the fray with
their dignity intact. Further, I would suggest that
they have little to gain from legal action: however
distasteful some of Senator Maximus' remarks may be,
they do not as far as I can see constitute slander as
defined in the lex Salica. Indeed that Senator has
already made himself look abundantly foolish, at least
in my opinion, and any legal action against him will
only make his remarks seem more worthy of serious
consideration than they are.

And since none of the parties directly involved have
any reason to pursue this further, I do not see that
the rest of us have any good reason to do it on their
behalf. Indeed the more it continues the greater the
risk becomes that irrelevant political or personal
differences will be dragged in - this has only been
avoided in the case of the present elections by prompt
action from Senator Silanus and Octavia Aventina.
Best, I think, to let it all drop now.

________________________________________________________________________
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Gnaeus Salix Astur wrote:

> (a) The statements of senator Q. Fabius Maximus do not necessarily
> reflect the feelings or thoughts of the Senate of Nova Roma, of the
> Republic of Nova Roma, or of any of her citizens, safe senator Q.
> Fabius Maximus himself. He does *not* speak in the name of the Senate
> or of the Republic.

And I would like to re-iterate what C. Fabius Quintilianus said the other
day - he does not speak in the name of all the Fabii either.

Livia

Ave,

I Have been deleting any messages from this group unread for the present
time, however someone informed me that a defamatory post directed at me
was posted in this forum.

Message 19966 has been reported to Yahoo! groups as a violation of the
Terms of Service posted at http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

You agree to not use the Service to:

upload, post, email, transmit or otherwise make available any Content
that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, tortious,
defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, invasive of another's privacy,
hateful, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable;

LSD

G. Iulius Scaurus S. P. D.

Salvete, Quirites.

Here's a link to "Textkit: Greek and Latin Learning Tools":

http://www.textkit.com/

Given our discussion of Latin instruction on the ML, I thought that
this link with its many useful downloads of valuable instructional
materials might be of interest.

Valete.

G. Iulius Scaurus

Si valete, valeo.

In this War of Words, I have seen much that demonstrates just
exactly the cost in the virtual battlefield, namely:

The waste of bandwidth to further petty squabbles.

Insults flying like bombshells, without regard for innocents.

The weakening of the political infrastructure of the country.

The disillusionment of the citizenry.

In the aftermath of this conflict, the results can clearly be seen.
After all, hindsight IS 20/20, and was it not Epimetheus who was
given Pandora?

In the wake of this desolation of the Roman spirit, let us now
rebuild; put aside the sword; and become farmers again.

Modem tenere debemus.

Valete!
Q. Valerius Callidus

G. Iulius Scaurus S. P. D.

Salvete, Quirites.

Today is ante diem IX Kalendae Februarii; the day is comitialis.

Tomorrow is ante diem VIII Kalendae Februarii; the day is comitialis.

Valete.

G. Iulius Scaurus
Aedilis Curulis, Flamen Quirinalis et Pontifex

SALVETE CIVES ROMANI

I'm happy to say that we now have a page in our site dedicated to
the project "Interview the Expert".
This page has been created by Honorable Tribunus Fr. Apulus Caesar:
thank you.

There you can find out all the Experts of previous months, with
their themes, questions and answers.

The link is:
www.novaroma.org/expert

Our monthly theme is: Stoicism in Ancient Rome, prof. A. Poliseno.
Questions at this email addresses: 21aprile@... or
iulius@....

OPTIME VALETE
L IUL SULLA
Italia

Salve Apollonius Cordus,

your words are quite correct, first of all about the sad situation
of Senatores Maximus and Drusus.
But please, let me comment a couple of things about me.

> Iulius Sulla and Tribune Caesar have no reason to
> continue the argument, for it is abundantly clear that
> they have a good deal of public sympathy already and
> are unlikely to win any more by further argument;

I agree but I must to correct something. I sent 4-5 messages about
the insults of Maximus. However in the last 24 hours I was absent
from the bagarre bacause I'm meditating about what I could to do for
having the Dignitas repaired.
In any way it's clear to everybody that we have two men which don't
respect Rome, this organization, the Res Publica, the citizens and
the Senatores. And someone claimed the moderation and other
punishments for Maximus and Drusus. Someone wrote what I wanted to
claim.

> in
> fact they seem to have come to this conclusion
> themselves and already withdrawn from the fray with
> their dignity intact.

Sorry, but my Dignitas is not intact. The CALUMNIA of Senator
Maximus hurted my dignitas and my honor.

> Further, I would suggest that
> they have little to gain from legal action: however
> distasteful some of Senator Maximus' remarks may be,
> they do not as far as I can see constitute slander as
> defined in the lex Salica. Indeed that Senator has
> already made himself look abundantly foolish, at least
> in my opinion, and any legal action against him will
> only make his remarks seem more worthy of serious
> consideration than they are.

I'm not sure of this. Yes a legal action is a risk and first of all
a political risk. But maybe we should start to use the Lex Salicia
to find solutions. We write laws because we want avoid some sad
events like this and because the citizens must to respect them.
Yes, I agree, a legal action against Maximus will give him more
consideration than they deserve. But can this kind of people
continue to hurt our Res Publica?
What I want is easy: public apologies and moderation for this
foolish men. I can't accept to be insulted and injuried again in the
future.
I don't know what is the best solution, maybe a legal action
following the Lex Salicia, or maybe the rules of moderation of this
list, or maybe a senatorial nota against him, or maybe volunteer
acts by Maximus and Drusus ...

Vale
Fr. Apulus Caesar

A. Apollonius Cordus to Senator L. Sicinius Drusus and
all citizens and peregrines, greetings.

> Message 19966 has been reported to Yahoo! groups as
> a violation of the
> Terms of Service posted at
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

I am not even going to bother to check which message
you are referring to. Frankly, sir, I am both furious
and astounded that you should have chosen to bypass
the comprehensive procedures of dispute-resolution
which scores of citizens have worked hard to establish
- particularly the leges poenalis and iudiciaria and
the very existence of the praetors themselves.

Those institutions are there so that members of our
community can resolve their problems using mechanisms
which are of and for this community. As far as I am
concerned, agreement to at least try to resolve our
differences within those procedures before going
outside, whether to Yahoo or to macronational legal
authorities, is an implicit part of the agreement to
be a citizen and obey the laws of Nova Roma. I have
often said in the past, in public and in private, as
an assistant to magistrates and as a private citizen,
that anyone who deliberately bypasses our internal
disciplinary procedures ought without hesitation to be
deprived of his citizenship. I repeat that belief now,
and with specific reference to this case.

Forgive me if my memory is faulty, Senator, but are
you not the Senator who has virtually made a political
career in Nova Roma out of warning us not to risk
destroying our community by involving, or inviting the
involvement, of outside bodies, especially
macronational ones? Have you not often warned that to
risk the intervention to such bodies in our business
is to invite macronational prosecution, financial
liability, even collapse? And is it not you who has
clearly, publicly and more than once stated that you
would never even think of asking for disciplinary
action to be taken against another citizen even within
Nova Roma's own judicial system?

Surely this must be someone else, for if it were you
then the action you say you have just taken would be
not only reprehensible but hypocritical in the
extreme.

I look forward to hearing that you have written to
Yahoo to retract your complaint and that you have
decided instead to pursue the matter through Nova
Roma's own disciplinary structures.

________________________________________________________________________
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A. Apollonius Cordus wrote:

> I am not even going to bother to check which message
> you are referring to. Frankly, sir, I am both furious
> and astounded that you should have chosen to bypass
> the comprehensive procedures of dispute-resolution
> which scores of citizens have worked hard to establish
> - particularly the leges poenalis and iudiciaria and
> the very existence of the praetors themselves.

Indeed. L. Sicinius Drusus now shows nothing but contempt for Nova Roma,
its citizens, its institutions; and has grossly violated the long-established
standards of behaviour of internet mailing lists with his posting of anothers'
private message.

He has flouted public morality and honor.

Citizens, rest assured that the rest of the Senate does not condone such
abusive activities. The senior magistrates are presently considering
a course of action.

Valete, Octavius.

--
Marcus Octavius Germanicus.
Censor, Consular, Citizen.

A. Apollonius Cordus to Tribune Franciscus Apulus
Caesar and all citizens and peregrines, greetings.

I shall reply to you privately about most of what you
say, but let me just say publicly that I think your
dignitas is entirely intact in the opinions of all
those citizens whose opinions I consider worth
worrying about. Although I would certainly not
criticise you for taking legal action in this case, I
do not think it is necessary in order to restore your
reputation, which as I say is undamaged.

________________________________________________________________________
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Salve Senator Drusus,
what strange message ...
Drusus, I suggest you to withdraw your statement because firstly
you're reus of a bad message not respecting the general rules of the
netequitte, the Edictum Praetorium de Moderatione and the Dignitas
of a honourable citizen of Nova Roma.
You're not in the position permitting you to claim violations of
rules.
If you deleted the messages in your e-mail browser, even you can
vist http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/ and read the past
posts.

Vale
Fr. Apulus Caesar

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Sicinius Drusus" <drusus@b...>
wrote:

> Ave,
>
> I Have been deleting any messages from this group unread for the

present

> time, however someone informed me that a defamatory post directed

at me

> was posted in this forum.
>
> Message 19966 has been reported to Yahoo! groups as a violation of

the

> Terms of Service posted at http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
> You agree to not use the Service to:
>
> upload, post, email, transmit or otherwise make available any

Content

> that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing,

tortious,

> defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, invasive of another's

privacy,

> hateful, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable;
>
> LSD

Salve G. Iuli Scaure,

Duh, what about all those courses that advertise mastering a language
in 6 weeks o 3 months? (LOL)

Well we are certainly looking forward to your course. Sounds great!

Regards

Quintus Lanius Paulinus

> As head of the Latin programme in the Academia Thules, I am
> designing precisely such a curriculum which will commence at the
> introductory level in mid-February (Dis volentibus). It's going to

be

> at least four years before we have our first crop of students who

read

> Latin as well as an average undergraduate Latin major.
>
> Vale.
>
> G. Iulius Scaurus

This list has become a sink of slander directed at any who dare to state
a politically incorrect viewpoint. A Place where the Formosian tactic of
calling those who disagree with you "Racist" or "Mentally Deranged" is
accepted if it's posted by a politically correct person. A Place where
Slanderers are praised and their victims are damned. A Place where
sending someone poison pen letters and threats is "good behaviour" while
exposing this good behaviour is evil personified.

This Rank Postering is as depraved as the slurs. The Few posts that I
have bothered to read today have not changed my views of the disgusting
behaviour that is becomming all too common on this list.

LSD

Marcus Octavius Germanicus wrote:

> A. Apollonius Cordus wrote:
>
> > I am not even going to bother to check which message
> > you are referring to. Frankly, sir, I am both furious
> > and astounded that you should have chosen to bypass
> > the comprehensive procedures of dispute-resolution
> > which scores of citizens have worked hard to establish
> > - particularly the leges poenalis and iudiciaria and
> > the very existence of the praetors themselves.
>
> Indeed. L. Sicinius Drusus now shows nothing but contempt for Nova Roma,
> its citizens, its institutions; and has grossly violated the
> long-established
> standards of behaviour of internet mailing lists with his posting of
> anothers'
> private message.
>
> He has flouted public morality and honor.
>
> Citizens, rest assured that the rest of the Senate does not condone such
> abusive activities. The senior magistrates are presently considering
> a course of action.
>
> Valete, Octavius.
>
> --
> Marcus Octavius Germanicus.
> Censor, Consular, Citizen.
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *Yahoo! Groups Links*
>
> * To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/
>
> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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> <mailto:Nova-Roma-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
>
> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
>
>

This person was reported to the Praetors yesterday. Post 19966 was made
over 12 hours later.

I Would sugest that you read the post in question and decide if it does
in fact violate the Yahoo! TOS that this group claims to enforce at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Nova-Roma/

LSD

A. Apollonius Cordus wrote:

> A. Apollonius Cordus to Senator L. Sicinius Drusus and
> all citizens and peregrines, greetings.
>
> > Message 19966 has been reported to Yahoo! groups as
> > a violation of the
> > Terms of Service posted at
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
> I am not even going to bother to check which message
> you are referring to. Frankly, sir, I am both furious
> and astounded that you should have chosen to bypass
> the comprehensive procedures of dispute-resolution
> which scores of citizens have worked hard to establish
> - particularly the leges poenalis and iudiciaria and
> the very existence of the praetors themselves.
>
> Those institutions are there so that members of our
> community can resolve their problems using mechanisms
> which are of and for this community. As far as I am
> concerned, agreement to at least try to resolve our
> differences within those procedures before going
> outside, whether to Yahoo or to macronational legal
> authorities, is an implicit part of the agreement to
> be a citizen and obey the laws of Nova Roma. I have
> often said in the past, in public and in private, as
> an assistant to magistrates and as a private citizen,
> that anyone who deliberately bypasses our internal
> disciplinary procedures ought without hesitation to be
> deprived of his citizenship. I repeat that belief now,
> and with specific reference to this case.
>
> Forgive me if my memory is faulty, Senator, but are
> you not the Senator who has virtually made a political
> career in Nova Roma out of warning us not to risk
> destroying our community by involving, or inviting the
> involvement, of outside bodies, especially
> macronational ones? Have you not often warned that to
> risk the intervention to such bodies in our business
> is to invite macronational prosecution, financial
> liability, even collapse? And is it not you who has
> clearly, publicly and more than once stated that you
> would never even think of asking for disciplinary
> action to be taken against another citizen even within
> Nova Roma's own judicial system?
>
> Surely this must be someone else, for if it were you
> then the action you say you have just taken would be
> not only reprehensible but hypocritical in the
> extreme.
>
> I look forward to hearing that you have written to
> Yahoo to retract your complaint and that you have
> decided instead to pursue the matter through Nova
> Roma's own disciplinary structures.
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
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>
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>
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>
>