Iulius Sabinus has a valid point. It is not necessary for Iunius Bassus to
leave Nova Roma. He has admitted he wasn't up to be governor. There are
many who are not up for the challenge. He could stay and try to rebuild his
reputation and his personal integrity by continuing to serve the Res Publica by
working under other magistrates. He could learn by observing and giving
service. We have lost the services of many who might have contributed in small
but important ways. Some we drove out with a swift kick to the fundament and
a hardy "Good riddance!"

Iunius Bassus is young and could mature into a future leader of Nova Roma.
I would be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and allow him to try
again. Of course, I am sure that he will have to bear the burden of close
observation for a time. IF Iunius Bassus does remain, he will have to give up
his rending of garments and hand wringing so he can get back to his tasks.

Fl. Galerius Aurelianus,
Tribunus Plebis



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ya'll got the quick of it there, bro. Iffen ya'll wants you'ens should have
the missus make up a poultice of mustard an water for your chest so there
won't be near as much wheezin and spittin. Drink up that rock-and-rye warm and
be sure to add some rose hips with honey to yore tea. Stay warm, get some
rest. I'll offer up a prayer to Asklepius and Apollo for yur swift recovery.

Flavy Galeri



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

OSD C. Equitius Cato

Salvete omnes!

Hodie est Idibus Maiis; haec dies nefastus publicus est.

"Come, Mercury, Atlas' famous grandson, you whom
A Pleiad once bore to Jove, among the Arcadian hills,
Arbiter of war and peace to gods on high, and those below:
You who make your way with winged feet: who delight
In the sounding lyre, and the gleaming wrestling:
You through whose teaching the tongue learnt eloquence:
On the Ides, the Senate founded for you, a temple facing
The Circus: since then today has been your festival.
All those who make a living trading their wares,
Offer you incense, and beg you to swell their profits.
There's Mercury's fountain close to the Capene Gate:
It's potent, if you believe those who've tried it.
Here the merchant, cleansed, with his tunic girt,
Draws water and carries it off, in a purified jar.
With it he wets some laurel, sprinkles his goods
With damp laurel: those soon to have new owners.
And he sprinkles his hair with dripping laurel too,
And with that voice, that often deceives, utters prayers:
`Wash away all the lies of the past,' he says,
`Wash away all the perjured words of a day that's gone.
If I've called on you as witness, and falsely invoked
Jove's great power, hoping he wouldn't hear:
If I've knowingly taken the names of gods and goddesses,
In vain: let the swift southerlies steal my sinful words,
And leave the day clear for me, for further perjuries,
And let the gods above fail to notice I've uttered any.
Just grant me my profit, give me joy of the profit I've made:
And make sure I'll have the pleasure of cheating a buyer.'
Mercury, on high, laughs aloud at such prayers,
Remembering how he himself stole Apollo's cattle." - Ovid, Fasti V

"Though he was laid out in swaddling-clothes with her winnowing-basket
for a cradle, he escaped and made his way to Pieria, where he stole
some cattle that Apollon was tending. To keep from being discovered by
the tracks, he put boots on their feet and led them to Pylos. He hid
them in a grotto, except for two which he sacrificed, pinning up their
hides on rocks, boiling some o the meat for his meal and burning the
rest. Outside the cave he found a tortoise feeding. He cleaned it
out, and stretched across the shell strings made from the cattle he
had sacrificed, and when he had thus devised a lyre he also invented a
plectrum. Meanwhile Apollon reached Pylos in his search for the
cattle, and asked the locals about them. They told him that they had
indeed seen a boy driving some cattle, but they could not say where
they had been driven because there were no tracks to be found. So
Apollon learned who the thief was by divine science, and made his way
to Maia on Kyllene to charge Hermes. Maia, however, showed Apollon the
baby in his swaddling-clothes, whereupon Apollon took him to Zeus and
demanded his cattle. When Zeus told Hermes to return them, he denied
everything, but since his father would not believe him, he led Apollon
to Pylos and gave him back his cattle. Then, when Apollon heard the
lyre, he exchanged the cattle for that." - Apollodorus, the Library

"I am he who bears his father's mandates through the sky. My father's
Juppiter himself." - Ovid, Metamorphoses 2.708

"Hermes ... messenger of Zeus ... Celestial messenger of various
skill, whose powerful arts could watchful Argos kill. With winged feet
`tis thine through air to course." - Orphic Hymn 28 to Hermes

"Zeus who masses the clouds made answer ... turned to his dear son
Hermes: `Hermes, you are always our messenger." - Homer, Odyssey 5.4

"There was a craftsman who had a wooden statue of Hermes. Every day he
poured libations and made sacrifices to it, but he still wasn't able
to earn a living. The man got angry at the god so he grabbed the
statue by the leg and threw it down on the ground. The head of the
statue shattered and gold coins came pouring out from inside it. As he
gathered the gold, the man remarked, 'Hermes, you are an unlucky god,
since you take no thought for your friends. You didn't do me any good
when I was treating you with devotion, but now that I have wronged
you, you give me this immense reward. I do not understand this strange
kind of cult!" - Aesop, Fables 464

"A man fashioned a Hermes out of wood and carried it to the market to
put it up for sale but no customers approached him. In order to
attract some buyers the man began to shout that he was selling a
wish-fulfilling god who brought profit to its owner. 'Hey you,'
someone said, 'why are you putting such a thing up for sale, instead
of enjoying its benefits yourself?' The man answered, 'I am in need of
some immediate benefits, but this god happens to take his time when
distributing profits!" - Aesop, Fables 561

Today is the Mercuralia. Mercury, whose name is connected with
"merchandise" (merx), is the Roman divinity of commerce and gain,
later identified by the Romans with the Greek Hermes. His mother was
Maia, the eldest of the Pleiades, and the most beautiful of the seven
sisters. The Ides of May was recognized as his birthday. It became a
festival of traders and merchants; Ovid records the details of their
rites.

With laurel boughs, they sprinkled their goods for sale, along with
their hair, with water from a fountain near the Caperna Gate called
aqua Mercurii. They offered prayers to Mercury, who in legend had been
a thief, for forgiveness for past and future perjuries, for profit,
and for the continued ability to cheat customers! It is reasonable to
suppose that the guild of merchants spent the evening of the Ides of
May dining and feasting together.

Valete bene!

Cato



SOURCES

Ovid, Apollodorus, Homer, Aesop, Wikipedia

SALVETE!

Today, 15 of May, Mercuralia is celebrated.

"Sacred to Mercurius, this is traditionally the birthday of the
Patron of Merchants (this day is also sacred to Maia, his mother).
Merchants draw water from the aqua Mercurii — a sacred spring tied
to Mercurius — in jars cleansed by fumigation. With a bough of
laurel, the merchant then sprinkles both his merchandise and himself
with water from the jars. Mercurius is closely associated with
merchants and traders, and they hold this day as a feast day."

From this day, the Temple of Mercurius is on line:

http://www.dacia-novaroma.org/Temple-of-Mercurius.htm


VALETE,
IVL SABINVS

Salve, I paid my taxes long ago but still can't make the list. I've
sent 3 emails (this makes 4) and still nothing. Vale, T. Valerius
Severus. Invisible citizen.

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Tito Valerio Severo salutem dicit

I'm showing you listed as a current Assidui in the database. That is were
it counts!

Vale:

Modianus

On 5/15/07, titus_valerius_severus <titus_valerius_severus@...> wrote:
>
> Salve, I paid my taxes long ago but still can't make the list. I've
> sent 3 emails (this makes 4) and still nothing. Vale, T. Valerius
> Severus. Invisible citizen.
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete

The Censors are creating a new tool for the processing of payments
to the album civium.

As soon as it is ready It will used to update the album civium. In
the meantime all paypal taxpayers are being added to the list on the
Wiki. If or when I receive a list of taxpayers by check or money
order they too will be included.

Valete

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
Consul

----- Original Message -----
From: titus_valerius_severus<mailto:titus_valerius_severus@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2007 8:08 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Assidui


Salve, I paid my taxes long ago but still can't make the list. I've
sent 3 emails (this makes 4) and still nothing. Vale, T. Valerius
Severus. Invisible citizen.





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> L. Arminius Faustus CSL to all quirites,
>
> Citizens, there still a vacancy for the office of rogator. If any
> citizen desires to serve NR, announce the candidature on this list

and

> CC it to me.

Salvete

I have been thinking long and hard about running for office. I am a
new citizen and still have a great deal to learn about NR. And what
better way to learn about our Republic and serve the citizenry but
in the the service of the Censors.

I have noticed in my short time that important offices in the
Republic remain vacant for one reason or another. So I for one am
not going to stand by idle when I know that I can help. I hope that
my enthusiasm and that of my opponents in this election may inspire
others to run for office in the future.

I, Marcus Aurelius Pullo, announce my candidacy for the office of
Rogator as announced by Consul L. Arminius Faustus.


Valete

M. Aurelius Pullo

Who is living in Wells, Maine that is responsible for picking up the mail?
Are they doing it in a timely fashion? Is the person also processing the
information on who has paid to the Censores in a timely manner? This problem
seems to be happening every year for the last few years for mailed payments as
opposed to PayPal.

Flavius Galerius Aurelianus



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> A. Tullia Scholastica scriba censoris M. Aurelio Pulloni quiritibus bonae
> voluntatis S.P.D.
>
>
>
>> > L. Arminius Faustus CSL to all quirites,
>> >
>> > Citizens, there still a vacancy for the office of rogator. If any
>> > citizen desires to serve NR, announce the candidature on this list
> and
>> > CC it to me.
>
> Salvete
>
> I have been thinking long and hard about running for office. I am a
> new citizen and still have a great deal to learn about NR. And what
> better way to learn about our Republic and serve the citizenry but
> in the the service of the Censors.
>
> I have noticed in my short time that important offices in the
> Republic remain vacant for one reason or another.
>
> ATS: This, unfortunately, is true.
>
> So I for one am
> not going to stand by idle when I know that I can help. I hope that
> my enthusiasm and that of my opponents in this election may inspire
> others to run for office in the future.
>
> I, Marcus Aurelius Pullo, announce my candidacy for the office of
> Rogator as announced by Consul L. Arminius Faustus.
>
> ATS: I applaud your desire to serve. Unfortunately, you are not eligible
> to run for office. One must be a citizen for six months and be assiduus; you
> arrived this February. Moreover, for work in the censor¹s office, which is
> very demanding and quite constant, one should have worked in a cohors,
> particularly in the censorial cohors. The censors, the rogatores, and
> censorial scribae have access to the citizen data base, containing personal
> information about every citizen, including probationary ones; it is imperative
> that the censores know that their scribae and the rogatores are discreet, and
> will not misuse that information. We already have two qualified candidates
> for this post; in a few months, you will be able to run for office. As is,
> you are barely out of your probationary period, so cannot run.
>
> Valete
>
> M. Aurelius Pullo
>
> Vale, et valete.
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salve M. Aurelius Pullo!

If You can't stand for an elected office yet, You may offer yourself
as a Censorial Scriba (or scriba of another magistrate). As a former
Censor I know that the demand for Censorial Scribae is always high
and that way You will still begin your way _towards_ the Cursus
Honorum as a appointed official, if not as an elected one. As You
said there is no better way to learn the ropes than by serving. Good
Luck!

> I, Marcus Aurelius Pullo, announce my candidacy for the office of
>> Rogator as announced by Consul L. Arminius Faustus.
>>
>> ATS: I applaud your desire to serve. Unfortunately, you are
>>not eligible
>> to run for office. One must be a citizen for six months and be
>>assiduus; you
>> arrived this February. Moreover, for work in the censor's office, which is
>> very demanding and quite constant, one should have worked in a cohors,
>> particularly in the censorial cohors. The censors, the rogatores, and
>> censorial scribae have access to the citizen data base, containing personal
>> information about every citizen, including probationary ones; it
>>is imperative
>> that the censores know that their scribae and the rogatores are
>>discreet, and
>> will not misuse that information. We already have two qualified candidates
>> for this post; in a few months, you will be able to run for office. As is,
>> you are barely out of your probationary period, so cannot run.
>>
>> Valete
>>
> > M. Aurelius Pullo
>>
> > Vale, et valete.

--

Vale

Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus

Senator, Censorius et Consularis
Accensus LAF, Scribae Censoris GFBM
Praeses, Triumvir et Praescriptor Academia Thules ad S.R.A. et N.
Editor-in-Chief, Publisher and Owner of "Roman Times Quarterly"
Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
Civis Romanus sum
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness

OSD C. Equitius Cato

Salvete omnes!

Hodie est ante diem XVII Kalendas Iunius; haec dies fastus aterque est.

"On 13th January, 27 B.C., Octavian completed his first attempt to
find a constitutional basis for his extraordinary position, and on
16th January he received from the senate the cognomen Augustus, which
henceforward remained the personal appellation of the reigning Roman
emperors, and, substantially, of them alone. It has been generally
recognised that the name was well chosen, but no writer, so far as I
know, has offered any positive reason why it in particular should have
been chosen. Yet some reason is surely needed. Before 27 B.C. the
name, though not altogether unknown, does not seem to have served as a
Roman proper name. It had not been borne as a cognomen by any
republican statesman, or indeed by any historical character or
legendary hero. It was an adjective adapted by Octavian. We can,
indeed, see how much it had to recommend it to the genius in
adaptation. It possessed no political associations of any sort; it had
belonged to nobody before Octavian and recalled no one's peculiar
policy or aims. It had been merely an adjective used occasionally, yet
not very often, in earlier literature (since Ennius), and, so far as
it implied anything at all, implied simply a semi-religious sanctity —
'sancta vocant augusta patres,' as Ovid says (Fasti I.609). Thus it
fitted singularly well with the half-divinity of the divi filius. Just
as Augustus, early in his career (40 B.C.), had dropped the name
Julius and had adapted an appellation (Imp. Caesar, etc.) which marked
him off from the ordinary citizens, thereby indicating by the subtle
change his great aims and his ambitions, so by the name Augustus he
again set himself apart. Still, the name did not lie ready-made to his
hand; we need some reason, beyond its fitness, to explain why his
peculiar choice fell on it; such a reason can, I think, be learnt from
coins. The coins of Mark Antony, notably his legionary silver, which
must have been issued in great profusion not long before Actium, bear
regularly the legend " ANT- AVG - III - VIR R - P - C " Here avg. is,
of course, short for augur. But it is also an obvious abbreviation of
Augustus (as already in the Monumentum Ancyranum, that is, before A.D.
13), and, as this silver of Antony must have been circulating freely
in the Roman world about 28 B.C. it might well have suggested the name
Augustus. This would be the more likely since such faint associations
as the adjective had possessed in earlier literature were with augur;
compare Ennius Annals: 'augusto augurio postquam incluta condita
Romast,' and so Servius on Aen. VII.153: 'augusta ad moenia regis,'
paraphrases augusta by augurio consecrata. To take a title which would
(so to say) absorb automatically the familiar style of Antony, would
well accord with the methods of Octavian.

Once created, the name Augustus never spread. Apart from derivatives
('Augustinus,' 'Augustalis' and the like), it remained almost wholly
confined to the actual rulers of the empire. Occasionally, it occurs
as cognomen of some unimportant personage whose obscurity kept him
safe. The terrors of a prosecution for 'maiestas' no doubt stopped
most private persons from adopting it; indeed, it was not till the
Renaissance and the sixteenth century that it came to be used by
various princes in Germany in some abundance." - Prof. F. J.
Haverfield [ed.]

"My prayer to God is a very short one: 'O, Lord, make my enemies
ridiculous.' God has granted it." - Voltaire (1694 - 1778), letter to
M. Damilaville, 16 May AD 1767

Valete bene!

Cato



SOURCES

Voltaire, F.J. Haverfield "The Name Augustus"

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Flavio Galerio Aureliano salutem dicit

The two individuals responsible for the PO Box in Wells, Maine are Patricia
Cassia and Marcus Cassius Julianus.

Vale:

Modianus

On 5/16/07, PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@... <PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@...> wrote:
>
> Who is living in Wells, Maine that is responsible for picking up the
> mail?
> Are they doing it in a timely fashion? Is the person also processing the
> information on who has paid to the Censores in a timely manner? This
> problem
> seems to be happening every year for the last few years for mailed
> payments as
> opposed to PayPal.
>
> Flavius Galerius Aurelianus
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Reminder from:		Nova-Roma Yahoo! Group
Title:		Nova Roma Taxes Due
Date:		Wednesday May 16, 2007
Time:		12:00 pm - 1:00 pm
Repeats:		This event repeats every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday until Thursday May 31, 2007.
Notes:		The Tax Edict (rates, address, other info) is at http://novaroma.org/nr/Tax_rate_%28Nova_Roma%29 NEW! Pay through the Album Civium! * 1. log in at Album Civium ( http://www.novaroma.org/civitas/album ) * 2. go to My Account * 3. go to "make payment" * 4. add citizens to the list if paying for multiple citizens * 5. choose pay pal or check * 6. if choosing pay pal, continue through pay pal until it sends you back to My Account * 7. if choosing check, print and mail
Get reminders on your mobile, Yahoo! Messenger, and email. Edit reminder options

Copyright © 2007  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy

Very Nice Site!



--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Titus Iulius Sabinus"
<iulius_sabinus@...> wrote:

>
> SALVETE!
>
> Today, 15 of May, Mercuralia is celebrated.
>
> "Sacred to Mercurius, this is traditionally the birthday of the
> Patron of Merchants (this day is also sacred to Maia, his mother).
> Merchants draw water from the aqua Mercurii — a sacred spring tied
> to Mercurius — in jars cleansed by fumigation. With a bough of
> laurel, the merchant then sprinkles both his merchandise and himself
> with water from the jars. Mercurius is closely associated with
> merchants and traders, and they hold this day as a feast day."
>
> From this day, the Temple of Mercurius is on line:
>
> http://www.dacia-novaroma.org/Temple-of-Mercurius.htm
>
>
> VALETE,
> IVL SABINVS
>

PADRUIGTHEUNCLE@... writes:

> Who is living in Wells, Maine that is responsible for picking up the mail?

Marcus Cassius Julianus and Patricia Cassia.

> Are they doing it in a timely fashion?

I have no idea. If past experience is any guide, Julianus gets to the Post
Office about once a week, some weeks. Patricia Cassia used to go more often,
but she's been working in Boston for the past couple of years and only gets
home to Wells on weekends.

> Is the person also processing the
> information on who has paid to the Censores in a timely manner?

The information is processed by the Consular Quaestor to Consul Paulinus. The
Quaestor has access to the census database and can update the status of
citizens directly. He doesn't have to get the censors to do it.

Information about payments made through PayPal is forwarded to the consuls.
It's up to the consul in charge of tax revenues (consul Paulinus) to forward
that information to his Quaestor. That part of the process seems to be
working just fine. Information about payments mailed to the Wells, Maine PO
box is provided to the consuls by either Julianus or Patricia Cassia. That
part of the process seems to be very slow.

> This problem
> seems to be happening every year for the last few years for mailed
> payments as opposed to PayPal.

Yes, it is. I think the problem is due to Patricia's job duties in Boston and
the infrequent opportunities she has to get to the bank in Maine to deposit
the checks. She's asked to be relieved of her duties as Chief Financial
Officer, but thus far the Consuls haven't presented the Senate with any other
candidates that I can recall.

Vale,

CN•EQVIT•MARINVS

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Gnaeo Equitio Marino saltuem dicit

I was not aware of this. This is very important and needs to be addressed
ASAP.

Vale:

Modianus

On 5/15/07, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@...> wrote:
>
> <PADRUIGTHEUNCLE%40aol.com>
>
> Yes, it is. I think the problem is due to Patricia's job duties in Boston
> and
> the infrequent opportunities she has to get to the bank in Maine to
> deposit
> the checks. She's asked to be relieved of her duties as Chief Financial
> Officer, but thus far the Consuls haven't presented the Senate with any
> other
> candidates that I can recall.
>
> Vale,
>
> CN�EQVIT�MARINVS
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

SALVE TRIARE AMICE!
ET SALVETE!

Thank you.
Nothing new about your trip?

VALE ET VALETE,
IVL SABINVS

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Vitellius Triarius"
<lucius_vitellius_triarius@...> wrote:

> Very Nice Site!

> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Titus Iulius Sabinus"
> <iulius_sabinus@> wrote:
> > http://www.dacia-novaroma.org/Temple-of-Mercurius.htm

Salvete omnes!

Thank you to all of you who welcomed me as a new citizen of Nova Roma - I
appreciate it very much! I would like to do my part and pay my taxes, but I
do not have an account set up on the website. I have tried a couple of
times to create an account, but it doesn't work.

Please let me know how to proceed so that I set up an account to pay my
taxes for this year.

Thank you!

Valete,

Lucia Caecilia Marcella


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

---Salvete Modianus Censor, Marinus Consular:

I was not aware of this either. I know we Consuls didn't receive
anything from her to this effect last year, but I don't recall seeing
any announcement this year (well, obviously :>)), and I think I would
remember that. She is super busy, I know, and she has been doing
this for a while.

Valete
Pompeia



In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "David Kling (Modianus)"
<tau.athanasios@...> wrote:

>
> Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Gnaeo Equitio Marino saltuem dicit
>
> I was not aware of this. This is very important and needs to be

addressed

> ASAP.
>
> Vale:
>
> Modianus
>
> On 5/15/07, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@...> wrote:
> >
> > <PADRUIGTHEUNCLE%40aol.com>
> >
> > Yes, it is. I think the problem is due to Patricia's job duties

in Boston

> > and
> > the infrequent opportunities she has to get to the bank in Maine

to

> > deposit
> > the checks. She's asked to be relieved of her duties as Chief

Financial

> > Officer, but thus far the Consuls haven't presented the Senate

with any

> > other
> > candidates that I can recall.
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > CN•EQVIT•MARINVS
> >
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Salvete Romans

In an effort to process tax payment faster those who need to or want to pay by check or money order can send them to

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
5496 Ross Court
New Market, Maryland 21774
or you can still send it to the P.O. Box in Maine.

As always they should be made out to NOVA ROMA.

Also any citizen who has made a good faith effort to pay on time will not be subject to any penalty do to the slowness of snail mail.

Valete

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
Consul






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Lucia Caecilia Marcella writes:

> Please let me know how to proceed so that I set up an account to pay my
> taxes for this year.

I just answered this over in the newroman mailing list. Please see my answer
there.

Vale,

CN•EQVIT•MARINVS

Salvete consulares,

I recall her posting in the Senate mailing list last year, asking for a
replacement. I shall see if I can find the message and forward it to both of
you.

Valete,

-- Marinus

pompeia_minucia_tiberia <pompeia_minucia_tiberia@...> writes:

> ---Salvete Modianus Censor, Marinus Consular:
>
> I was not aware of this either. I know we Consuls didn't receive
> anything from her to this effect last year, but I don't recall seeing
> any announcement this year (well, obviously :>)), and I think I would
> remember that. She is super busy, I know, and she has been doing
> this for a while.
>
> Valete
> Pompeia
>
>
>
> In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "David Kling (Modianus)"
> <tau.athanasios@...> wrote:
> >
> > Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Gnaeo Equitio Marino saltuem dicit
> >
> > I was not aware of this. This is very important and needs to be
> addressed
> > ASAP.
> >
> > Vale:
> >
> > Modianus
> >
> > On 5/15/07, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > <PADRUIGTHEUNCLE%40aol.com>
> > >
> > > Yes, it is. I think the problem is due to Patricia's job duties
> in Boston
> > > and
> > > the infrequent opportunities she has to get to the bank in Maine
> to
> > > deposit
> > > the checks. She's asked to be relieved of her duties as Chief
> Financial
> > > Officer, but thus far the Consuls haven't presented the Senate
> with any
> > > other
> > > candidates that I can recall.
> > >
> > > Vale,
> > >
> > > CN•EQVIT•MARINVS
> > >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

CN•EQVIT•MARINVS

M. Hortensia Ti. Galerio spd;
thanks! all right then, now I'll pay my taxes;-) How much is
it for those of us who missed the tax time? approx $20.00?
M.Hortensia Maior

>
> In an effort to process tax payment faster those who need to or

want to pay by check or money order can send them to

>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> 5496 Ross Court
> New Market, Maryland 21774
> or you can still send it to the P.O. Box in Maine.
>
> As always they should be made out to NOVA ROMA.
>
> Also any citizen who has made a good faith effort to pay on time

will not be subject to any penalty do to the slowness of snail mail.

>
> Valete
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> Consul
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Still working out the details..waiting on RO Customs and Environmental
Testing Approvals


--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Titus Iulius Sabinus"
<iulius_sabinus@...> wrote:

>
> SALVE TRIARE AMICE!
> ET SALVETE!
>
> Thank you.
> Nothing new about your trip?
>
> VALE ET VALETE,
> IVL SABINVS
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Vitellius Triarius"
> <lucius_vitellius_triarius@> wrote:
>
> > Very Nice Site!
>
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Titus Iulius Sabinus"
> > <iulius_sabinus@> wrote:
> > > http://www.dacia-novaroma.org/Temple-of-Mercurius.htm
>

Salve M.Hortensia Maior

If you are sending in your payment now you have met the deadline ( May 31st).
The penalty would be the tax plus 50%.

Vale

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

----- Original Message -----
From: Maior<mailto:rory12001@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com<mailto:Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 12:20 AM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Mailing address for tax payments


M. Hortensia Ti. Galerio spd;
thanks! all right then, now I'll pay my taxes;-) How much is
it for those of us who missed the tax time? approx $20.00?
M.Hortensia Maior
>
> In an effort to process tax payment faster those who need to or
want to pay by check or money order can send them to
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> 5496 Ross Court
> New Market, Maryland 21774
> or you can still send it to the P.O. Box in Maine.
>
> As always they should be made out to NOVA ROMA.
>
> Also any citizen who has made a good faith effort to pay on time
will not be subject to any penalty do to the slowness of snail mail.
>
> Valete
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> Consul
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

OSD C. Equitius Cato

Salvete omnes!

Hodie est ante diem XVI Kalendas Iunius; haec dies comitialis est.

"Arvorum sacerdotes Romulus in primis instituit seque duodecimum
fratrem appellavit inter illos Acca Larentia nutrice sua genitos,
spicea corona, quae vitta alba colligaretur, sacerdotio ei pro
religiosissimo insigni data; quae prima apud Romanos fuit corona,
honosque is non nisi vita finitur et exules etiam captosque
comitatur." - Pliny, "Natural History" xviii.2

"ille mag. manibus lautis capite velato sub divo contra orientem
sacrificium indixit deae Diae sic Quod bonum faustum felix
fortunatumque sit populo Romano Quiritibus, fratribusque arvalibus,
Tiberio Caesar Augusto, Iuliae Augustae et liberis nepotibus totique
domui eorum, sacrificium deae Diae hoc anno erit a.d. XVI Kalendas Iunias"

("The magister [of the Fratres Arvales], with washed hands, head
covered, below the open sky and turned to East proclaimed the
sacrifice to Dea Dia in the following way: 'In order that it may be
auspicious, prosperous and happy to the Roman people of the Quirites,
to the Fratres Arvales, to Tiberius Caesar Augustus, to Iulia Augusta
and to all grandchildren of their household, the sacrifice to Dea Dia
this year will be on the 16th day before the Kalends of June.'") -
Comentarii Fratrum Arvalium, CIL VI, 32340.0-20

Today is held in honor of the Dea Dia. The worship of the Roman
goddess Dea Dia was in the hands of a priesthood of twelve, the
fratres arvales (Arval brethren), and she possessed a shrine in a
grove outside Rome at the fifth (or sixth, depending on the period)
milestone on the Via Campana, in the modern suburb of La Magliana. The
deity, her cult, and her priesthood supposedly date back to very early
in Roman history, but they underwent a major renovation by Augustus.
Roman legend held that the priestly college was originated by Romulus,
who took the place of a dead son of his nurse Acca Laurentia, and
formed the priesthood with the remaining eleven sons. They were also
connected originally with the Sabine priesthood of Sodales Titii and
were probably originally their counterpart among the Sabines. From
the previous period, we only know of the existence of the arvales and
of a public sacrifice, mentioned by Varro. The site itself bears
testimony of cultic occupation since at least the third century BC.
But it is impossible to be sure whether these items belonged to Dea
Dia or to Fors Fortuna, who possessed a temple on the same spot.

After Augustus's reform the priesthood consisted of twelve members
chosen by cooptation from the most distinguished families. The
reigning emperor was always a member. The reorganization was one
element in Augustus's policy of directing enthusiasm for his person
and policies into traditional religious channels. Under the empire the
Arval brethren offered sacrifices not only to Dea Dia but to a wide
variety of divinities to secure the health and prosperity of the
emperor and his family. Along with sometimes lengthy descriptions of
the rituals celebrated in the grove of Dea Dia, and of other
sacrifices of the brotherhood in Rome, the records of the Arval
brethren were inscribed on marble, and numerous fragments have been
preserved. These records, extending from 21 BC to AD 241, are a major
source for traditional Roman religion in the imperial age. The cult
and its priesthood are documented as late as AD 304.

Dea Dia, who was the owner of the lucus fratrum arvalium and the main
addressee of the cult celebrated by the Arval brethren, is only known
by the proceedings of this brotherhood. Thus, there has been much
speculation about her identity. During the nineteenth century, when
scholars tended to assimilate gods, some saw her as a goddess similar
to Ceres, if not Ceres herself. In the "Romische Mythologie" (1831) of
Ludwig Preller and Heinrich Jordan, Dea Dia was supposed to embody
certain aspects of the numen otherwise venerated under the names of
Ceres, Tellus, and perhaps Ops or Acca Larentia. One also finds
assimilations to Diana, Hebe, and the Mother of the Gods. In short,
Dea Dia was supposed to be an indigitation (the assimilation of minor
deities to one major god or goddess) of Ceres or another goddess
linked to agriculture.

The name Dea Dia is an emphatic doublet, meaning literally, "the
celestial goddess." According to the Arval proceedings, Dea Dia
performed her divine function between the periods of sowing and
harvesting and was thus the good light of heaven that brought the
crops from germination to maturation. The ritual at her festival
employed, among other offerings (a lamb, meatballs, sweet wine, and
pastries), green ears from the current crop, together with dried ears
of grain from the previous year's crop. The other gods and goddesses
mentioned in her lucus are to be considered her assistants or her guests.

Valete bene!

Cato



SOURCES

Pliny, Fears & Scheid

Salvete

Thank you, Praetrix A. Tullia Scholastica and Senator Caeso Fabius
Buteo Quintilianus for the correction. As you can see my eagerness
overcame my normal caution. I thank you for your advice, I have
been working for our Plebian Aedile Gaius Curius Saturninus
unofficially doing research. I believe now that I am a full citizen
he will be appointing me as his scriba.

I was inspired by the acheivements of NR since I last saw it in 2000
on the net. I want to contribute to the progression of the
organization in any way I can.

Valete

M. Aurelius Pullo

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
<christer.edling@...> wrote:

>
> Salve M. Aurelius Pullo!
>
> If You can't stand for an elected office yet, You may offer

yourself

> as a Censorial Scriba (or scriba of another magistrate). As a

former

> Censor I know that the demand for Censorial Scribae is always high
> and that way You will still begin your way _towards_ the Cursus
> Honorum as a appointed official, if not as an elected one. As You
> said there is no better way to learn the ropes than by serving.

Good

> Luck!
>
>
> > I, Marcus Aurelius Pullo, announce my candidacy for the office

of

> >> Rogator as announced by Consul L. Arminius Faustus.
> >>
> >> ATS: I applaud your desire to serve. Unfortunately, you

are

> >>not eligible
> >> to run for office. One must be a citizen for six months and

be

> >>assiduus; you
> >> arrived this February. Moreover, for work in the censor's

office, which is

> >> very demanding and quite constant, one should have worked in a

cohors,

> >> particularly in the censorial cohors. The censors, the

rogatores, and

> >> censorial scribae have access to the citizen data base,

containing personal

> >> information about every citizen, including probationary ones;

it

> >>is imperative
> >> that the censores know that their scribae and the rogatores

are

> >>discreet, and
> >> will not misuse that information. We already have two

qualified candidates

> >> for this post; in a few months, you will be able to run for

office. As is,

> >> you are barely out of your probationary period, so cannot run.
> >>
> >> Valete
> >>
> > > M. Aurelius Pullo
> >>
> > > Vale, et valete.
>
> --
>
> Vale
>
> Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
>
> Senator, Censorius et Consularis
> Accensus LAF, Scribae Censoris GFBM
> Praeses, Triumvir et Praescriptor Academia Thules ad S.R.A. et N.
> Editor-in-Chief, Publisher and Owner of "Roman Times Quarterly"
> Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
> Civis Romanus sum
> ************************************************
> Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> "I'll either find a way or make one"
> ************************************************
> Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
> Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness
>

D. Suetoni Lupe T. Galerio S.P.D.

Salve !

This answers my question also, my final question is: how much are my taxes ? $20.00 ?
If you would be so kind as to advise me, as well as if there is a penalty, I will be happy to remit same at the address provided, by mail.

Vale,
D. Suetonius Lupus

Maior <rory12001@...> wrote:
M. Hortensia Ti. Galerio spd;
thanks! all right then, now I'll pay my taxes;-) How much is
it for those of us who missed the tax time? approx $20.00?
M.Hortensia Maior

>
> In an effort to process tax payment faster those who need to or

want to pay by check or money order can send them to

>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> 5496 Ross Court
> New Market, Maryland 21774
> or you can still send it to the P.O. Box in Maine.
>
> As always they should be made out to NOVA ROMA.
>
> Also any citizen who has made a good faith effort to pay on time

will not be subject to any penalty do to the slowness of snail mail.

>
> Valete
>
> Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
> Consul
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Yahoo! Groups Links






Michael P. Orley

---------------------------------
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha!
Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete



If any citizen would like to know their tax rate please go to the Nova
Roma Wiki

and click on " taxes are due now". The individual tax rates are
listed by country .



http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page
<http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page>



If you reside in the USA the current rate is $15.00 until June 1.

If a tax payment is received a few days after this date and sent in by
snail mail the

50% penalty will not be applied.



Valete

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

Consul







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Gratia tibi

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus <spqr753@...> wrote:
Salvete



If any citizen would like to know their tax rate please go to the Nova
Roma Wiki

and click on " taxes are due now". The individual tax rates are
listed by country .



http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page




If you reside in the USA the current rate is $15.00 until June 1.

If a tax payment is received a few days after this date and sent in by
snail mail the

50% penalty will not be applied.



Valete

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus

Consul







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Yahoo! Groups Links






Michael P. Orley

---------------------------------
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> A. Tullia Scholastica M. Aurelio Pulloni quiritibus S.P.D.
>
>
>
>
>
> Salvete
>
> Thank you, Praetrix A. Tullia Scholastica and Senator Caeso Fabius
> Buteo Quintilianus for the correction. As you can see my eagerness
> overcame my normal caution. I thank you for your advice, I have
> been working for our Plebian Aedile Gaius Curius Saturninus
> unofficially doing research. I believe now that I am a full citizen
> he will be appointing me as his scriba.
>
> I was inspired by the acheivements of NR since I last saw it in 2000
> on the net. I want to contribute to the progression of the
> organization in any way I can.
>
> ATS: You are entirely welcome. We certainly welcome anyone who wants to
> serve the Res Publica, but our laws require that candidates for elected office
> be assidui/ae who have been among us for at least six months. Various offices
> have other requirements regarding minimum age and experience in lower offices,
> etc. Magisterial assistants (scribae, accensi/ae, viatores/viatrices) must
> also be assidui, and normally meet the six-month requirement as well, though
> there are no age requirements beyond that for citizenship. Incidentally, your
> scriba should adjust your censorial citizen page (not available to the public)
> to reflect your completion of the tirocinium, and the extension of voting
> privileges to you, if this has not already been done.
>
> We are delighted that you seem so enthusiastic about NR. This is indeed a
> wonderful organization comprised of many interested and interesting, often
> highly educated, people from all walks of life. We hope you enjoy your stay
> among us.
>
>
> Valete
>
> M. Aurelius Pullo
>
>
> Vale, et valete.
>
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com> , Caeso
> Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
> <christer.edling@...> wrote:
>> >
>> > Salve M. Aurelius Pullo!
>> >
>> > If You can't stand for an elected office yet, You may offer
> yourself
>> > as a Censorial Scriba (or scriba of another magistrate). As a
> former
>> > Censor I know that the demand for Censorial Scribae is always high
>> > and that way You will still begin your way _towards_ the Cursus
>> > Honorum as a appointed official, if not as an elected one. As You
>> > said there is no better way to learn the ropes than by serving.
> Good
>> > Luck!
>> >
>> >
>>> > > I, Marcus Aurelius Pullo, announce my candidacy for the office
> of
>>>> > >> Rogator as announced by Consul L. Arminius Faustus.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> ATS: I applaud your desire to serve. Unfortunately, you
> are
>>>> > >>not eligible
>>>> > >> to run for office. One must be a citizen for six months and
> be
>>>> > >>assiduus; you
>>>> > >> arrived this February. Moreover, for work in the censor's
> office, which is
>>>> > >> very demanding and quite constant, one should have worked in a
> cohors,
>>>> > >> particularly in the censorial cohors. The censors, the
> rogatores, and
>>>> > >> censorial scribae have access to the citizen data base,
> containing personal
>>>> > >> information about every citizen, including probationary ones;
> it
>>>> > >>is imperative
>>>> > >> that the censores know that their scribae and the rogatores
> are
>>>> > >>discreet, and
>>>> > >> will not misuse that information. We already have two
> qualified candidates
>>>> > >> for this post; in a few months, you will be able to run for
> office. As is,
>>>> > >> you are barely out of your probationary period, so cannot run.
>>>> > >>
>>>> > >> Valete
>>>> > >>
>>>> > > > M. Aurelius Pullo
>>>> > >>
>>>> > > > Vale, et valete.
>> >
>> > --
>> >
>> > Vale
>> >
>> > Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
>> >
>> > Senator, Censorius et Consularis
>> > Accensus LAF, Scribae Censoris GFBM
>> > Praeses, Triumvir et Praescriptor Academia Thules ad S.R.A. et N.
>> > Editor-in-Chief, Publisher and Owner of "Roman Times Quarterly"
>> > Sodalitas Egressus Beneficarius et Praefectus Provincia Thules
>> > Civis Romanus sum
>> > ************************************************
>> > Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
>> > "I'll either find a way or make one"
>> > ************************************************
>> > Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
>> > Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness
>> >

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

---Salvete Marinus Consularis Quiritibus:



In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@...>
wrote:

>
> Salvete consulares,
>
> I recall her posting in the Senate mailing list last year, asking

for a

> replacement. I shall see if I can find the message and forward it

to both of

> you.

Pompeia: I hope this matter has been clarified to your
satisfaction. I don't know how the current Consuls feel, but as one
of last year's Consuls, I'd respectfully appreciate your checking the
facts first regarding the issuance of any resignations, written
requests to be replaced etc. before openly presuming Consular
irresponsiblity through failure to seek and present replacement
candidates. Especially with such an important position. I have not
always agreed with you, but I believe I have treated you in this
forum with courtesy, and I have not openly implied neglect on your
part during your Consulship or Censorship.


"She's asked to be relieved of her duties as Chief Financial
Officer, but thus far the Consuls haven't presented the Senate with
any other
candidates that I can recall."

Pompeia: That said, I do think any official 'heralding' of such
information is best delivered by the Consuls or perhaps Tribunes.
With Senators randomly making these public declarations willy nilly,
nothing is kept straight, and people don't know if the statement
is 'if memory serves' (not always) or if the matter is indeed
official information.


Valete
Pompeia Minucia Strabo
Consul 2759 A.U.C.

>
> Valete,
>
> -- Marinus
>
> pompeia_minucia_tiberia <pompeia_minucia_tiberia@...> writes:
>
> > ---Salvete Modianus Censor, Marinus Consular:
> >
> > I was not aware of this either. I know we Consuls didn't receive
> > anything from her to this effect last year, but I don't recall

seeing

> > any announcement this year (well, obviously :>)), and I think I

would

> > remember that. She is super busy, I know, and she has been doing
> > this for a while.
> >
> > Valete
> > Pompeia
> >
> >
> >
> > In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "David Kling (Modianus)"
> > <tau.athanasios@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Gnaeo Equitio Marino saltuem dicit
> > >
> > > I was not aware of this. This is very important and needs to be
> > addressed
> > > ASAP.
> > >
> > > Vale:
> > >
> > > Modianus
> > >
> > > On 5/15/07, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > <PADRUIGTHEUNCLE%40aol.com>
> > > >
> > > > Yes, it is. I think the problem is due to Patricia's job

duties

> > in Boston
> > > > and
> > > > the infrequent opportunities she has to get to the bank in

Maine

> > to
> > > > deposit
> > > > the checks. She's asked to be relieved of her duties as Chief
> > Financial
> > > > Officer, but thus far the Consuls haven't presented the Senate
> > with any
> > > > other
> > > > candidates that I can recall.
> > > >
> > > > Vale,
> > > >
> > > > CN•EQVIT•MARINVS
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> CN•EQVIT•MARINVS
>

Reminder from:		Nova-Roma Yahoo! Group
Title:		Nova Roma Taxes Due
Date:		Friday May 18, 2007
Time:		12:00 pm - 1:00 pm
Repeats:		This event repeats every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday until Thursday May 31, 2007.
Notes:		The Tax Edict (rates, address, other info) is at http://novaroma.org/nr/Tax_rate_%28Nova_Roma%29 NEW! Pay through the Album Civium! * 1. log in at Album Civium ( http://www.novaroma.org/civitas/album ) * 2. go to My Account * 3. go to "make payment" * 4. add citizens to the list if paying for multiple citizens * 5. choose pay pal or check * 6. if choosing pay pal, continue through pay pal until it sends you back to My Account * 7. if choosing check, print and mail
Get reminders on your mobile, Yahoo! Messenger, and email. Edit reminder options

Copyright © 2007  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy

P. Memmius Albucius Consulibus Consularibus Censori al. magist.
omn.que

I remembered that, two years ago, I have some difficulty as a Tribune
to understand why it was so hard for our - now consul - then consular
quaestor Hon. Galerius to get informations on "who paid her/his
annual tax".
With his usual efficiency, Hon. Galerius then explained to me that,
as our censor Fabius Buteo has reminded us in this forum, "the two
individuals responsible for the PO Box in Wells, Maine are Patricia
Cassia and Marcus Cassius Julianus", and that the communication was
sometimes not easy between all these very busy concerned people.

This point let apart, I have been amazed of this situation, which
seems to get its root in Nova Roma association history, but does not
seem that appropriate, according our constitution and laws.

We all know that our constitution is "the bylaws of Nova Roma" inc.
(cf. its text). So the way we manage NR Inc. must respect our laws.

These laws say that the Senate vote the annual budget, which is
prepared by the concerned quaestors, who are generally consular ones.
This is the good sense itself.

So why keeping asking two good willing senators, independantly of any
legal reference, to pick up the postal mail, specially the budget
one ?

Why not say, legally and historically :

1/ the consuls and their departments are responsible of the daily
good working of NR, in its Republic side as its NGO's one ;

2/ in these officia, someone - up to the consuls - is responsible to
check the postal mail (why not the special 'budget' quaestor
consularis, for the most important mails are still taxes ones ?!)

3/ up to the annual elected consuls to organize the matters of P.O.
box, postal address, etc. according to the organization that they
have decided (and not the contrary, according the old habits : the
mail must come to us, not we to the mail !!!).

Consul Galerius has shown his will bettering up the efficiency of our
tax collecting, by giving a direct postal address.

This is a good and immediate answer, for the very next weeks.

The next step would consist, Consuls, to put an end to the burden
asked to Sen. Cassius and Cassia and organize, as suggested above a
simple, efficient, legal and... roman way to handle our postal mail.

No need of a new law or of convening the Senate : a simple edict
would be sufficient, if the quaestor is available.


Valete Magistratus et omnes,


P. Memmius Albucius

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Publio Memmio Albucio salutem dicit

The truth, as I see it, is that Marcus Cassius Julianus founded Nova Roma.
If the "taking away" of control of the checking account and documents of
incorporation would make him feel that he has lost power in Nova Roma. I
believe this is a desire that they (the Cassia) wish to retain, that power.
I believe this has never been attempted, as you say, for fear of conflict of
unbearable proportions. Things should operate as you proposed, but to do
this would cause a potential battle. Marcus Cassius Julianus will go months
without posting or communicating to anyone. You mention one peep about
taking away or potentially taking away what he perceives is his "power base"
and he suddenly has time again to invest in Nova Roma. The battle to
"up-root" the real power from the Cassia (power over the incorporation and
power over the money) is a battle that any consul should be willing to fight
for the long haul and he (or she) had better make sure they have friends to
accomplish the task, because it might get ugly. Of course, I *could* be
wrong on every point I have made and the Cassia *could* be well dispose to
do as the senate wants -- assuming the senate ever decides to change the
status quo.

Vale:

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus

On 5/18/07, Publius Memmius Albucius <albucius_aoe@...> wrote:
>
> P. Memmius Albucius Consulibus Consularibus Censori al. magist.
> omn.que
>
> I remembered that, two years ago, I have some difficulty as a Tribune
> to understand why it was so hard for our - now consul - then consular
> quaestor Hon. Galerius to get informations on "who paid her/his
> annual tax".
> With his usual efficiency, Hon. Galerius then explained to me that,
> as our censor Fabius Buteo has reminded us in this forum, "the two
> individuals responsible for the PO Box in Wells, Maine are Patricia
> Cassia and Marcus Cassius Julianus", and that the communication was
> sometimes not easy between all these very busy concerned people.
>
> This point let apart, I have been amazed of this situation, which
> seems to get its root in Nova Roma association history, but does not
> seem that appropriate, according our constitution and laws.
>
> We all know that our constitution is "the bylaws of Nova Roma" inc.
> (cf. its text). So the way we manage NR Inc. must respect our laws.
>
> These laws say that the Senate vote the annual budget, which is
> prepared by the concerned quaestors, who are generally consular ones.
> This is the good sense itself.
>
> So why keeping asking two good willing senators, independantly of any
> legal reference, to pick up the postal mail, specially the budget
> one ?
>
> Why not say, legally and historically :
>
> 1/ the consuls and their departments are responsible of the daily
> good working of NR, in its Republic side as its NGO's one ;
>
> 2/ in these officia, someone - up to the consuls - is responsible to
> check the postal mail (why not the special 'budget' quaestor
> consularis, for the most important mails are still taxes ones ?!)
>
> 3/ up to the annual elected consuls to organize the matters of P.O.
> box, postal address, etc. according to the organization that they
> have decided (and not the contrary, according the old habits : the
> mail must come to us, not we to the mail !!!).
>
> Consul Galerius has shown his will bettering up the efficiency of our
> tax collecting, by giving a direct postal address.
>
> This is a good and immediate answer, for the very next weeks.
>
> The next step would consist, Consuls, to put an end to the burden
> asked to Sen. Cassius and Cassia and organize, as suggested above a
> simple, efficient, legal and... roman way to handle our postal mail.
>
> No need of a new law or of convening the Senate : a simple edict
> would be sufficient, if the quaestor is available.
>
> Valete Magistratus et omnes,
>
> P. Memmius Albucius
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete Omnes,

A couple of days ago I mentioned here that I thought Patricia Cassia had asked
to be relieved as Chief Financial Officer of Nova Roma sometime last year. A
review of the senate archives found nothing to support this, so I have to
conclude that I was mistaken.

I particularly want to be sure that nobody imputes any negligence toward last
year's consuls from this.

Valete,

CN•EQVIT•MARINVS

OSD C. equitius Cato

Salvete omnes!

Hodie est ante diem XV Kalendas Iunius; haec dies comitialis est.

"Why do men not marry during the month of May? Is it because this
month comes between April and June, of which they regard April as
sacred to Venus and June as sacred to Juno, both of them divinities of
marriage; and so they put the wedding a little earlier or wait until
later? Or is it because in this month they hold their most important
ceremony of purification, in which they now throw images from the
bridge into the river, but in days of old they used to throw human
beings? Wherefore it is the custom that the Flaminica, reputed to be
consecrate to Juno, shall wear a stern face, and refrain from bathing
and wearing ornaments at this time.

Or is it because many of the Latins make offerings to the departed in
this month? And it is for this reason, perhaps, that they worship
Mercury in this month and that the month derives its name from Maia.
Or is May, as some relate, named after the older (maior) and June
after the younger generation (iunior)? For youth is better fitted for
marriage, as Euripides also says:

Old age bids Love to take her leave for aye
And Aphrodite wearies of the old.

They do not, therefore, marry in May, but wait for June which comes
next after May." - Plutarch, "The Roman Questions" 86


"The people of Rome were regretting that they had not prevented
Hannibal from sailing home, and when they learned that he was
consolidating the opposition in Africa, they were again greatly
terrified. Accordingly, they sent Claudius Nero, one of the
p263consuls, against him, and allotted to Marcus Servilius the
protection of Italy. Nero, however, was unable to reach Africa, being
detained by stormy weather in Italy and again in Sardinia. After that
he progressed no farther than Sicily, for he learned that Scipio had
proved the victor. Scipio, in fact, had been afraid that Nero might be
so prompt as to appropriate the glory of his own toils, and so at the
first glimmer of spring, he had advanced against Hannibal, having
learned that the latter had conquered Masinissa. And Hannibal, when he
found out that Scipio was approaching, went to meet him. They encamped
opposite each other, though they did not at once come to blows, but
delayed several days; and each commander addressed his army, inciting
it to battle.

When it seemed best to Scipio not to delay any longer, but to draw
Hannibal into a struggle whether he wished it or not, he set out for
Utica, that by creating an impression of fear and flight he might gain
a favourable opportunity for attack; and thus it turned out. Hannibal,
thinking that he was in flight, and being correspondingly encouraged,
pursued him with his cavalry only. Contrary to his expectations Scipio
resisted, engaged in battle, and came out victorious. After routing
this body he then directed his attention not to pursuing them, but to
their equipment train, which was on the march, and he captured it
entire. This caused Hannibal alarm, and his alarm was increased by the
news that Scipio had done no injury to three Carthaginian spies whom
he had found in his camp. Hannibal had learned this fact from one of
them, after the other two had chosen to remain with the Romans.
Disheartened, therefore, he no longer felt the courage to carry on a
decisive engagement with the Romans, but determined to make efforts
for a truce as quickly as possible, in order that even if this attempt
should not be successful, it might at least cause a temporary delay
and cessation of hostilities. So he sent to Masinissa, and through
him, as a man of the same race, asked for a truce. And he secured a
conference with Scipio, but accomplished nothing. For Scipio avoided a
definite answer as well as a harsh one, but pursued a middle course
throughout, although adopting a particularly mild tone, in order to
lead Hannibal into careless behavior by pretending a willingness to
come to terms. And such was the result. For Hannibal now gave no
thought to battle, but was desirous of shifting his camp to a more
favorable place. Scipio, gaining this information from deserters,
broke camp by night and occupied the spot which was the goal of
Hannibal's efforts. And when the Carthaginians had reached a valley
unsuited for a camping place, he suddenly confronted them. Hannibal
refused to fight, but in his efforts to pitch camp there and to dig
wells he had a hard time of it all night long. Thus Scipio forced the
enemy, while at a disadvantage from weariness and thirst, to offer
battle in spite of themselves.

Accordingly, the Romans entered the conflict well marshalled and
eager, but Hannibal and the Carthaginians listless and dejected. This
was owing in part to a total eclipse of the sun; for in view of the
other circumstances, Hannibal suspected that this, too, augured
nothing auspicious for them. In this frame of mind they stationed the
elephants in front of them as a protection. Suddenly the Romans
uttered a great and terrible shout, and smiting their spears against
their shields, rushed furiously against the elephants. Thrown into a
panic by their charge, most of the beasts did not await their coming,
but turned to flight, and receiving frequent wounds caused still
greater confusion among those stationed beside them. But some of the
beasts charged the Romans, whereupon the latter would stand apart so
that they ran through the spaces between the ranks, getting struck
with missiles and wounded from close at hand as they passed along. For
a time the Carthaginians resisted, but at length, when Masinissa and
Laelius fell upon them from the rear with the horsemen, they all fled.
The majority of them were destroyed, and Hannibal came very near
losing his life. For as he fled, Masinissa pursued him at breakneck
speed, giving his horse a free rein. But Hannibal turned, and seeing
him thus pursuing, swerved aside slightly and checked his course; thus
Masinissa rushed by, and Hannibal got in his rear and wounded him.
Thus he made his escape with a few followers." - Cassius Dio, "Roman
History" XVII.xiv

"One of the symptoms of an approaching nervous breakdown is the belief
that one's work is terribly important." - Bertrand Russell, born 18
May AD 1872

Valete bene!

Cato



SOURCES

Plutarch, Cassius Dio, Russell

Is there any other place where we can share our own personal works such as poetry and
such? Instinctively, I would post items here, but I feel that would be rude no matter my
inclination to share with my fellow citizens some poetry.

Bene Valete,
D. Iulius Caesar

Salve Decime Iuli,

decimus_iulius_caesar <sapamila79@...> writes:

> Is there any other place where we can share our own personal works such as
> poetry and such?

The Sodalitas Musarum. Join our mailing list by sending a blank e-mail
message to ForTheMuses-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

Vale,

CN•EQVIT•MARINVS

Reminder from:		Nova-Roma Yahoo! Group
Title:		VI Conventus Novae Romae
Date:		Saturday May 19, 2007
Time:		12:00 am - 1:00 am
Repeats:		This event repeats every week until Thursday August 9, 2007.
Location:		http://www.novaroma.org/nr/VI_Conventus_Novae_Romae
Notes:		Brush up your Latin and get your tickets for the VI Conventus Novae Romae in Emerita Augusta, Hispania (Merida, Spain).
Get reminders on your mobile, Yahoo! Messenger, and email. Edit reminder options

Copyright © 2007  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy

Salvete omnes,

Well A. Tullia Scholastica will be impressed to hear this along with
some of us other citizens:




Cardinal: Pope to relax Latin Mass rules By NICOLE WINFIELD,
Associated Press Writer
Fri May 18, 12:58 PM ET



VATICAN CITY - A Vatican official has confirmed that Pope Benedict
XVI plans to loosen restrictions on celebrating the old Latin Mass,
reviving a rite that was essentially swept away by the revolutionary
reforms of the Second Vatican Council.

ADVERTISEMENT

Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos told a meeting of Latin American
bishops in Brazil this week that Benedict wanted to give all
Catholics greater access to the so-called Tridentine Mass because of
a "new and renewed interest" in the rite.

Benedict is also acting in a bid to reach out to an
ultraconservative schismatic group, the Society of St. Pius X, and
bring it back into the Vatican's fold, Castrillon Hoyos said
Wednesday, according to a copy of his speech posted on the meeting's
Web site.

The late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre founded the society in 1969 in
Switzerland, opposed to the liberalizing reforms of the 1962-65
Second Vatican Council, particularly its reform of the Tridentine
Mass into the modern liturgy celebrated today in the vernacular.

The Vatican excommunicated Lefebvre in 1988 after he consecrated
four bishops without Rome's consent. Benedict has been keen to
reconcile with the group, which has demanded freer use of the old
Mass as a precondition for normalizing relations.

The 1962-65 Second Vatican Council was a landmark event in the Roman
Catholic Church, modernizing the liturgy and its relations with
other faiths. Benedict attended the council as a young theological
expert, and has long lamented what he considers the erroneous
interpretation of its work.

He has made clear he greatly admires the 16th century rite and in a
recent document urged seminarians and the faithful alike to learn
Latin prayers.

The Tridentine Mass differs significantly from the new Mass: It is
celebrated in Latin, with the priest facing the altar away from the
faithful. The rank and file do not participate actively in the
service.

Castrillon Hoyos stressed that Benedict's plans to revive the
Tridentine rite did not represent a "step backward, of a regression
to times before the reforms." Rather, it is an offer to the faithful
to have greater access to what he said was a "treasure" of the
church.

"For this reason, the Holy Father intends to extend to the entire
Latin church the possibility of celebrating the Holy Mass and the
sacraments" according to the latest version of the Tridentine Mass,
from 1962.

The pope would decree it an "extraordinary form of the unique Roman
rite," he said.

Castrillon Hoyos noted that the Tridentine liturgy had never been
abolished. Currently, local bishops must grant permission for
priests to celebrate it — a bureaucratic obstacle that fans say has
greatly limited its availability.

Castrillon Hoyos was the second Vatican official to confirm the
pope's plans in as many months. In late March, the Vatican secretary
of state, Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, told Le Figaro magazine that
Benedict believed there was no reason not to give the priests around
the world the right to celebrate the old Mass.

Castrillon Hoyos gave no date of when the pope's document would be
released. It remains unclear whether Benedict will remove the
requirement that bishops must approve each celebration.

Castrillon Hoyos heads a Vatican commission, Ecclesia Dei, which was
created to try to reconcile with Lefebvre's followers. Castrillon
Hoyos said Benedict wanted the office to be converted into an office
to "conserve and maintain the value of the traditional Latin
liturgy."

Regards,

QSP

> A. Tullia Scholastica Q. Suetonio Paulino quiritibus, sociis, peregrinisque
> bonae voluntatis S.P.D.
>
>
>
> Salvete omnes,
>
> Well A. Tullia Scholastica will be impressed to hear this along with
> some of us other citizens:
>
> Cardinal: Pope to relax Latin Mass rules By NICOLE WINFIELD,
> Associated Press Writer
> Fri May 18, 12:58 PM ET
>
>
> VATICAN CITY - A Vatican official has confirmed that Pope Benedict
> XVI plans to loosen restrictions on celebrating the old Latin Mass,
> reviving a rite that was essentially swept away by the revolutionary
> reforms of the Second Vatican Council.
>
> ATS: YESSSSS! Viva il Papa Benedetto! The banishment of Latin from the
> (previously) Roman (previously) Catholic Church was, and still is, one of the
> worst things for Latin and Latin instruction. As soon as the Church dropped
> Latin, the Catholic schools followed suit, and a generation or two has come
> along which has no experience of hearing Latin in church, and no need to take
> it in school, for they no longer require it to understand the Mass. Hearing
> Latin in church was the path whereby many came to learn Latin, and many WANTED
> to learn Latin, if for no better reason than that they could then understand
> exactly what was being said in church. I know I wanted to understand what the
> priest was saying, and wanted very much to learn Latin (and Greek). Moreover,
> the Tridentine Rite is far more solemn, far more beautiful that the present
> version (not that I¹ve seen many examples thereof, for that is part of the
> price the RC Church has had to pay for this folly). A faith which has turned
> its back on the very element which made it both Roman and Catholic (universal)
> cannot truly be called by either of these names; it¹s a church, all right, but
> one which has abandoned the basis for its name. If indeed Pope Benedict does
> relax these rules, and preferably removes the requirement for episcopal
> approval, he will be doing every Latinist in the world a huge favor, and might
> even earn the right for the Church to be called Roman and Catholic once again.
> Yes, the pronunciation is not the classical one, but it is a legitimate one,
> one which, as my colleague Barbatus noted earlier in a different context, the
> one in which Latin was preserved for many centuries. Medieval Latin is a big
> improvement over no Latin in my book; one can learn the reconstructed one
> later. (I did...) Avitus will be all too eager to do that...and maybe the
> presence of living Latin groups all over the world and seminars in spoken
> Latin gave this as much a push as the presence of the St. Pius X society.
> Vivemus quam Latinissime!
>
> Now, if we could just find some Catholic priests and bishops who know
> Latin...
>
> Plurimas gratias for posting this...now it should go to Latinitas.
>
> Vale, et valete.
>
>
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
> Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos told a meeting of Latin American
> bishops in Brazil this week that Benedict wanted to give all
> Catholics greater access to the so-called Tridentine Mass because of
> a "new and renewed interest" in the rite.
>
> Benedict is also acting in a bid to reach out to an
> ultraconservative schismatic group, the Society of St. Pius X, and
> bring it back into the Vatican's fold, Castrillon Hoyos said
> Wednesday, according to a copy of his speech posted on the meeting's
> Web site.
>
> The late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre founded the society in 1969 in
> Switzerland, opposed to the liberalizing reforms of the 1962-65
> Second Vatican Council, particularly its reform of the Tridentine
> Mass into the modern liturgy celebrated today in the vernacular.
>
> The Vatican excommunicated Lefebvre in 1988 after he consecrated
> four bishops without Rome's consent. Benedict has been keen to
> reconcile with the group, which has demanded freer use of the old
> Mass as a precondition for normalizing relations.
>
> The 1962-65 Second Vatican Council was a landmark event in the Roman
> Catholic Church, modernizing the liturgy and its relations with
> other faiths. Benedict attended the council as a young theological
> expert, and has long lamented what he considers the erroneous
> interpretation of its work.
>
> He has made clear he greatly admires the 16th century rite and in a
> recent document urged seminarians and the faithful alike to learn
> Latin prayers.
>
> The Tridentine Mass differs significantly from the new Mass: It is
> celebrated in Latin, with the priest facing the altar away from the
> faithful. The rank and file do not participate actively in the
> service.
>
> Castrillon Hoyos stressed that Benedict's plans to revive the
> Tridentine rite did not represent a "step backward, of a regression
> to times before the reforms." Rather, it is an offer to the faithful
> to have greater access to what he said was a "treasure" of the
> church.
>
> "For this reason, the Holy Father intends to extend to the entire
> Latin church the possibility of celebrating the Holy Mass and the
> sacraments" according to the latest version of the Tridentine Mass,
> from 1962.
>
> The pope would decree it an "extraordinary form of the unique Roman
> rite," he said.
>
> Castrillon Hoyos noted that the Tridentine liturgy had never been
> abolished. Currently, local bishops must grant permission for
> priests to celebrate it — a bureaucratic obstacle that fans say has
> greatly limited its availability.
>
> Castrillon Hoyos was the second Vatican official to confirm the
> pope's plans in as many months. In late March, the Vatican secretary
> of state, Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone, told Le Figaro magazine that
> Benedict believed there was no reason not to give the priests around
> the world the right to celebrate the old Mass.
>
> Castrillon Hoyos gave no date of when the pope's document would be
> released. It remains unclear whether Benedict will remove the
> requirement that bishops must approve each celebration.
>
> Castrillon Hoyos heads a Vatican commission, Ecclesia Dei, which was
> created to try to reconcile with Lefebvre's followers. Castrillon
> Hoyos said Benedict wanted the office to be converted into an office
> to "conserve and maintain the value of the traditional Latin
> liturgy."
>
> Regards,
>
> QSP
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Salvete,

Yes, it's time for more blunt and to the point questions from that
d@#%ned Vitellian again!

My questions as a tax paying member of this organization (which I did
not get credit for last year, by the way) are:

1) Where are the financial reports for the last 15 quarters, and WHY
are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?

2) What expenses does this organization have besides the website,
because you really get nothing for your money, other than a title, and
sometimes you don't even get that?

3) What happens to the surplus money at the end of the year, we being
a non-profit organization?

4) Is this an international organization or a private venture of the
Cassia?

5) Why does this organization not operate like 99.9% of the other
non-profit, social, historical, etc. organizations and pass the
blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to the elected financial
people in the organization?

6) Why is the surplus money collected not reallocated to the provinces
to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real growth of the
organization will be...maybe...someday...probably not in our lifetime?

7) How much of the organizations money is placed into noble, but
unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater project (a project which in
reality would require hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not
millions, to be regarded as a successful venture)?

8) Why does everything have to go to Wells, Maine; many corporations
have administrative centers separate from the corporate headquarters?

9) Why do so few people in this organization fail to see that there is
a stagnation that seems to runs off good potential leaders every time
the opportunity presents itself, especially when new ideas are
presented that "challenge" the "old ways"? Whether it is the Ancient
Roman government or Nova Roma, the organization must be run like a
business, not a private, disorganized social club on the west side of
town?

10) why do some people in leadership positions not understand that if
an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life blood of the
organization is its current and future members, not its founder and
original members, who in many cases are never heard from?

Okay, now I've vented my current frustrations on the Res Pvblica...

Vale optime,
L. Vitellius Triarius




--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "David Kling (Modianus)"
<tau.athanasios@...> wrote:

>
> Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Publio Memmio Albucio salutem dicit
>
> The truth, as I see it, is that Marcus Cassius Julianus founded Nova

Roma.

> If the "taking away" of control of the checking account and

documents of

> incorporation would make him feel that he has lost power in Nova

Roma. I

> believe this is a desire that they (the Cassia) wish to retain, that

power.

> I believe this has never been attempted, as you say, for fear of

conflict of

> unbearable proportions. Things should operate as you proposed, but

to do

> this would cause a potential battle. Marcus Cassius Julianus will

go months

> without posting or communicating to anyone. You mention one peep about
> taking away or potentially taking away what he perceives is his

"power base"

> and he suddenly has time again to invest in Nova Roma. The battle to
> "up-root" the real power from the Cassia (power over the

incorporation and

> power over the money) is a battle that any consul should be willing

to fight

> for the long haul and he (or she) had better make sure they have

friends to

> accomplish the task, because it might get ugly. Of course, I *could* be
> wrong on every point I have made and the Cassia *could* be well

dispose to

> do as the senate wants -- assuming the senate ever decides to change the
> status quo.
>
> Vale:
>
> Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus
>
> On 5/18/07, Publius Memmius Albucius <albucius_aoe@...> wrote:
> >
> > P. Memmius Albucius Consulibus Consularibus Censori al. magist.
> > omn.que
> >
> > I remembered that, two years ago, I have some difficulty as a Tribune
> > to understand why it was so hard for our - now consul - then consular
> > quaestor Hon. Galerius to get informations on "who paid her/his
> > annual tax".
> > With his usual efficiency, Hon. Galerius then explained to me that,
> > as our censor Fabius Buteo has reminded us in this forum, "the two
> > individuals responsible for the PO Box in Wells, Maine are Patricia
> > Cassia and Marcus Cassius Julianus", and that the communication was
> > sometimes not easy between all these very busy concerned people.
> >
> > This point let apart, I have been amazed of this situation, which
> > seems to get its root in Nova Roma association history, but does not
> > seem that appropriate, according our constitution and laws.
> >
> > We all know that our constitution is "the bylaws of Nova Roma" inc.
> > (cf. its text). So the way we manage NR Inc. must respect our laws.
> >
> > These laws say that the Senate vote the annual budget, which is
> > prepared by the concerned quaestors, who are generally consular ones.
> > This is the good sense itself.
> >
> > So why keeping asking two good willing senators, independantly of any
> > legal reference, to pick up the postal mail, specially the budget
> > one ?
> >
> > Why not say, legally and historically :
> >
> > 1/ the consuls and their departments are responsible of the daily
> > good working of NR, in its Republic side as its NGO's one ;
> >
> > 2/ in these officia, someone - up to the consuls - is responsible to
> > check the postal mail (why not the special 'budget' quaestor
> > consularis, for the most important mails are still taxes ones ?!)
> >
> > 3/ up to the annual elected consuls to organize the matters of P.O.
> > box, postal address, etc. according to the organization that they
> > have decided (and not the contrary, according the old habits : the
> > mail must come to us, not we to the mail !!!).
> >
> > Consul Galerius has shown his will bettering up the efficiency of our
> > tax collecting, by giving a direct postal address.
> >
> > This is a good and immediate answer, for the very next weeks.
> >
> > The next step would consist, Consuls, to put an end to the burden
> > asked to Sen. Cassius and Cassia and organize, as suggested above a
> > simple, efficient, legal and... roman way to handle our postal mail.
> >
> > No need of a new law or of convening the Senate : a simple edict
> > would be sufficient, if the quaestor is available.
> >
> > Valete Magistratus et omnes,
> >
> > P. Memmius Albucius
> >
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus L. Vitellio Trairio salutem dicit

I'll do the best I can to answer your questions from my perspective.

1) Where are the financial reports for the last 15 quarters, and WHY
are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?
GFBM: I don't know, but they should be there. I believe that if Patricia
Cassia cannot do the job any longer then she should step down. I think we
need two Quaestors, elected to two year terms like the censors, who manage
the finances of Nova Roma. I think our current system is flawed. Nova Roma
is much more than what it was when it was founded, and those apron strings
need to be cut and the magistrates allowed to be responsible for our funds.


2) What expenses does this organization have besides the website,
because you really get nothing for your money, other than a title, and
sometimes you don't even get that?

GFBM: There are efforts for a scholarship fund, among other things. There
are things that can be done, unfortunately such things are not being
accomplished. We were supposed to have a newsletter this year, but we don't
because the magistrate responsible has not done it.

3) What happens to the surplus money at the end of the year, we being
a non-profit organization?

GFBM: It stays in the bank.

4) Is this an international organization or a private venture of the
Cassia?

GFBM: I sometimes wonder the same question. It is time for the Cassia to
"retire" with dignity. Marcus Cassius Julianus only comes out of hiding
when his "title" is threatened. Otherwise he prevents any real progress
within the Religio side of Nova Roma.

5) Why does this organization not operate like 99.9% of the other
non-profit, social, historical, etc. organizations and pass the
blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to the elected financial
people in the organization?

GFBM: GOOD QUESTION! My belief is it is because of power. Those who
control the check book have some semblence of power, even if its not in the
constitution or within our laws.

6) Why is the surplus money collected not reallocated to the provinces
to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real growth of the
organization will be...maybe...someday...probably not in our lifetime?

GFBM: That is an option. Its never been presented to the senate, and no
governor has asked.

7) How much of the organizations money is placed into noble, but
unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater project (a project which in
reality would require hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not
millions, to be regarded as a successful venture)?

GFBM: Most of the money generated by the Magna Mater project is donated
specifically to the project.

8) Why does everything have to go to Wells, Maine; many corporations
have administrative centers separate from the corporate headquarters?

GFBM: Good question. See above.

9) Why do so few people in this organization fail to see that there is
a stagnation that seems to runs off good potential leaders every time
the opportunity presents itself, especially when new ideas are
presented that "challenge" the "old ways"? Whether it is the Ancient
Roman government or Nova Roma, the organization must be run like a
business, not a private, disorganized social club on the west side of
town?

GFBM: I know there is a stagnation, and have been advocating against it for
years. I think we need a new Pontifex Maximus who will end the deadlock in
the Collegium Ponficium. That would be a start.

10) why do some people in leadership positions not understand that if
an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life blood of the
organization is its current and future members, not its founder and
original members, who in many cases are never heard from?

GFBM: You are preaching to the choir on this one, I understand and agree
with you.

Vale:

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus
Censor, Consular, Pontifex, et al.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

OSD C. Equitius Cato

Salvete omnes!

Hodie est ante diem XIV Kalendas Iunius; haec dies comitialis est.


"They say that Aeneas, the son of Anchises and Venus, when he had
landed in Italy, was intending to sacrifice to some one or other of
the gods, and after praying was about to begin the sacrifice of the
animal that had been prepared for the rite, when he caught sight of
one of the Achaeans approaching at a distance — either Ulysses, when
he was about to consult the oracle near Lake Avernus, or Diomed, when
he came as an ally to Daunus. And being vexed at the coincidence and
wishing to avert as an evil omen the sight of an enemy that had
appeared at the time of a sacrifice, he veiled himself and turned
back; then, after the departure of the enemy, he washed his hands
again and finished the sacrifice. When the sacrifices turned out
rather favorably, he was pleased at the coincidence and observed the
same practice on the occasion of every prayer; and his posterity keep
this also as one of the customary observances in connection with their
sacrifices. It was in accordance with the traditional usages, then,
that Camillus, after making his prayer and drawing his garment down
over his head, wished to turn his back; however, his foot slipped and
he was unable to recover himself, but fell flat on the ground. Though
this omen called for no divination or uncertainty but was easy for
even the most ordinary mind to interpret, signifying that it was
absolutely inevitable that he should come a disgraceful fall,
nevertheless, he did not consider it worth while either to guard
against it or to avert it by expiations, but altered it to the mention
gate that pleased him, assuming that the gods had given ear to his
prayers and had contrived that the mischief should be of the
slightest." - Dionysius of Halicarnassus, "Roman Antiquities" XII.16


"Why is it that when they worship the gods, they cover their heads,
but when they meet any of their fellow-men worthy of honour, if they
happen to have the toga over the head, they uncover?

This second fact seems to intensify the difficulty of the first. If,
then, the tale told of Aeneas is true, that, when Diomedes passed by,
he covered his head and completed the sacrifice, it is reasonable and
consistent with the covering of one's head in the presence of an enemy
that men who meet good men and their friends should uncover. In fact,
the behavior in regard to the gods is not properly related to this
custom, but accidentally resembles it; and its observance has
persisted since the days of Aeneas.

But if there is anything else to be said, consider whether it be not
true that there is only one matter that needs investigation: why men
cover their heads when they worship the gods; and the other follows
from this. For they uncover their heads in the presence of men more
influential than they: it is not to invest these men with additional
honor, but rather to avert from them the jealousy of the gods, that
these men may not seem to demand the same honors as the gods, nor to
tolerate an attention like that bestowed on the gods, nor to rejoice
therein. But they thus worshipped the gods, either humbling themselves
by concealing the head, or rather by pulling the toga over their ears
as a precaution lest any ill-omened and baleful sound from without
should reach them while they were praying. That they were mightily
vigilant in this matter is obvious from the fact that when they went
forth for purposes of divination, they surrounded themselves with the
clashing of bronze.

Or, as Castor states when he is trying to bring Roman customs into
relation with Pythagorean doctrines: the Spirit within us entreats and
supplicates the gods without, and thus he symbolizes by the covering
of the head the covering and concealment of the soul by the body." -
Plutarch, "The Roman Questions" 10

Valete bene!

Cato



SOURCES

Plutarch, Dionysius of Halicarnassus

Salvete Luci Vitelli et Omnes:



In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Vitellius Triarius"
<lucius_vitellius_triarius@...> wrote:

>
> Salvete,
>

My questions as a tax paying member of this organization (which I did

> not get credit for last year, by the way)

I checked my records to see if you wrote me on this matter last year,
and I have no record of your telling me you were not in the Album
Civium as assidus. What inquiries I did get of this nature, I have in
a separate file.

I think I might still be able to look into this for you, in
collaboration with this year's administration. (I was last year's
Junior Consul who worked on tax management with Patricia Cassia and
Quaestor, now Tribune, C. Arminius Reccanellus).

As a FYI, Reccanellus would credit the Album Civium as payment
notifications came in, either via Paypal or Patricia Cassia, so I
didn't feel a need to keep an additional List of Assidui, other than
of course our working spreadsheet and the Album Civium. Citizens
could just as easily check their Album Civium page, where the credit
really counts. The more steps involved, the greater the margin for
error, but that is just my opinion. The current Consuls and the Wiki
magister are making modifications to the system. Galerius Consul
announced such within the last few days I believe.

Anyway,to your payment:

Did you write a cheque, money order, send the remittance by Paypal?
Did you include a Roman name or a nonRoman name which could be
crosschecked with the Censors? Was your remittance made by a third
party who is not in NR, who didn't state what the payment was for?

In any accounts receivable scenerio, there are always a couple
of 'problem payments'. We were actually able to trace most of them,
but I know there were a couple that we couldn't accredit due to poor
identification. It appears they were sent third party on behalf of a
citizen and even trying to track down the third party sender in once
case proved fruitless.

Again, if you write me with some particulars, I'll confer with this
year's Consuls and see what I can do for you.

>
> Okay, now I've vented my current frustrations on the Res Pvblica...

Well, the above 'detective work' is frustrating, to say the least,
but that's the nature of the beast when collecting funds from all
over the world.

Now, (and I've snipped these sorry) regarding your questions about
the use of NR income, why financial statements haven't been
published, I can answer these question in part. I cannot say what
happened prior to my term, mind you, other than the a budget has been
prepared and voted on.

Last December Modianus and myself called an Senate audit. The Consuls
and some Senators wanted to review budget methods to date, take an
earnest look at our income to date with respect to our goals...maybe
set some additional goals. This proposal was published by the
Tribunes via the Senate Call, and the Senate elected to do this. We
are in process of doing the audit right now, and as we are able, the
Senate Auditing Committee will make some specific recommendations to
the Senate.

Previous budget sheets, a Statement of Income and Expenses for last
year, the tax spreadsheets, and Magna Mater budget at 2759 end were
uploaded to the Senate List last year, for use by the Auditing
Committee. In addition, any monies I received for the first couple of
months this year were accounted for to the Consuls..., a few tax
payments for this year (yes, in January),a Magna Mater donation, and
Macellum commissions. But everything is switched over now, and I'm
out of that picture.

I believe that Galerius Consul reissued another edict regarding the
Audit activities this year, so these plans and the above particulars
have been well publicized.

Anyway, do write me about your missing payment and I hope the above
information relaxes your frustrations a little.


Valete bene
Pompeia Minucia Strabo
Consul 2759 A.U.C.

>
> Vale optime,
> L. Vitellius Triarius
>
>
>
>
>
> >
>

---Salvete Modianus Censor, Luci Vitelli et Omnes:

You wrote, Modianus:



6) Why is the surplus money collected not reallocated to the provinces
to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real growth of the
organization will be...maybe...someday...probably not in our lifetime?

GFBM: That is an option. Its never been presented to the senate, and
no
governor has asked



Actually, just to note, the Senate allocated tax entitlements to
America Austroccidentalis provincia during one of our Senate Calls.
That was a while back though, in an eventful year. This amount was
calculated from data on the spreadsheets from last year and the year
before. I agree though, it is not a frequent request. I think the
last request of this nature was from Hispania in 2002. Some
governors, I can think of 5, currently retain their 50% prior to
remitting their collective provincial payment, avoiding the need to
requisition it from the Senate.

Just a FYI...I missed this question when reading Vitellius' original
post.

Valete
Pompeia

>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus Pompeiae Minuciae Tiberiae salutem dicit

Ah, I remember. These are few and far between for sure!

Vale:

Modianus

On 5/19/07, pompeia_minucia_tiberia <pompeia_minucia_tiberia@...>
wrote:

>
> ---Salvete Modianus Censor, Luci Vitelli et Omnes:
>
> You wrote, Modianus:
>
> 6) Why is the surplus money collected not reallocated to the provinces
> to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real growth of the
> organization will be...maybe...someday...probably not in our lifetime?
>
> GFBM: That is an option. Its never been presented to the senate, and
> no
> governor has asked
>
> Actually, just to note, the Senate allocated tax entitlements to
> America Austroccidentalis provincia during one of our Senate Calls.
> That was a while back though, in an eventful year. This amount was
> calculated from data on the spreadsheets from last year and the year
> before. I agree though, it is not a frequent request. I think the
> last request of this nature was from Hispania in 2002. Some
> governors, I can think of 5, currently retain their 50% prior to
> remitting their collective provincial payment, avoiding the need to
> requisition it from the Senate.
>
> Just a FYI...I missed this question when reading Vitellius' original
> post.
>
> Valete
> Pompeia
>
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

SALVE ET SALVETE!

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Vitellius Triarius"
<lucius_vitellius_triarius@...> wrote:

> 1) Where are the financial reports for the last 15 quarters, and

WHY are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?>>>

The wiki financial sections were created. You saw that. Past and
actual quaestores must start to upload the section.

> 2) What expenses does this organization have besides the website,
> because you really get nothing for your money, other than a title,

and sometimes you don't even get that?>>>

You pay the tax that's means you are responsible member. Finally
what to receive?

> 3) What happens to the surplus money at the end of the year, we

being a non-profit organization?>>>

In reserve.

> 4) Is this an international organization or a private venture of

the Cassia?>>>

International. About Cassii I have not any references.

> 5) Why does this organization not operate like 99.9% of the other
> non-profit, social, historical, etc. organizations and pass the
> blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to the elected

financial people in the organization?>>>

Here I agree with you. It's a problem.

> 6) Why is the surplus money collected not reallocated to the

provinces to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real
growth of the organization will be...maybe...someday...probably not
in our lifetime?>>>

Any governor can ask. Senate can approve. But if nobody ask, what
the central administration can do? To dream about the provincial
necessities?

> 7) How much of the organizations money is placed into noble, but
> unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater project (a project which

in reality would require hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not

> millions, to be regarded as a successful venture)?>>>

From two years, nothing. Magna Mater Project already has his own
course. To reconstruct the Temple from Palatine? Yes, you can say
so, it's unrealistic. But the Project has many aspects and
proposals. People involved know better and I'm one of them as time
as I'm in the second year as MMP coordinator.

>
> 8) Why does everything have to go to Wells, Maine; many

corporations have administrative centers separate from the corporate
headquarters?>>>

Correct. One is necessary to each continent.

> 9) Why do so few people in this organization fail to see that

there is a stagnation that seems to runs off good potential leaders
every time the opportunity presents itself, especially when new
ideas are presented that "challenge" the "old ways"? Whether it is
the Ancient Roman government or Nova Roma, the organization must be
run like a business, not a private, disorganized social club on the
west side of town?>>>

Again it's correct. Here are the eternal conflicts between
generations and the humans fear about new things and changes.

> 10) why do some people in leadership positions not understand that

if an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life blood of the

> organization is its current and future members, not its founder and
> original members, who in many cases are never heard from?>>>

Probably they will answer for themselves.

VALETE,
IVL SABINVS

Salve et salvete omnes,

I'll have to look it up (A. Cordus asked me about this
a year ago) but as I recall until the Principate the
title of pontifex maximus was as annual appointment
just like any magistrate in Republican times. In fact,
sometimes more than one pontifex maximus was appointed
if I remember correctly. Off the top of my head, a
second pontifex maximus was appointed one year when
Julius Caesar also held the office but he was off
fighting the Gauls and too busy to carry out the
pontifical duties. Anyway, I'll look for the sources.
But again, off the top of my head, while flamens were
life time appointments, the pontifex maximus was an
annual one. And actually, in order of religious
authority, the three flamen maiores and flamen minores
ranked higher in the college of pontiffs than the
pontifex maximus who was originally the "go-between"
(sort of a first secretary, also responsible for the
calendar (hence somewhat politically powerful) and
Vestals) first between the college of pontiffs and the
Regia, and later, the college of pontiffs and the
Senate.


--- "David Kling (Modianus)"
<tau.athanasios@...> wrote:

> Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus L. Vitellio Trairio
> salutem dicit
>
> I'll do the best I can to answer your questions from
> my perspective.
>
> 1) Where are the financial reports for the last 15
> quarters, and WHY
> are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?
> GFBM: I don't know, but they should be there. I
> believe that if Patricia
> Cassia cannot do the job any longer then she should
> step down. I think we
> need two Quaestors, elected to two year terms like
> the censors, who manage
> the finances of Nova Roma. I think our current
> system is flawed. Nova Roma
> is much more than what it was when it was founded,
> and those apron strings
> need to be cut and the magistrates allowed to be
> responsible for our funds.
>
>
> 2) What expenses does this organization have besides
> the website,
> because you really get nothing for your money, other
> than a title, and
> sometimes you don't even get that?
>
> GFBM: There are efforts for a scholarship fund,
> among other things. There
> are things that can be done, unfortunately such
> things are not being
> accomplished. We were supposed to have a newsletter
> this year, but we don't
> because the magistrate responsible has not done it.
>
> 3) What happens to the surplus money at the end of
> the year, we being
> a non-profit organization?
>
> GFBM: It stays in the bank.
>
> 4) Is this an international organization or a
> private venture of the
> Cassia?
>
> GFBM: I sometimes wonder the same question. It is
> time for the Cassia to
> "retire" with dignity. Marcus Cassius Julianus only
> comes out of hiding
> when his "title" is threatened. Otherwise he
> prevents any real progress
> within the Religio side of Nova Roma.
>
> 5) Why does this organization not operate like 99.9%
> of the other
> non-profit, social, historical, etc. organizations
> and pass the
> blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to the
> elected financial
> people in the organization?
>
> GFBM: GOOD QUESTION! My belief is it is because of
> power. Those who
> control the check book have some semblence of power,
> even if its not in the
> constitution or within our laws.
>
> 6) Why is the surplus money collected not
> reallocated to the provinces
> to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real
> growth of the
> organization will be...maybe...someday...probably
> not in our lifetime?
>
> GFBM: That is an option. Its never been presented
> to the senate, and no
> governor has asked.
>
> 7) How much of the organizations money is placed
> into noble, but
> unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater project (a
> project which in
> reality would require hundreds of thousands of
> dollars, if not
> millions, to be regarded as a successful venture)?
>
> GFBM: Most of the money generated by the Magna
> Mater project is donated
> specifically to the project.
>
> 8) Why does everything have to go to Wells, Maine;
> many corporations
> have administrative centers separate from the
> corporate headquarters?
>
> GFBM: Good question. See above.
>
> 9) Why do so few people in this organization fail to
> see that there is
> a stagnation that seems to runs off good potential
> leaders every time
> the opportunity presents itself, especially when new
> ideas are
> presented that "challenge" the "old ways"? Whether
> it is the Ancient
> Roman government or Nova Roma, the organization must
> be run like a
> business, not a private, disorganized social club on
> the west side of
> town?
>
> GFBM: I know there is a stagnation, and have been
> advocating against it for
> years. I think we need a new Pontifex Maximus who
> will end the deadlock in
> the Collegium Ponficium. That would be a start.
>
> 10) why do some people in leadership positions not
> understand that if
> an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life
> blood of the
> organization is its current and future members, not
> its founder and
> original members, who in many cases are never heard
> from?
>
> GFBM: You are preaching to the choir on this one, I
> understand and agree
> with you.
>
> Vale:
>
> Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus
> Censor, Consular, Pontifex, et al.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>

A. Sempronius Regulus

America Austrorientalis


Vincit qui se vincit. - Seneca
Vivere disce, cogita mori. - Cicero
Ubi spiritus est cantus est. - Sempronius Atratinus

ANNI MMDCCLX AVC (anno urbis conditae - a.u.c.)






____________________________________________________________________________________Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's
Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.
http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222

---Marinus Consularis Salve:

Your clarification is appreciated.

Vale
Pompeia


In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Gnaeus Equitius Marinus <gawne@...>
wrote:

>
> Salvete Omnes,
>
> A couple of days ago I mentioned here that I thought Patricia

Cassia had asked

> to be relieved as Chief Financial Officer of Nova Roma sometime

last year. A

> review of the senate archives found nothing to support this, so I

have to

> conclude that I was mistaken.
>
> I particularly want to be sure that nobody imputes any negligence

toward last

> year's consuls from this.
>
> Valete,
>
> CN•EQVIT•MARINVS
>

Salve Triari, et salvete omnes,

"L. Vitellius Triarius" <lucius_vitellius_triarius@...> writes:

> 1) Where are the financial reports for the last 15 quarters,

There are no financial reports for the last 15 quarters. There are the annual
budgets which are presented to the senate, and the financial sections of each
provincial governor's annual report.

> and WHY are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?

Because they don't exist.

> 2) What expenses does this organization have besides the website,

Maintenance of the PO box. Maintenance of the bank account. Census costs
(snail mail and phone).

> 3) What happens to the surplus money at the end of the year, we being
> a non-profit organization?

It stays in the bank account, adding to the endowment.

> 4) Is this an international organization or a private venture of the
> Cassia?

Nova Roma is an international organization registered as a non-profit
corporation with the state of Maine.

> 5) Why does this organization not operate like 99.9% of the other
> non-profit, social, historical, etc. organizations and pass the
> blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to the elected financial
> people in the organization?

The Senate has appointed Patricia Cassia as Chief Financial Officer of the
organization. This makes sense since she lives near the bank where our
account is maintained.

> 6) Why is the surplus money collected not reallocated to the provinces
> to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real growth of the
> organization will be...maybe...someday...probably not in our lifetime?

Every provincial governor can get 50% of tax revenues for a provincial fund.
When I was governor of Mediatlantica I investigated the maintenance costs of
a bank account for a non-profit corporation, and discovered that they are
much higher than for a personal checking account. I concluded that it would
be fiscally irresponsible of me to let our meagre funds be winnowed away by
bank fees. So I left the funds in the bank in Maine. Provincial expenses
can still be reimbursed, up to the 50% of collecgted taxes limit.

> 7) How much of the organizations money is placed into noble, but
> unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater project

Not a dime of tax payments goes to the Magna Mater project.

Nova Roma does maintain several funds, such as the Scholarship Fund. These
are accounted for in every year's budget.

> 8) Why does everything have to go to Wells, Maine; many corporations
> have administrative centers separate from the corporate headquarters?

Bank accounts cost money. Interstate banking laws limit how funds can be
moved around from state to state, never mind country to country. Senator Gn.
Salvius Astur investigated the creation of a bank account in Spain and
reported back to the Senate on the costs associated with having such an
account in an EU nation. Because of the costs no European account was
created.

> 9) Why do so few people in this organization fail to see that there is
> a stagnation

I don't know what you mean by few. I think it's fair to say that every
current and past consul is keenly aware of the problems. Most current and
past curule magistrates of all ranks know about them.

> 10) why do some people in leadership positions not understand that if
> an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life blood of the
> organization is its current and future members, not its founder and
> original members, who in many cases are never heard from?

Who would be the people in leadership positions you refer to? The consuls?
The senate? Who?

Nova Roma's fundamental financial problem is that we have a very small revenue
stream. It won't support the costs associated with banking services. The
long term goal is to build up enough of an endowment over the course of
several decades to allow it to become self-perpetuating. In order to realize
that goal with such a small revenue stream the annual expenses have to be kept
to a minimum.

Vale, et valete,

CN•EQVIT•MARINVS

---Salve Semproni Regule, Salvete Omnes:

I wanted to crosscheck a couple of things before responding to you,
but I think I can add a bit from a religious and historical
perspective, though, admittedly, I am not as learned as a religious
official in NR. How about armchair historian? :>) :


In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "A. Sempronius Regulus"
<a_sempronius_regulus@...> wrote:

>
> Salve et salvete omnes,
>
> I'll have to look it up (A. Cordus asked me about this
> a year ago) but as I recall until the Principate the
> title of pontifex maximus was as annual appointment
> just like any magistrate in Republican times.

Pompeia: I haven't found any source, really, suggesting that a
Pontifex or Pontifex Maximus appointment was anything but a lifetime
term. Mind you there are periods in the latter republic where there
were elections of these positions. It was mentioned in 212 BC, but
that's about all I know about that.(Livy) Actually documented, and
easily referenced is the Lex Domitia in 104 BCE, where members of the
College of Pontiffs (and maybe augurs, but definitely Pontifices)
were elected by comitia members, but again, nothing said about a
change in length of term. This Lex was abolished by the dictator
Sulla in the Lex Cornelia de Sacedotes. After Sulla's departure,
a 'modified' form of the Lex Domitia was passed whereby the College
of Pontiffs would select a couple of candidates for a pontifical
vacancy, and comitia would select whom the thought was the more
suitable candidate. Julius Caesar was elected Pontifex Maximus.
Apparently, this method of CP membership selection might have
continued until Marcus Antonius canned it after the death of Julius
Caesar.


In fact,

> sometimes more than one pontifex maximus was appointed
> if I remember correctly. Off the top of my head, a
> second pontifex maximus was appointed one year when
> Julius Caesar also held the office but he was off
> fighting the Gauls and too busy to carry out the
> pontifical duties. Anyway, I'll look for the sources.

Pompeia: Interesting. I look forward to reading them. Didn't know
that, to be honest. I do know that the Pontifex Maximus could hold
civil magistracies, and history shows that this was frequently the
case, but the PM could not leave Italy. Julius Caesar did just that
in going off to Gaul...he was in violation of his religious
obligations. But....Julius did alot of things :>) There was a
Pontifex Maximus, Lucinius Crassus who violated the same covenant,145
BCE, prior to Caesar's doing so.

> But again, off the top of my head, while flamens were
> life time appointments, the pontifex maximus was an
> annual one. And actually, in order of religious
> authority, the three flamen maiores and flamen minores
> ranked higher in the college of pontiffs than the
> pontifex maximus who was originally the "go-between"
> (sort of a first secretary, also responsible for the
> calendar (hence somewhat politically powerful) and
> Vestals) first between the college of pontiffs and the
> Regia, and later, the college of pontiffs and the
> Senate.

Pompeia: From anything I've read, which crossreferences primary
sources (Dio, Livius, Cicero and I think once I read of Appian) the
Pontiffs, including the CP were the supreme authority over all public
religious practices, including rituals; they would regulate the
calendar, issue responsa when asked, Decretum Pontificium when it was
felt such were needed to maintain the Pax Deorum. They had authority
over other priestly practices, including Flamens. The Vestals were
the charge of the Pontifex Maximus. Additionally, the Pontifex
Maximus kept a yearly annal of religious activity for a given year.
It is said Pontifices derive their power from Numa, and serve as the
Bridge between the divine and the people for the maintainence of the
Pax Deorum. Although the Pontifex Maximus was not always included in
the total tally of Pontiffs, he was, from what I can see, considered
a Pontiff, having atleast the same priestly authority, with some
additional duties.

The Rex Sacrorum seems more of a ceremonial position than the
Pontifex Maximus, although considered an important honourary
representative of the Kings (I think I have that right).

Now at one point a lex passed (sometime post Sulla) called the Lex
Ovinia Tribunicia, which conferred a Senate seat upon the Flamen
Dialis and the Pontifex Maximus, but I do not believe that the lex
gave this Flamen any special authority over the Pontifex Maximus. I
don't see where it legally could anyway. The purpose of the lex was
to guide the Censors in their selection of Senators, which happened
to include the above religious personnal.

Valete
Pompeia

>
>
> --- "David Kling (Modianus)"
> <tau.athanasios@...> wrote:
>
> > Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus L. Vitellio Trairio
> > salutem dicit
> >
> > I'll do the best I can to answer your questions from
> > my perspective.
> >
> > 1) Where are the financial reports for the last 15
> > quarters, and WHY
> > are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?
> > GFBM: I don't know, but they should be there. I
> > believe that if Patricia
> > Cassia cannot do the job any longer then she should
> > step down. I think we
> > need two Quaestors, elected to two year terms like
> > the censors, who manage
> > the finances of Nova Roma. I think our current
> > system is flawed. Nova Roma
> > is much more than what it was when it was founded,
> > and those apron strings
> > need to be cut and the magistrates allowed to be
> > responsible for our funds.
> >
> >
> > 2) What expenses does this organization have besides
> > the website,
> > because you really get nothing for your money, other
> > than a title, and
> > sometimes you don't even get that?
> >
> > GFBM: There are efforts for a scholarship fund,
> > among other things. There
> > are things that can be done, unfortunately such
> > things are not being
> > accomplished. We were supposed to have a newsletter
> > this year, but we don't
> > because the magistrate responsible has not done it.
> >
> > 3) What happens to the surplus money at the end of
> > the year, we being
> > a non-profit organization?
> >
> > GFBM: It stays in the bank.
> >
> > 4) Is this an international organization or a
> > private venture of the
> > Cassia?
> >
> > GFBM: I sometimes wonder the same question. It is
> > time for the Cassia to
> > "retire" with dignity. Marcus Cassius Julianus only
> > comes out of hiding
> > when his "title" is threatened. Otherwise he
> > prevents any real progress
> > within the Religio side of Nova Roma.
> >
> > 5) Why does this organization not operate like 99.9%
> > of the other
> > non-profit, social, historical, etc. organizations
> > and pass the
> > blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to the
> > elected financial
> > people in the organization?
> >
> > GFBM: GOOD QUESTION! My belief is it is because of
> > power. Those who
> > control the check book have some semblence of power,
> > even if its not in the
> > constitution or within our laws.
> >
> > 6) Why is the surplus money collected not
> > reallocated to the provinces
> > to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the real
> > growth of the
> > organization will be...maybe...someday...probably
> > not in our lifetime?
> >
> > GFBM: That is an option. Its never been presented
> > to the senate, and no
> > governor has asked.
> >
> > 7) How much of the organizations money is placed
> > into noble, but
> > unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater project (a
> > project which in
> > reality would require hundreds of thousands of
> > dollars, if not
> > millions, to be regarded as a successful venture)?
> >
> > GFBM: Most of the money generated by the Magna
> > Mater project is donated
> > specifically to the project.
> >
> > 8) Why does everything have to go to Wells, Maine;
> > many corporations
> > have administrative centers separate from the
> > corporate headquarters?
> >
> > GFBM: Good question. See above.
> >
> > 9) Why do so few people in this organization fail to
> > see that there is
> > a stagnation that seems to runs off good potential
> > leaders every time
> > the opportunity presents itself, especially when new
> > ideas are
> > presented that "challenge" the "old ways"? Whether
> > it is the Ancient
> > Roman government or Nova Roma, the organization must
> > be run like a
> > business, not a private, disorganized social club on
> > the west side of
> > town?
> >
> > GFBM: I know there is a stagnation, and have been
> > advocating against it for
> > years. I think we need a new Pontifex Maximus who
> > will end the deadlock in
> > the Collegium Ponficium. That would be a start.
> >
> > 10) why do some people in leadership positions not
> > understand that if
> > an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life
> > blood of the
> > organization is its current and future members, not
> > its founder and
> > original members, who in many cases are never heard
> > from?
> >
> > GFBM: You are preaching to the choir on this one, I
> > understand and agree
> > with you.
> >
> > Vale:
> >
> > Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus
> > Censor, Consular, Pontifex, et al.
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been
> > removed]
> >
> >
>
>
> A. Sempronius Regulus
>
> America Austrorientalis
>
>
> Vincit qui se vincit. - Seneca
> Vivere disce, cogita mori. - Cicero
> Ubi spiritus est cantus est. - Sempronius Atratinus
>
> ANNI MMDCCLX AVC (anno urbis conditae - a.u.c.)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

______________________________________________________________________
______________Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's

> Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.
> http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222
>

Ex Officio Tiberius Galerius Paulinus Consul


I hereby issue a general call for applications of those citizens who
wish to serve as Praetor ( governor) of the following provinces.

Argentina

Australia

Asia Occidentalis

Asia Orientalis America Boreoccidentalis

Britannia

Germania

Hibernia

Nova Britannia

Any citizen who resides in any one of these provinces should send a
letter of interest to spqr753@... <mailto:spqr753@...>

Done this day a.d. XIV Kal. Iun. .MMDCCLX a.u.c.
L. Arminio Ti. Galerio cos.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

For the love of God(s), would someone take charge in this organization
and straighten it out.

We cannot afford a bank account, but we have a scholarship
fund...Would the recipient of this year's No.2 pencil allotment please
step forward.

I suppose we are supposed to sit around for decades while our $7500
earns a whopping half-percent interest annually on checking?

It is absolutely and completely inexcusable for an organization of
this size to NOT have financial statements for the last 15 quarters
and a defined vision for the future.

We have elected officials who are supposed to have some role and
responsibility to those elected officials who are supposed to be
overseeing the administrative ends of things, who are supposed to
report to elected officials who are supposed to make legislative
decisions for the good of the organization.

Maybe...just maybe...everyone will get over this silly notion of
"stepping on the other officials toes" and possibly offending someone
and start to do something about MANAGEMENT.

One of these days, the glorious Senate of Nova Roma and its
illustrious magistrates are going to get out of bed and realize that
the only membership base they have have is that of the senate mailing
list, the corporate officer list, and pontiff's list.

Then they can use the old familiar "we were the only dedicated ones
who stuck through thick and thin..the persevering ones...the Real NR
members" excuse and watch what is left of the Republic crumble to the
barbaric hoards.

So, back to the basics of business management when pure crap has
overtaken the hallways and cancer has taken over the operation...

Who do we fire first for not doing their job?

Vale optime,
Triarius

Caesar Triario sal.

Just out of interest who do you suggest we fire, never mind who gets
fired first? Do we have the rudiments of a list already?

I think we all would like Nova Roma to run as efficiently as
possible, and other voluntary groups certainly seem to have a more
well oiled machine, but the Roman Republic wasn't a model of
administrative probity, in fact often the reverse, so possibly we are
historically accurate in the way we muddle along.

I would of course support any increase in efficiency, as long as the
solution doesn't compromise the principles and lines the Republic
functioned along. One could argue that the Empire was at various
times far more efficient than the Republic, but the price for that
success was an absence of the right to make a mess of things, in fact
the absence of the right to do anything that you weren't told to do.

The call you make for "someone take charge in this organization and
straighten it out" seems rather similar to the calls that have been
made throughout history for powerful men to assume sole control and
set things to rights. There may be a time when that is necessary, but
I think we should avoid that possibility at all costs in NR, unless
all else has failed.

All of us need to step forward and "straighten it out". We are all to
blame for these failures. If we, the people, elect magistrates who
then perform their duties in a mediocre way or who fail completely
then ultimately it is our fault for not choosing for selectively. If
we elect people who don't exercise oversight rigidly and who worry
more about treading on people's toes, as you so rightly say, then we
are to blame.

Dictators and proscriptions? My, my the republic does live after
all :)


--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "L. Vitellius Triarius"
<lucius_vitellius_triarius@...> wrote:

>
> For the love of God(s), would someone take charge in this

organization

> and straighten it out.

Salve, et salvete omnes,

I will respond to you in full when I dig up some old
stuff [once upon a time, over a decade ago, when I
still identified myself as Eastern Orthodox Christian,
I was part of an ecumenical discussion between the
Greek Orthodox Church, of which I was a minor
representative as a historian of Romano-Byzantine
religion and law, and the Roman Catholic Church -- the
topic was the status of the pope historically -- my
bit was the status of the pontifex maximus
historically]. Let us just say for now that our
"inherited" and mistaken image of the status and role
of what the office of pontifex maximus was in ancient
Rome is largely due to a Roman Catholic academic
hangover created as propaganda by the Vatican Chancery
around the time of Pope Gregory the 7th. Our
historical mirage of what the pontifex maximus was is
of the same stuff as the "Donation of Constantine"
created by the same little group.

The noting that someone was given an office "for life"
in Roman documents means it had never been done
before.
As a legal parallel, Caesar Augustus was given
"proconsular" status for life, and thus, the empire
politically under the military general and "first
citizen" for life. Those given the office of pontifex
maximus for life, before the empire, were a late
exception (hence, noted "for life") to the rule.

But I shall reply fuller with citation of sources.



--- pompeia_minucia_tiberia
<pompeia_minucia_tiberia@...> wrote:

> ---Salve Semproni Regule, Salvete Omnes:
>
> I wanted to crosscheck a couple of things before
> responding to you,
> but I think I can add a bit from a religious and
> historical
> perspective, though, admittedly, I am not as learned
> as a religious
> official in NR. How about armchair historian? :>) :
>
>
> In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "A. Sempronius
> Regulus"
> <a_sempronius_regulus@...> wrote:
> >
> > Salve et salvete omnes,
> >
> > I'll have to look it up (A. Cordus asked me about
> this
> > a year ago) but as I recall until the Principate
> the
> > title of pontifex maximus was as annual
> appointment
> > just like any magistrate in Republican times.
>
> Pompeia: I haven't found any source, really,
> suggesting that a
> Pontifex or Pontifex Maximus appointment was
> anything but a lifetime
> term. Mind you there are periods in the latter
> republic where there
> were elections of these positions. It was
> mentioned in 212 BC, but
> that's about all I know about that.(Livy) Actually
> documented, and
> easily referenced is the Lex Domitia in 104 BCE,
> where members of the
> College of Pontiffs (and maybe augurs, but
> definitely Pontifices)
> were elected by comitia members, but again, nothing
> said about a
> change in length of term. This Lex was abolished by
> the dictator
> Sulla in the Lex Cornelia de Sacedotes. After
> Sulla's departure,
> a 'modified' form of the Lex Domitia was passed
> whereby the College
> of Pontiffs would select a couple of candidates for
> a pontifical
> vacancy, and comitia would select whom the thought
> was the more
> suitable candidate. Julius Caesar was elected
> Pontifex Maximus.
> Apparently, this method of CP membership selection
> might have
> continued until Marcus Antonius canned it after the
> death of Julius
> Caesar.
>
>
> In fact,
> > sometimes more than one pontifex maximus was
> appointed
> > if I remember correctly. Off the top of my head, a
> > second pontifex maximus was appointed one year
> when
> > Julius Caesar also held the office but he was off
> > fighting the Gauls and too busy to carry out the
> > pontifical duties. Anyway, I'll look for the
> sources.
>
>
> Pompeia: Interesting. I look forward to reading
> them. Didn't know
> that, to be honest. I do know that the Pontifex
> Maximus could hold
> civil magistracies, and history shows that this was
> frequently the
> case, but the PM could not leave Italy. Julius
> Caesar did just that
> in going off to Gaul...he was in violation of his
> religious
> obligations. But....Julius did alot of things :>)
> There was a
> Pontifex Maximus, Lucinius Crassus who violated the
> same covenant,145
> BCE, prior to Caesar's doing so.
>
> > But again, off the top of my head, while flamens
> were
> > life time appointments, the pontifex maximus was
> an
> > annual one. And actually, in order of religious
> > authority, the three flamen maiores and flamen
> minores
> > ranked higher in the college of pontiffs than the
> > pontifex maximus who was originally the
> "go-between"
> > (sort of a first secretary, also responsible for
> the
> > calendar (hence somewhat politically powerful) and
> > Vestals) first between the college of pontiffs and
> the
> > Regia, and later, the college of pontiffs and the
> > Senate.
>
> Pompeia: From anything I've read, which
> crossreferences primary
> sources (Dio, Livius, Cicero and I think once I read
> of Appian) the
> Pontiffs, including the CP were the supreme
> authority over all public
> religious practices, including rituals; they would
> regulate the
> calendar, issue responsa when asked, Decretum
> Pontificium when it was
> felt such were needed to maintain the Pax Deorum.
> They had authority
> over other priestly practices, including Flamens.
> The Vestals were
> the charge of the Pontifex Maximus. Additionally,
> the Pontifex
> Maximus kept a yearly annal of religious activity
> for a given year.
> It is said Pontifices derive their power from Numa,
> and serve as the
> Bridge between the divine and the people for the
> maintainence of the
> Pax Deorum. Although the Pontifex Maximus was not
> always included in
> the total tally of Pontiffs, he was, from what I can
> see, considered
> a Pontiff, having atleast the same priestly
> authority, with some
> additional duties.
>
> The Rex Sacrorum seems more of a ceremonial position
> than the
> Pontifex Maximus, although considered an important
> honourary
> representative of the Kings (I think I have that
> right).
>
> Now at one point a lex passed (sometime post Sulla)
> called the Lex
> Ovinia Tribunicia, which conferred a Senate seat
> upon the Flamen
> Dialis and the Pontifex Maximus, but I do not
> believe that the lex
> gave this Flamen any special authority over the
> Pontifex Maximus. I
> don't see where it legally could anyway. The
> purpose of the lex was
> to guide the Censors in their selection of Senators,
> which happened
> to include the above religious personnal.
>
> Valete
> Pompeia
>
>
> >
> >
> > --- "David Kling (Modianus)"
> > <tau.athanasios@...> wrote:
> >
> > > Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus L. Vitellio Trairio
> > > salutem dicit
> > >
> > > I'll do the best I can to answer your questions
> from
> > > my perspective.
> > >
> > > 1) Where are the financial reports for the last
> 15
> > > quarters, and WHY
> > > are not they not posted in the Aerarium Saturni?
> > > GFBM: I don't know, but they should be there.
> I
> > > believe that if Patricia
> > > Cassia cannot do the job any longer then she
> should
> > > step down. I think we
> > > need two Quaestors, elected to two year terms
> like
> > > the censors, who manage
> > > the finances of Nova Roma. I think our current
> > > system is flawed. Nova Roma
> > > is much more than what it was when it was
> founded,
> > > and those apron strings
> > > need to be cut and the magistrates allowed to be
> > > responsible for our funds.
> > >
> > >
> > > 2) What expenses does this organization have
> besides
> > > the website,
> > > because you really get nothing for your money,
> other
> > > than a title, and
> > > sometimes you don't even get that?
> > >
> > > GFBM: There are efforts for a scholarship fund,
> > > among other things. There
> > > are things that can be done, unfortunately such
> > > things are not being
> > > accomplished. We were supposed to have a
> newsletter
> > > this year, but we don't
> > > because the magistrate responsible has not done
> it.
> > >
> > > 3) What happens to the surplus money at the end
> of
> > > the year, we being
> > > a non-profit organization?
> > >
> > > GFBM: It stays in the bank.
> > >
> > > 4) Is this an international organization or a
> > > private venture of the
> > > Cassia?
> > >
> > > GFBM: I sometimes wonder the same question. It
> is
> > > time for the Cassia to
> > > "retire" with dignity. Marcus Cassius Julianus
> only
> > > comes out of hiding
> > > when his "title" is threatened. Otherwise he
> > > prevents any real progress
> > > within the Religio side of Nova Roma.
> > >
> > > 5) Why does this organization not operate like
> 99.9%
> > > of the other
> > > non-profit, social, historical, etc.
> organizations
> > > and pass the
> > > blasted checkbook, or at least access to it, to
> the
> > > elected financial
> > > people in the organization?
> > >
> > > GFBM: GOOD QUESTION! My belief is it is
> because of
> > > power. Those who
> > > control the check book have some semblence of
> power,
> > > even if its not in the
> > > constitution or within our laws.
> > >
> > > 6) Why is the surplus money collected not
> > > reallocated to the provinces
> > > to use for recruitment, events, etc., where the
> real
> > > growth of the
> > > organization will
> be...maybe...someday...probably
> > > not in our lifetime?
> > >
> > > GFBM: That is an option. Its never been
> presented
> > > to the senate, and no
> > > governor has asked.
> > >
> > > 7) How much of the organizations money is placed
> > > into noble, but
> > > unrealistic projects like the Magna Mater
> project (a
> > > project which in
> > > reality would require hundreds of thousands of
> > > dollars, if not
> > > millions, to be regarded as a successful
> venture)?
> > >
> > > GFBM: Most of the money generated by the Magna
> > > Mater project is donated
> > > specifically to the project.
> > >
> > > 8) Why does everything have to go to Wells,
> Maine;
> > > many corporations
> > > have administrative centers separate from the
> > > corporate headquarters?
> > >
> > > GFBM: Good question. See above.
> > >
> > > 9) Why do so few people in this organization
> fail to
> > > see that there is
> > > a stagnation that seems to runs off good
> potential
> > > leaders every time
> > > the opportunity presents itself, especially when
> new
> > > ideas are
> > > presented that "challenge" the "old ways"?
> Whether
> > > it is the Ancient
> > > Roman government or Nova Roma, the organization
> must
> > > be run like a
> > > business, not a private, disorganized social
> club on
> > > the west side of
> > > town?
> > >
> > > GFBM: I know there is a stagnation, and have
> been
> > > advocating against it for
> > > years. I think we need a new Pontifex Maximus
> who
> > > will end the deadlock in
> > > the Collegium Ponficium. That would be a start.
> > >
> > > 10) why do some people in leadership positions
> not
> > > understand that if
> > > an organzation is to grow and flourish, the life
> > > blood of the
> > > organization is its current and future members,
> not
> > > its founder and
> > > original members, who in many cases are never
> heard
> > > from?
> > >
> > > GFBM: You are preaching to the choir on this
> one, I
> > > understand and agree
> > > with you.
> > >
> > > Vale:
> > >
> > > Gaius Fabius Buteo Modianus
> > > Censor, Consular, Pontifex, et al.
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
> > > removed]
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > A. Sempronius Regulus
> >
> > America Austrorientalis
> >
> >
> > Vincit qui se vincit. - Seneca
> > Vivere disce, cogita mori. - Cicero
> > Ubi spiritus est cantus est. - Sempronius
> Atratinus
> >
> > ANNI MMDCCLX AVC (anno urbis conditae - a.u.c.)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

______________________________________________________________________

> ______________Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's
>
> > Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.
> > http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/222
> >
>
>
>

A. Sempronius Regulus

America Austrorientalis


Vincit qui se vincit. - Seneca
Vivere disce, cogita mori. - Cicero
Ubi spiritus est cantus est. - Sempronius Atratinus

ANNI MMDCCLX AVC (anno urbis conditae - a.u.c.)






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