Salve Lucia Livia,

>> VI. that the People act in good faith toward each other, with honour and integrity as befits us as Romans.
>
> I wish! There are some people here who definitely are in bad faith: they take this
> all as a role-playing game, where they can have fun observing the effects of blatant manipulation.

I find it amusing that "role-playing game" has now become the generic insult du jour in
Nova Roma, used by people who have not the slightest idea what the words actually mean.

As coined by the late Messrs. Gygax and Arneson, a role-playing game is one in which
participants take on the names and attributes of fictional characters, essentially
becoming actors in an impromptu play.

"I, Belkar Bitterleaf, am an eighth-level chaotic evil halfing ranger!".

"I, Varsuuvius of the Elves, wield supreme arcane power! Prismatic Sphere!"

Pray tell, how do the actions of Cato have anything to do with that?

Is he claiming to be a wizard? A druid, perhaps? Where's his Vorpal Sword +5?

Meanwhile, you have people called "praetores" who issue "edicts" and accuse someone
of treason, a capital crime.

Where are the accusations of "role-playing" when a "praetor" accuses a mailing list
participant of a crime that traditionally carries the death penalty?

What bogus accusation is next - rape? arson? murder? That's what the "anything
the praetores say is true and honourable, everything else is role-playing" mentality
will inevitably lead to.

Is it "role-playing" when someone talks to a real-world attorney? Because that's
all that any of the people you condemn against has done.

Please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.

M. Octavius Gracchus,
who has no idea how many hit points he has.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

Salve Octavi,
OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the effects and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by dictatorships and/or terrorist organizations".

Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?

Vale,
Livia

>
>
> Salve Lucia Livia,
>
> >> VI. that the People act in good faith toward each other, with honour and integrity as befits us as Romans.
> >
> > I wish! There are some people here who definitely are in bad faith: they take this
> > all as a role-playing game, where they can have fun observing the effects of blatant manipulation.
>
> I find it amusing that "role-playing game" has now become the generic insult du jour in
> Nova Roma, used by people who have not the slightest idea what the words actually mean.
>
> As coined by the late Messrs. Gygax and Arneson, a role-playing game is one in which
> participants take on the names and attributes of fictional characters, essentially
> becoming actors in an impromptu play.
>
> "I, Belkar Bitterleaf, am an eighth-level chaotic evil halfing ranger!".
>
> "I, Varsuuvius of the Elves, wield supreme arcane power! Prismatic Sphere!"
>
> Pray tell, how do the actions of Cato have anything to do with that?
>
> Is he claiming to be a wizard? A druid, perhaps? Where's his Vorpal Sword +5?
>
> Meanwhile, you have people called "praetores" who issue "edicts" and accuse someone
> of treason, a capital crime.
>
> Where are the accusations of "role-playing" when a "praetor" accuses a mailing list
> participant of a crime that traditionally carries the death penalty?
>
> What bogus accusation is next - rape? arson? murder? That's what the "anything
> the praetores say is true and honourable, everything else is role-playing" mentality
> will inevitably lead to.
>
> Is it "role-playing" when someone talks to a real-world attorney? Because that's
> all that any of the people you condemn against has done.
>
> Please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.
>
> M. Octavius Gracchus,
> who has no idea how many hit points he has.
>
> --
> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
>

> OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the effects and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by dictatorships and/or terrorist organizations".
>
> Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?

I won't, because your characterization of Cato and Caesar and Sulla's efforts is laughable.

Dictatorships? Terrorists?

THEY TALKED TO LAWYERS.

That's all. They talked to lawyers.

They have expressed an opinion that the solicitation of funds for "restoration"
of a template that can never be actually rebuilt may expose this corporation to
legal liability. You don't share that opinion; fine. I myself am undecided
on that issue.

But you, and some others here, slap hyberbolic labels on any disagreement.

Treason. Role-playing game. Propaganda.

You really need to get some perspective.

It's your side that's accusing people of a capital crime. Not Cato and his allies.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

Perhaps if that term were accurate, but unfortunately, it's not. You'd be
instantly laughed off as a crackpot if you tried to compare someone who was
suing an organization for violation of his rights to Saddam Hussein or
Hezbollah.

I think your statement effectively destroyed any ounce of credibility you
might have had left.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 4:25 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> Salve Octavi,
> OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the
> expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the effects
> and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by dictatorships
> and/or terrorist organizations".
>
> Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?
>
> Vale,
> Livia
>
>>
>>
>> Salve Lucia Livia,
>>
>> >> VI. that the People act in good faith toward each other, with honour
>> >> and integrity as befits us as Romans.
>> >
>> > I wish! There are some people here who definitely are in bad faith:
>> > they take this
>> > all as a role-playing game, where they can have fun observing the
>> > effects of blatant manipulation.
>>
>> I find it amusing that "role-playing game" has now become the generic
>> insult du jour in
>> Nova Roma, used by people who have not the slightest idea what the words
>> actually mean.
>>
>> As coined by the late Messrs. Gygax and Arneson, a role-playing game is
>> one in which
>> participants take on the names and attributes of fictional characters,
>> essentially
>> becoming actors in an impromptu play.
>>
>> "I, Belkar Bitterleaf, am an eighth-level chaotic evil halfing ranger!".
>>
>> "I, Varsuuvius of the Elves, wield supreme arcane power! Prismatic
>> Sphere!"
>>
>> Pray tell, how do the actions of Cato have anything to do with that?
>>
>> Is he claiming to be a wizard? A druid, perhaps? Where's his Vorpal
>> Sword +5?
>>
>> Meanwhile, you have people called "praetores" who issue "edicts" and
>> accuse someone
>> of treason, a capital crime.
>>
>> Where are the accusations of "role-playing" when a "praetor" accuses a
>> mailing list
>> participant of a crime that traditionally carries the death penalty?
>>
>> What bogus accusation is next - rape? arson? murder? That's what the
>> "anything
>> the praetores say is true and honourable, everything else is
>> role-playing" mentality
>> will inevitably lead to.
>>
>> Is it "role-playing" when someone talks to a real-world attorney?
>> Because that's
>> all that any of the people you condemn against has done.
>>
>> Please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.
>>
>> M. Octavius Gracchus,
>> who has no idea how many hit points he has.
>>
>> --
>> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
>> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
>> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
>>
>
>
>

> OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I

will use the expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the effects and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by dictatorships and/or terrorist organizations".

>
> Could you please

come up with a suitable abbreviation?

I won't, because your characterization of Cato and Caesar and Sulla's efforts is laughable.

Dictatorships?  Terrorists?

THEY TALKED TO LAWYERS.

That's all.  They talked to lawyers.

They have expressed an opinion that the solicitation of funds for "restoration"
of a template that can never be actually rebuilt may expose this corporation to
legal liability.  You don't share that opinion; fine.  I myself am undecided
on that issue.

But you, and some others here, slap hyberbolic labels on any disagreement.

Treason.  Role-playing game.  Propaganda.

You really need to get some perspective.

It's your side that's accusing people of a capital crime.  Not Cato and his allies.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/


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Salve Octavi,

They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma. I have no doubt that in the US. legal system (land of trivial lawsuits) if you really want to sue somebody you will find a way to. This still does not mean that all U.S. citizens are breaking the law.

Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents. These are the same techniques used in totalitarian states, and also by terrorists such as fundamentalist muslims.
I'm not calling anyone terrorist, I think the game here is to reproduce the real-life mechanisms in a virtual community. Kind of like one of those neat little computer programs that can simulate life and evolution.
Personally, I think at least Sulla takes all this as a very fun game, and wants to see exactly how much he is able to manipulate our community into discord and inefficiency. I'm not sure of the motives of some of the others, but by now I'm past assuming good faith.

If any of you really cared about the welfare of NR and had found some legal issues that could give raise to worries, you would have discussed them in a civil way.
No, this game is all about vendetta and retaliation. For some the wish for revenge was caused by being excluded from some mailing lists after trolling (Sulla), for others by having their resignation taken seriously (Cato), for others again it was caused by seeing their friends partially banned in virtue of a law (lex Salicia) that some other friends of theirs had made.

They took all this resentment for matters that essentially concern access or not to certain mailing lists, and turned it into a game of real-life lawsuits. Now who's exaggerating?

Optime vale,
Livia

>
>
> > OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the effects and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by dictatorships and/or terrorist organizations".
> >
> > Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?
>
> I won't, because your characterization of Cato and Caesar and Sulla's efforts is laughable.
>
> Dictatorships? Terrorists?
>
> THEY TALKED TO LAWYERS.
>
> That's all. They talked to lawyers.
>
> They have expressed an opinion that the solicitation of funds for "restoration"
> of a template that can never be actually rebuilt may expose this corporation to
> legal liability. You don't share that opinion; fine. I myself am undecided
> on that issue.
>
> But you, and some others here, slap hyberbolic labels on any disagreement.
>
> Treason. Role-playing game. Propaganda.
>
> You really need to get some perspective.
>
> It's your side that's accusing people of a capital crime. Not Cato and his allies.
>
> --
> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
>

More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was illegally
removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
lawyer.

"access or not to certain mailing lists"

When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been illegally
blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like it if
we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma after
having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?

I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going to call
you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:18 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> Salve Octavi,
>
> They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
> trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma. I have no doubt that in the
> US. legal system (land of trivial lawsuits) if you really want to sue
> somebody you will find a way to. This still does not mean that all U.S.
> citizens are breaking the law.
>
> Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of
> repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up
> charges against their political opponents. These are the same techniques
> used in totalitarian states, and also by terrorists such as fundamentalist
> muslims.
> I'm not calling anyone terrorist, I think the game here is to reproduce
> the real-life mechanisms in a virtual community. Kind of like one of those
> neat little computer programs that can simulate life and evolution.
> Personally, I think at least Sulla takes all this as a very fun game, and
> wants to see exactly how much he is able to manipulate our community into
> discord and inefficiency. I'm not sure of the motives of some of the
> others, but by now I'm past assuming good faith.
>
> If any of you really cared about the welfare of NR and had found some
> legal issues that could give raise to worries, you would have discussed
> them in a civil way.
> No, this game is all about vendetta and retaliation. For some the wish for
> revenge was caused by being excluded from some mailing lists after
> trolling (Sulla), for others by having their resignation taken seriously
> (Cato), for others again it was caused by seeing their friends partially
> banned in virtue of a law (lex Salicia) that some other friends of theirs
> had made.
>
> They took all this resentment for matters that essentially concern access
> or not to certain mailing lists, and turned it into a game of real-life
> lawsuits. Now who's exaggerating?
>
> Optime vale,
> Livia
>
>
>>
>>
>> > OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the
>> > expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the
>> > effects and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by
>> > dictatorships and/or terrorist organizations".
>> >
>> > Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?
>>
>> I won't, because your characterization of Cato and Caesar and Sulla's
>> efforts is laughable.
>>
>> Dictatorships? Terrorists?
>>
>> THEY TALKED TO LAWYERS.
>>
>> That's all. They talked to lawyers.
>>
>> They have expressed an opinion that the solicitation of funds for
>> "restoration"
>> of a template that can never be actually rebuilt may expose this
>> corporation to
>> legal liability. You don't share that opinion; fine. I myself am
>> undecided
>> on that issue.
>>
>> But you, and some others here, slap hyberbolic labels on any
>> disagreement.
>>
>> Treason. Role-playing game. Propaganda.
>>
>> You really need to get some perspective.
>>
>> It's your side that's accusing people of a capital crime. Not Cato and
>> his allies.
>>
>> --
>> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
>> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
>> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
>>
>
>
>

> They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
> trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma.

"Trumped-up", in your opinion.

> Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of
> repeating lies

"Lies." You really have no respect for people whose opinions differ from
yours at all, do you?

Someone disagrees with you, therefore they're repeating "lies", and they're
using the tactics of dictators.

You really can't conceive of the possibility that someone might honestly
have a different perspective.

How sad.

Vale, Octavius.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

Salve Regule,
I don't know anyone making reproductions of roman altars, but this is the occasion to mention an observation I made in Pompeii regarding their architecture.
Some time ago on the religio list Piscinus mentioned that he believed some turf was placed on top of marble altars before using them for sacrifices, because usually no burn signs are visible.

It would be impossible to light fires directly on the marble, because it is very sensitive to temperature variations and it would crack.
Usually altars have the reproduction of a pillow on top, rolled up iat the two sides, and the surface in the centre is rough, sometimes with a small hole in the middle.

Well, in Pompeii, where the altars were left in the state they were when in use, I found out that there was something on top of them, but not turf. The altar of Juppiter had some flat black lava stones inset on its top, filling exactly the space between the two pillow rolls, and smooth on top.
Some other altars instead had big, specially shaped ceramic tiles on top.

For your altar, I suggest asking any stone-mason and giving them a photo to base on.

Optime vale,
Livia

>
> Salvete omnes,
>  
> As I posted a few years ago, I'm constructing a small cella out of a mixture
> of torn-down mausoleums and old houses with columns to make way for
> sub-divisions (the building trade does not seem dead in Tennessee). The
> cella will be placed within a templum. However, I am short one Roman altar
> to place outside the cella but within the templum.
>  
> Does anyone in Nova Roma make reproduction Roman altars?
>  
> Thanks in advance, if you do, contact me off-list unless you think it will
> be of general interest -- and making one a member of the equestrian order.
>  
> Valete,
> A. Sempronius Regulus
>

Poplicola Potito fratri suo SPD

No, that would be a violation of her rights. However, she is in violation of
the Edictum de sermone, which means she could be brought to court via the
Leges Saliciae.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Steve Moore" <astrobear@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:30 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>; <BackAlley@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [BackAlley] Place Plauta on Moderation

> I ask that the praetors and their scribes enforce their new edict and
> place
> Livia Plauta on moderation for her rude and uncivil behavior. She has
> displayed bad behavior in disparaging the US and all its citizens on
> several
> occasions.
>
>
>
> M. Valerius Potitus
>
>

Salve Poplicola,
you have failed to prove that I'm lying, so you are lying yourself.

>
> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was illegally
> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
> lawyer.
>

He was removed for the senate list for trolling. The obvious solution was to stop trolling.

> "access or not to certain mailing lists"
>
> When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been illegally
> blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like it if
> we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma after
> having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?
>

I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making it work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until I'm in some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends).

> I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going to call
> you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.
>

You really seem to have problems understanding plain English, sometimes.
I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a simulation game.
Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to try out the same strategies on an internet community.

Vale,
Livia

Salve Octavi,

>
> You really can't conceive of the possibility that someone might honestly
> have a different perspective.
>

I can, and I do. I always assume the best intentions from everybody. It is only after repeated disillusionment that I have to assume bad faith. Even now, I'm sure only a minority of the people in the BA are really in bad faith. Others are just deceived.

Vale,
Livia

Salve Livia,

> I can, and I do. I always assume the best intentions from everybody.

I believe that everyone involved in this dispute, on either side,
honestly believes themselves and their allies to be in the right.

Even you.

Having read Cato's messages, sometimes arguing against him, I am
utterly confident that he is acting in good faith.

Calling people liars over a difference of opinion is inflammatory
and unacceptable.

We do you the courtesy of acknowledging that you truly believe what
you're writing, no matter how much that differs from our perspective.
Will you not do the same?

Enough with this "toll" and "liar" and "traitor" nonsense.

Vale, Octavius.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

I'm sorry, but you're still wrong.

First, "failing to prove that you lied" does not make me a liar. But, I
have shown and will show again how you're being deceptive, aka lying.

> They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
> trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma.

This is so clearly not true. It doesn't even make sense it's so untrue.
Perhaps you are ignorant that lawyers cost money (even if just to see if a
lawsuit is possible). The only sane action that anybody, except apparently
you, would take is to seek redress via a lawyer after an action is
committed. And quite clearly, that is what happened. The lawyer call
happened after Modianus removed Sulla. To deny that is a clear mark of
trolling.

Furthermore, Modianus did not have the legal authority from Nova Roma or
elsewhere to remove Sulla, regardless of his so-called "trolling".

" I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making it
work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until I'm in
some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends)."

Yes, ranting and raving while foaming at the mouth on how evil people who
disagree with you, how they're terrorists and dictators, is certainly
"helpful". Bravo. Bravo.

"> You really seem to have problems understanding plain English, sometimes.

> I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
> using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
> simulation game.
> Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
> try out the same strategies on an internet community."

Yes! The non-native English speaker thinks I have something wrong with my
native tongue! Classic! You compared their tactics to dictators and
terrorists, if you have no idea what metaphor entails, you should not be
speaking at all.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:51 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> Salve Poplicola,
> you have failed to prove that I'm lying, so you are lying yourself.
>>
>> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was illegally
>> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
>> lawyer.
>>
> He was removed for the senate list for trolling. The obvious solution was
> to stop trolling.
>
>> "access or not to certain mailing lists"
>>
>> When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been illegally
>> blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like it if
>> we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma after
>> having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?
>>
> I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
> nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making
> it work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until
> I'm in some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends).
>
>> I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going to
>> call
>> you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.
>>
> You really seem to have problems understanding plain English, sometimes.
> I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
> using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
> simulation game.
> Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
> try out the same strategies on an internet community.
>
> Vale,
> Livia
>
>
>

Salve,   As a professional in Indo-European Studies, I can say that turf (grass) placed on the altars (always, ALWAYS THREE, I have posted on this previously (search the archives) is totally correct. It may be only a small mound of turf within which incense and charcoal were nourished (nourished, that's the point) while wine, blood, animal parts were placed within. In Vedic India, the three fires were within immediate proximity (although no rule said they needed to be so -- just that they need to be within the sacred space plowed out in advance), Rome has sacred trenches by its mythical founders. The description of what was done matches the Vedic description of a sacrifice site. The first fire, the Vestal one, was inside the city. The second fire, guarding against demons or ill-influence, the Vulcanus has its Vedic counterpart. The third fire, the sacrificial fire, was the immediate one used at location. BTW, in both Vedic and Roman sources the geometric shape of these fires are identical. And at the deepest stratum of the Roman Forum (forgive, I can't remember, southeast or southwest), the three fire plan EXACTLY matches the physical layout of a Vedic fire sacrifice. But yes, a hollowing serving a turf liner.   Vale, A. Sempronius Regulus --- On Sun, 4/26/09, livia_plauta <livia.plauta@...> wrote: From: livia_plauta <livia.plauta@...> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, April 26, 2009, 10:40 PM Salve Regule, I don't know anyone making reproductions of roman altars, but this is the occasion to mention an observation I made in Pompeii regarding their architecture. Some time ago on the religio list Piscinus mentioned that he believed some turf was placed on top of marble altars before using them for sacrifices, because usually no burn signs are visible. It would be impossible to light fires directly on the marble, because it is very sensitive to temperature variations and it would crack. Usually altars have the reproduction of a pillow on top, rolled up iat the two sides, and the surface in the centre is rough, sometimes with a small hole in the middle. Well, in Pompeii, where the altars were left in the state they were when in use, I found out that there was something on top of them, but not turf. The altar of Juppiter had some flat black lava stones inset on its top, filling exactly the space between the two pillow rolls, and smooth on top. Some other altars instead had big, specially shaped ceramic tiles on top. For your altar, I suggest asking any stone-mason and giving them a photo to base on. Optime vale, Livia > > Salvete omnes, >   > As I posted a few years ago, I'm constructing a small cella out of a mixture > of torn-down mausoleums and old houses with columns to make way for > sub-divisions (the building trade does not seem dead in Tennessee). The > cella will be placed within a templum. However, I am short one Roman altar > to place outside the cella but within the templum. >   > Does anyone in Nova Roma make reproduction Roman altars? >   > Thanks in advance, if you do, contact me off-list unless you think it will > be of general interest -- and making one a member of the equestrian order. >   > Valete, > A. Sempronius Regulus >

Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to the gods -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is the consensus of modern academic research. --- On Sun, 4/26/09, livia_plauta <livia.plauta@...> wrote: From: livia_plauta <livia.plauta@...> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, April 26, 2009, 10:40 PM Salve Regule, I don't know anyone making reproductions of roman altars, but this is the occasion to mention an observation I made in Pompeii regarding their architecture. Some time ago on the religio list Piscinus mentioned that he believed some turf was placed on top of marble altars before using them for sacrifices, because usually no burn signs are visible. It would be impossible to light fires directly on the marble, because it is very sensitive to temperature variations and it would crack. Usually altars have the reproduction of a pillow on top, rolled up iat the two sides, and the surface in the centre is rough, sometimes with a small hole in the middle. Well, in Pompeii, where the altars were left in the state they were when in use, I found out that there was something on top of them, but not turf. The altar of Juppiter had some flat black lava stones inset on its top, filling exactly the space between the two pillow rolls, and smooth on top. Some other altars instead had big, specially shaped ceramic tiles on top. For your altar, I suggest asking any stone-mason and giving them a photo to base on. Optime vale, Livia > > Salvete omnes, >   > As I posted a few years ago, I'm constructing a small cella out of a mixture > of torn-down mausoleums and old houses with columns to make way for > sub-divisions (the building trade does not seem dead in Tennessee). The > cella will be placed within a templum. However, I am short one Roman altar > to place outside the cella but within the templum. >   > Does anyone in Nova Roma make reproduction Roman altars? >   > Thanks in advance, if you do, contact me off-list unless you think it will > be of general interest -- and making one a member of the equestrian order. >   > Valete, > A. Sempronius Regulus >

Cato Liviae Plautae sal.

Salve!

First of all, "trolling" is not an actionable offense that justifies removal from the Senate List; no matter what you think of Sulla's comments, he has the right to make them

Second - how would you know what Sulla said in the Senate? Do you have access to the Senate List? If not, has someone broken the seal of the Senate to copy his messages there to you?

Third, you write this clearly demonstrable lie:

"For some the wish for revenge was caused ... for others by having their resignation taken seriously (Cato)"

This is not just incorrect, but intentionally malicious. If you remember correctly, as soon as the question arose as to my status I, acting willingly and publicly, removed MYSELF from the senate List until the matter was decided.

Third, I see that you (and the consuls, and the praetors) completely ignored my response to Caecilius Metellus' words, yet still attempt to paint me as a villain - a dictator and terrorist, in fact.

You label me a terrorist? I was at the World Trade Center in NYC on the morning of the 11th of September 2001; I *watched* the plane hit the South Tower and explode; I was among the thousands of New Yorkers who ran terrified through the streets of Lower Manhattan while buildings were collapsing; I walked on foot across the Brooklyn Bridge covered in the ashes of the thousands who were murdered by terrorist acts. To label me a terrorist is unspeakable. You vile creature.

Vale,

Cato

Cato praetores SPD

Salvete.

I will not request that Livia Plauta be placed on moderation for having labeled me the equivalent of a terrorist because no matter how hideous and cruel her words may be, I believe she has the right to speak them. They can only reveal the kind of twisted mentality with which she approaches her fellow-citizens, and she should be judged by the People for them.

This is almost indescribably unacceptable, and I take her comment personally in the most cruel and horrific way.

Valete,

Cato

Pr. Memmius omnibus s.d.

As some of our cives had followed with interest L. Cornelius Sulla Felix' moderation status, I have the pleasure confirming that Cornelius has ended his new member 2 months moderation period and may thus post in our forum according ordinary "groups settings" rules.

On the current topics, please contact, if necessary, my collega Marinus during the eight next hours.

Thanks.


Valete omnes,


P. Memmius Albucius

Indeed, it is an occasion to celebrate - so rare and wondrous it is that a
person who joined 01 March 1998 is no longer considered a "new member".

Vale, Octavius.

> Pr. Memmius omnibus s.d.
>
> As some of our cives had followed with interest L. Cornelius Sulla Felix' moderation status, I have the pleasure confirming that Cornelius has ended his new member 2 months moderation period and may thus post in our forum according ordinary "groups settings" rules.
>
> On the current topics, please contact, if necessary, my collega Marinus during the eight next hours.
>

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

Salvete;
guess what; there are other cives with interests who'd like their voices heard. The free speech that many advocate here, means having their friends hog the ML with partisan politics.
You know what. i'm sick of it; and from the resounding silence, I think others are too.
Marca Hortensia Maior


- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Matt Hucke <hucke@...> wrote:

>
>
> Indeed, it is an occasion to celebrate - so rare and wondrous it is that a
> person who joined 01 March 1998 is no longer considered a "new member".
>
> Vale, Octavius.
>
> > Pr. Memmius omnibus s.d.
> >
> > As some of our cives had followed with interest L. Cornelius Sulla Felix' moderation status, I have the pleasure confirming that Cornelius has ended his new member 2 months moderation period and may thus post in our forum according ordinary "groups settings" rules.
> >
> > On the current topics, please contact, if necessary, my collega Marinus during the eight next hours.
> >
>
> --
> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
>

Cato Maiori sal.

Salve.

Well, Maior, unless their posts are deleted (as mine was) or they are placed on moderation without notice or cause (as I was), then any citizen can speak freely here.

Vale,

Cato

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Maior" <rory12001@...> wrote:
>
> Salvete;
> guess what; there are other cives with interests who'd like their voices heard. The free speech that many advocate here, means having their friends hog the ML with partisan politics.
> You know what. i'm sick of it; and from the resounding silence, I think others are too.
> Marca Hortensia Maior
>
>
> - In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Matt Hucke <hucke@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Indeed, it is an occasion to celebrate - so rare and wondrous it is that a
> > person who joined 01 March 1998 is no longer considered a "new member".
> >
> > Vale, Octavius.
> >
> > > Pr. Memmius omnibus s.d.
> > >
> > > As some of our cives had followed with interest L. Cornelius Sulla Felix' moderation status, I have the pleasure confirming that Cornelius has ended his new member 2 months moderation period and may thus post in our forum according ordinary "groups settings" rules.
> > >
> > > On the current topics, please contact, if necessary, my collega Marinus during the eight next hours.
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Matt Hucke (hucke@), programmer.
> > author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
> > CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
> >
>

Fascinating Regule;
so wed need these 3 fires in Rome?
valeas
Maior


-- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "A. Sempronius Regulus" <asempronius.regulus@...> wrote:

>
> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to the gods -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is the consensus of modern academic research.
>
> --- On Sun, 4/26/09, livia_plauta <livia.plauta@...> wrote:
>
>
> From: livia_plauta <livia.plauta@...>
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Sunday, April 26, 2009, 10:40 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Salve Regule,
> I don't know anyone making reproductions of roman altars, but this is the occasion to mention an observation I made in Pompeii regarding their architecture.
> Some time ago on the religio list Piscinus mentioned that he believed some turf was placed on top of marble altars before using them for sacrifices, because usually no burn signs are visible.
>
> It would be impossible to light fires directly on the marble, because it is very sensitive to temperature variations and it would crack.
> Usually altars have the reproduction of a pillow on top, rolled up iat the two sides, and the surface in the centre is rough, sometimes with a small hole in the middle.
>
> Well, in Pompeii, where the altars were left in the state they were when in use, I found out that there was something on top of them, but not turf. The altar of Juppiter had some flat black lava stones inset on its top, filling exactly the space between the two pillow rolls, and smooth on top.
> Some other altars instead had big, specially shaped ceramic tiles on top.
>
> For your altar, I suggest asking any stone-mason and giving them a photo to base on.
>
> Optime vale,
> Livia
>
> >
> > Salvete omnes,
> >
> > As I posted a few years ago, I'm constructing a small cella out of a mixture
> > of torn-down mausoleums and old houses with columns to make way for
> > sub-divisions (the building trade does not seem dead in Tennessee). The
> > cella will be placed within a templum. However, I am short one Roman altar
> > to place outside the cella but within the templum.
> >
> > Does anyone in Nova Roma make reproduction Roman altars?
> >
> > Thanks in advance, if you do, contact me off-list unless you think it will
> > be of general interest -- and making one a member of the equestrian order.
> >
> > Valete,
> > A. Sempronius Regulus
> >
>

actually we're all here aware of the faux dramas enacted & Livia Plauta is respected not only for real life activities, not that I see many from the BA crowd but her thoughtful replies.

Now as for you Poplicola;

are you calling Equestria Laeca, NR's Chief Financial Officer and macro world financial analyst and accountant a liar when she says Nova Roma, Inc is fiscally and legally fine, compliant with the necessary state and federal agencies that govern non-profits?

Marca Hortensia Maior



-- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola" <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote:

>
> Perhaps if that term were accurate, but unfortunately, it's not. You'd be
> instantly laughed off as a crackpot if you tried to compare someone who was
> suing an organization for violation of his rights to Saddam Hussein or
> Hezbollah.
>
> I think your statement effectively destroyed any ounce of credibility you
> might have had left.
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 4:25 PM
> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
> Publica
>
> > Salve Octavi,
> > OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the
> > expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the effects
> > and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by dictatorships
> > and/or terrorist organizations".
> >
> > Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?
> >
> > Vale,
> > Livia
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> Salve Lucia Livia,
> >>
> >> >> VI. that the People act in good faith toward each other, with honour
> >> >> and integrity as befits us as Romans.
> >> >
> >> > I wish! There are some people here who definitely are in bad faith:
> >> > they take this
> >> > all as a role-playing game, where they can have fun observing the
> >> > effects of blatant manipulation.
> >>
> >> I find it amusing that "role-playing game" has now become the generic
> >> insult du jour in
> >> Nova Roma, used by people who have not the slightest idea what the words
> >> actually mean.
> >>
> >> As coined by the late Messrs. Gygax and Arneson, a role-playing game is
> >> one in which
> >> participants take on the names and attributes of fictional characters,
> >> essentially
> >> becoming actors in an impromptu play.
> >>
> >> "I, Belkar Bitterleaf, am an eighth-level chaotic evil halfing ranger!".
> >>
> >> "I, Varsuuvius of the Elves, wield supreme arcane power! Prismatic
> >> Sphere!"
> >>
> >> Pray tell, how do the actions of Cato have anything to do with that?
> >>
> >> Is he claiming to be a wizard? A druid, perhaps? Where's his Vorpal
> >> Sword +5?
> >>
> >> Meanwhile, you have people called "praetores" who issue "edicts" and
> >> accuse someone
> >> of treason, a capital crime.
> >>
> >> Where are the accusations of "role-playing" when a "praetor" accuses a
> >> mailing list
> >> participant of a crime that traditionally carries the death penalty?
> >>
> >> What bogus accusation is next - rape? arson? murder? That's what the
> >> "anything
> >> the praetores say is true and honourable, everything else is
> >> role-playing" mentality
> >> will inevitably lead to.
> >>
> >> Is it "role-playing" when someone talks to a real-world attorney?
> >> Because that's
> >> all that any of the people you condemn against has done.
> >>
> >> Please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.
> >>
> >> M. Octavius Gracchus,
> >> who has no idea how many hit points he has.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Matt Hucke (hucke@), programmer.
> >> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
> >> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>

No, I'm calling her mistaken. I called Livia a liar for purposefully
misrepresenting events and a hypocrite for asking for peace and then calling
members terrorists.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Maior" <rory12001@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 7:36 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> actually we're all here aware of the faux dramas enacted & Livia Plauta is
> respected not only for real life activities, not that I see many from the
> BA crowd but her thoughtful replies.
>
> Now as for you Poplicola;
>
> are you calling Equestria Laeca, NR's Chief Financial Officer and macro
> world financial analyst and accountant a liar when she says Nova Roma, Inc
> is fiscally and legally fine, compliant with the necessary state and
> federal agencies that govern non-profits?
>
> Marca Hortensia Maior
>
>
>
> -- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola"
> <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote:
>>
>> Perhaps if that term were accurate, but unfortunately, it's not. You'd be
>> instantly laughed off as a crackpot if you tried to compare someone who
>> was
>> suing an organization for violation of his rights to Saddam Hussein or
>> Hezbollah.
>>
>> I think your statement effectively destroyed any ounce of credibility you
>> might have had left.
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
>> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 4:25 PM
>> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
>> Publica
>>
>> > Salve Octavi,
>> > OK. I won't use the term "role-playing" any more. I will use the
>> > expression "trying to model in a virtual and small community the
>> > effects
>> > and workings of propaganda techniques, as typically used by
>> > dictatorships
>> > and/or terrorist organizations".
>> >
>> > Could you please come up with a suitable abbreviation?
>> >
>> > Vale,
>> > Livia
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Salve Lucia Livia,
>> >>
>> >> >> VI. that the People act in good faith toward each other, with
>> >> >> honour
>> >> >> and integrity as befits us as Romans.
>> >> >
>> >> > I wish! There are some people here who definitely are in bad faith:
>> >> > they take this
>> >> > all as a role-playing game, where they can have fun observing the
>> >> > effects of blatant manipulation.
>> >>
>> >> I find it amusing that "role-playing game" has now become the generic
>> >> insult du jour in
>> >> Nova Roma, used by people who have not the slightest idea what the
>> >> words
>> >> actually mean.
>> >>
>> >> As coined by the late Messrs. Gygax and Arneson, a role-playing game
>> >> is
>> >> one in which
>> >> participants take on the names and attributes of fictional characters,
>> >> essentially
>> >> becoming actors in an impromptu play.
>> >>
>> >> "I, Belkar Bitterleaf, am an eighth-level chaotic evil halfing
>> >> ranger!".
>> >>
>> >> "I, Varsuuvius of the Elves, wield supreme arcane power! Prismatic
>> >> Sphere!"
>> >>
>> >> Pray tell, how do the actions of Cato have anything to do with that?
>> >>
>> >> Is he claiming to be a wizard? A druid, perhaps? Where's his Vorpal
>> >> Sword +5?
>> >>
>> >> Meanwhile, you have people called "praetores" who issue "edicts" and
>> >> accuse someone
>> >> of treason, a capital crime.
>> >>
>> >> Where are the accusations of "role-playing" when a "praetor" accuses a
>> >> mailing list
>> >> participant of a crime that traditionally carries the death penalty?
>> >>
>> >> What bogus accusation is next - rape? arson? murder? That's what
>> >> the
>> >> "anything
>> >> the praetores say is true and honourable, everything else is
>> >> role-playing" mentality
>> >> will inevitably lead to.
>> >>
>> >> Is it "role-playing" when someone talks to a real-world attorney?
>> >> Because that's
>> >> all that any of the people you condemn against has done.
>> >>
>> >> Please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.
>> >>
>> >> M. Octavius Gracchus,
>> >> who has no idea how many hit points he has.
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Matt Hucke (hucke@), programmer.
>> >> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
>> >> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 -
>> >> http://cynico.net/
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>

> No, I'm calling her mistaken. I called Livia a liar for purposefully
> misrepresenting events and a hypocrite for asking for peace and then calling
> members terrorists.

I believe that Equestria Iunia has given her honest opinion that Nova Roma's
affairs are in order.

I believe that Cato and Caesar have given their honest opinion that Nova Roma's
affairs are NOT in order.

This is not a contradiction. All of these people are acting in good faith.

Unfortunately, one of these opinions has alarmed the Powers That Be, and they
are seeking to stifle it; hysteria abounds, as do cries of "traitor". This is
abhorrent.

Regardless of who is in the right about the legality of the MM project or in
the matter of calling for the removal of officers, these charges of "treason" -
a capital crime - just because someone has spoken with a lawyer will not be
tolerated. I come to the aid of Cato, not because he is right in his opinions
about NR being in violation of the law, but because they are attempting to
silence him.

Vale, Octavius.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

Ave Rgulus;

On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 6:28 PM, A. Sempronius Regulus wrote:
>
> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to the gods
> -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are
> effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is the
> consensus of modern academic research.
>

Perhaps the fires memory is a little more widespread than you realize.
. .I always have at least 3 flames (candles in a holder made of 3
antlers, 3 lanterns or 3 torches) on or around my altar when I give
worship to the Northern Holy Ones.

It has always seemed the right thing to do, just as I have 3 cups for
hallowed drink: one for the Gods, one for the Spirits of Earth, Wind,
Fire & Water, and a third for the Spirits of my Family line.

Also, before I Offer to the Holy Powers, I will go around the ritual
ara carryng a Flame and offering dink to the Spirits of the Place.

=====================================
In amicitia et fide
Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator
Civis circa Quintilis MMDCCLI a.u.c.

Religio Septentrionalis - Poeta

http://www.myspace.com/venator_poetus
http://anheathenreader.blogspot.com/
http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
http://www.cafepress.com/catamountgrange
--
May the Holy Powers smile on our efforts.
May the Spirits of our family lines nod in approval.
May we be of Worth to our fellow Nova Romans.

Regule, do you buy into Dumezil's tripartite function of IndoEuropean
Religion?

Poplicola

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator" <famila.ulleria.venii@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:00 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars

> Ave Rgulus;
>
> On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 6:28 PM, A. Sempronius Regulus wrote:
>>
>> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to the
>> gods
>> -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are
>> effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is the
>> consensus of modern academic research.
>>
>
> Perhaps the fires memory is a little more widespread than you realize.
> . .I always have at least 3 flames (candles in a holder made of 3
> antlers, 3 lanterns or 3 torches) on or around my altar when I give
> worship to the Northern Holy Ones.
>
> It has always seemed the right thing to do, just as I have 3 cups for
> hallowed drink: one for the Gods, one for the Spirits of Earth, Wind,
> Fire & Water, and a third for the Spirits of my Family line.
>
> Also, before I Offer to the Holy Powers, I will go around the ritual
> ara carryng a Flame and offering dink to the Spirits of the Place.
>
> =====================================
> In amicitia et fide
> Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator
> Civis circa Quintilis MMDCCLI a.u.c.
>
> Religio Septentrionalis - Poeta
>
> http://www.myspace.com/venator_poetus
> http://anheathenreader.blogspot.com/
> http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
> http://www.cafepress.com/catamountgrange
> --
> May the Holy Powers smile on our efforts.
> May the Spirits of our family lines nod in approval.
> May we be of Worth to our fellow Nova Romans.
>

Salve Poplicola;
Sempronius Regulus recommended a fantastic book on Roman Religion and Indo-Aryan ritual, ecastor, I forgot the title, had excellent reviews. It's very compelling. The discussion of Terminus...read it. If Regulus posts the title I'll add it to the NRwiki.
valeas
Maior

- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola" <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote:

>
> Regule, do you buy into Dumezil's tripartite function of IndoEuropean
> Religion?
>
> Poplicola
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator" <famila.ulleria.venii@...>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:00 PM
> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
>
> > Ave Rgulus;
> >
> > On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 6:28 PM, A. Sempronius Regulus wrote:
> >>
> >> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to the
> >> gods
> >> -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are
> >> effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is the
> >> consensus of modern academic research.
> >>
> >
> > Perhaps the fires memory is a little more widespread than you realize.
> > . .I always have at least 3 flames (candles in a holder made of 3
> > antlers, 3 lanterns or 3 torches) on or around my altar when I give
> > worship to the Northern Holy Ones.
> >
> > It has always seemed the right thing to do, just as I have 3 cups for
> > hallowed drink: one for the Gods, one for the Spirits of Earth, Wind,
> > Fire & Water, and a third for the Spirits of my Family line.
> >
> > Also, before I Offer to the Holy Powers, I will go around the ritual
> > ara carryng a Flame and offering dink to the Spirits of the Place.
> >
> > =====================================
> > In amicitia et fide
> > Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator
> > Civis circa Quintilis MMDCCLI a.u.c.
> >
> > Religio Septentrionalis - Poeta
> >
> > http://www.myspace.com/venator_poetus
> > http://anheathenreader.blogspot.com/
> > http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
> > http://www.cafepress.com/catamountgrange
> > --
> > May the Holy Powers smile on our efforts.
> > May the Spirits of our family lines nod in approval.
> > May we be of Worth to our fellow Nova Romans.
> >
>

Is it, perchance, by Dumezil? He did his work on the tripartite function of
Indo-European religion in Flamen-Brahman and La Religione Romaine
Archaique.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Maior" <rory12001@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:15 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars

> Salve Poplicola;
> Sempronius Regulus recommended a fantastic book on Roman Religion and
> Indo-Aryan ritual, ecastor, I forgot the title, had excellent reviews.
> It's very compelling. The discussion of Terminus...read it. If Regulus
> posts the title I'll add it to the NRwiki.
> valeas
> Maior
>
> - In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola"
> <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote:
>>
>> Regule, do you buy into Dumezil's tripartite function of IndoEuropean
>> Religion?
>>
>> Poplicola
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator" <famila.ulleria.venii@...>
>> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:00 PM
>> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
>>
>> > Ave Rgulus;
>> >
>> > On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 6:28 PM, A. Sempronius Regulus wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to
>> >> the
>> >> gods
>> >> -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are
>> >> effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is
>> >> the
>> >> consensus of modern academic research.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Perhaps the fires memory is a little more widespread than you realize.
>> > . .I always have at least 3 flames (candles in a holder made of 3
>> > antlers, 3 lanterns or 3 torches) on or around my altar when I give
>> > worship to the Northern Holy Ones.
>> >
>> > It has always seemed the right thing to do, just as I have 3 cups for
>> > hallowed drink: one for the Gods, one for the Spirits of Earth, Wind,
>> > Fire & Water, and a third for the Spirits of my Family line.
>> >
>> > Also, before I Offer to the Holy Powers, I will go around the ritual
>> > ara carryng a Flame and offering dink to the Spirits of the Place.
>> >
>> > =====================================
>> > In amicitia et fide
>> > Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator
>> > Civis circa Quintilis MMDCCLI a.u.c.
>> >
>> > Religio Septentrionalis - Poeta
>> >
>> > http://www.myspace.com/venator_poetus
>> > http://anheathenreader.blogspot.com/
>> > http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
>> > http://www.cafepress.com/catamountgrange
>> > --
>> > May the Holy Powers smile on our efforts.
>> > May the Spirits of our family lines nod in approval.
>> > May we be of Worth to our fellow Nova Romans.
>> >
>>
>
>
>

Salve Octavi Gracche;
Equestria Laeca is Nova Roma, Inc's Chief Financial Officer. She performed a professional task for Nova Roma; one she performs in her macro life as a financial analyst and accountant. She acted: made filings and phone calls to ensure Nova Roma's compliance with state and federal law and told the Board it was so.

Gn.Caesar and Cato (two persons who have neither a degree in law or finance) have an opinion & dispute Equestria's statment. In effect they are questioning her professionalism, and her ability to do her job properly.

So please, let's stop this.

As for Livia, she said their methods were like...that's called a simile. She's too smart and too upright to stoop to ad hominem name- calling.
valeas
Maior

>
> I believe that Equestria Iunia has given her honest opinion that Nova Roma's
> affairs are in order.
>
> I believe that Cato and Caesar have given their honest opinion that Nova Roma's
> affairs are NOT in order.
>
> This is not a contradiction. All of these people are acting in good faith.
>
> Unfortunately, one of these opinions has alarmed the Powers That Be, and they
> are seeking to stifle it; hysteria abounds, as do cries of "traitor". This is
> abhorrent.
>
> Regardless of who is in the right about the legality of the MM project or in
> the matter of calling for the removal of officers, these charges of "treason" -
> a capital crime - just because someone has spoken with a lawyer will not be
> tolerated. I come to the aid of Cato, not because he is right in his opinions
> about NR being in violation of the law, but because they are attempting to
> silence him.
>
> Vale, Octavius.
>
> --
> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
> author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
> CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/
>

No, it's very recent. Brilliant. Ah just found it via BMCR search engine:
Roger D. Woodard "Indo-European Sacred Space.Vedic and Roman Cult." University of Illinois Press, 2006
here's the review.
http://bmcr.brynmawr.edu/2007/2007-02-36.html
valeas
Maior

>
> Is it, perchance, by Dumezil? He did his work on the tripartite function of
> Indo-European religion in Flamen-Brahman and La Religione Romaine
> Archaique.
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Maior" <rory12001@...>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:15 PM
> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
>
> > Salve Poplicola;
> > Sempronius Regulus recommended a fantastic book on Roman Religion and
> > Indo-Aryan ritual, ecastor, I forgot the title, had excellent reviews.
> > It's very compelling. The discussion of Terminus...read it. If Regulus
> > posts the title I'll add it to the NRwiki.
> > valeas
> > Maior
> >
> > - In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola"
> > <q.valerius.poplicola@> wrote:
> >>
> >> Regule, do you buy into Dumezil's tripartite function of IndoEuropean
> >> Religion?
> >>
> >> Poplicola
> >>
> >> --------------------------------------------------
> >> From: "Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator" <famila.ulleria.venii@>
> >> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:00 PM
> >> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
> >>
> >> > Ave Rgulus;
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 6:28 PM, A. Sempronius Regulus wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to
> >> >> the
> >> >> gods
> >> >> -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None are
> >> >> effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and is
> >> >> the
> >> >> consensus of modern academic research.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Perhaps the fires memory is a little more widespread than you realize.
> >> > . .I always have at least 3 flames (candles in a holder made of 3
> >> > antlers, 3 lanterns or 3 torches) on or around my altar when I give
> >> > worship to the Northern Holy Ones.
> >> >
> >> > It has always seemed the right thing to do, just as I have 3 cups for
> >> > hallowed drink: one for the Gods, one for the Spirits of Earth, Wind,
> >> > Fire & Water, and a third for the Spirits of my Family line.
> >> >
> >> > Also, before I Offer to the Holy Powers, I will go around the ritual
> >> > ara carryng a Flame and offering dink to the Spirits of the Place.
> >> >
> >> > =====================================
> >> > In amicitia et fide
> >> > Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator
> >> > Civis circa Quintilis MMDCCLI a.u.c.
> >> >
> >> > Religio Septentrionalis - Poeta
> >> >
> >> > http://www.myspace.com/venator_poetus
> >> > http://anheathenreader.blogspot.com/
> >> > http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
> >> > http://www.cafepress.com/catamountgrange
> >> > --
> >> > May the Holy Powers smile on our efforts.
> >> > May the Spirits of our family lines nod in approval.
> >> > May we be of Worth to our fellow Nova Romans.
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>

Oh, yes, Woodard is good. I've yet to digest it, but I will get around to it
soon.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Maior" <rory12001@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:54 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars

> No, it's very recent. Brilliant. Ah just found it via BMCR search engine:
> Roger D. Woodard "Indo-European Sacred Space.Vedic and Roman Cult."
> University of Illinois Press, 2006
> here's the review.
> http://bmcr.brynmawr.edu/2007/2007-02-36.html
> valeas
> Maior
>>
>> Is it, perchance, by Dumezil? He did his work on the tripartite function
>> of
>> Indo-European religion in Flamen-Brahman and La Religione Romaine
>> Archaique.
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Maior" <rory12001@...>
>> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:15 PM
>> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
>>
>> > Salve Poplicola;
>> > Sempronius Regulus recommended a fantastic book on Roman Religion and
>> > Indo-Aryan ritual, ecastor, I forgot the title, had excellent reviews.
>> > It's very compelling. The discussion of Terminus...read it. If Regulus
>> > posts the title I'll add it to the NRwiki.
>> > valeas
>> > Maior
>> >
>> > - In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola"
>> > <q.valerius.poplicola@> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Regule, do you buy into Dumezil's tripartite function of IndoEuropean
>> >> Religion?
>> >>
>> >> Poplicola
>> >>
>> >> --------------------------------------------------
>> >> From: "Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator" <famila.ulleria.venii@>
>> >> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:00 PM
>> >> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> >> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars
>> >>
>> >> > Ave Rgulus;
>> >> >
>> >> > On Sun, Apr 26, 2009 at 6:28 PM, A. Sempronius Regulus wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Maybe Nova Roma is not effective because it has not the sanction to
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> gods
>> >> >> -- because, it does not know the correct rites and rituals. None
>> >> >> are
>> >> >> effective without three fires as ALL ancient sources attest to and
>> >> >> is
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> consensus of modern academic research.
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > Perhaps the fires memory is a little more widespread than you
>> >> > realize.
>> >> > . .I always have at least 3 flames (candles in a holder made of 3
>> >> > antlers, 3 lanterns or 3 torches) on or around my altar when I give
>> >> > worship to the Northern Holy Ones.
>> >> >
>> >> > It has always seemed the right thing to do, just as I have 3 cups
>> >> > for
>> >> > hallowed drink: one for the Gods, one for the Spirits of Earth,
>> >> > Wind,
>> >> > Fire & Water, and a third for the Spirits of my Family line.
>> >> >
>> >> > Also, before I Offer to the Holy Powers, I will go around the ritual
>> >> > ara carryng a Flame and offering dink to the Spirits of the Place.
>> >> >
>> >> > =====================================
>> >> > In amicitia et fide
>> >> > Publius Ullerius Stephanus Venator
>> >> > Civis circa Quintilis MMDCCLI a.u.c.
>> >> >
>> >> > Religio Septentrionalis - Poeta
>> >> >
>> >> > http://www.myspace.com/venator_poetus
>> >> > http://anheathenreader.blogspot.com/
>> >> > http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
>> >> > http://www.cafepress.com/catamountgrange
>> >> > --
>> >> > May the Holy Powers smile on our efforts.
>> >> > May the Spirits of our family lines nod in approval.
>> >> > May we be of Worth to our fellow Nova Romans.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>

Salve Octavi Gracche;
 Equestria Laeca is Nova Roma, Inc's Chief Financial Officer. She performed a professional task for Nova Roma; one she performs in her macro life as a financial analyst and accountant. She acted: made filings and phone calls to ensure Nova Roma's compliance with state and federal law and told the Board it was so.

Gn.Caesar and Cato (two persons who have neither a degree in law or finance) have an opinion & dispute Equestria's statment. In effect they are questioning her professionalism, and her ability to do her job properly.

So please, let's stop this.

As for Livia, she said their methods were like...that's called a simile. She's too smart and too upright to stoop to ad hominem name- calling.
                       valeas
                         Maior

>
> I believe that Equestria Iunia has given her

honest opinion that Nova Roma's

> affairs are in order.
>
> I

believe that Cato and Caesar have given their honest opinion that Nova Roma's

> affairs are NOT in order.
>
> This is not a

contradiction.   All of these people are acting in good faith.

>
> Unfortunately, one of these opinions has alarmed the Powers That Be,

and they

> are seeking to stifle it; hysteria abounds, as do cries of

"traitor".  This is

> abhorrent.
>
> Regardless of who

is in the right about the legality of the MM project or in

> the matter of

calling for the removal of officers, these charges of "treason" -

> a

capital crime - just because someone has spoken with a lawyer will not be

> tolerated.  I come to the aid of Cato, not because he is right

in his opinions

> about NR being in violation of the law, but because they

are attempting to

> silence him.
>
> Vale, Octavius.
>
> --
> Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
> author,

Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/

>

CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

>

------------------------------------

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Yes, we do get sidetracked. Give it a couple of days. After two or three
days if no one has responded to you, then commission away, I say. But, do
give a quote when you do, because I may want to take one before I leave for
San Fran.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "A. Sempronius Regulus" <asempronius.regulus@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 10:44 PM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>; <ReligioRomana@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Basic Issue/Re: [Nova-Roma] Roman Altars

> Salvete,
> While all the posts on this are interesting (including my replies and
> Dumezil's complete theory is beside the point, it lead to new
> discoveries), none have addressed the basic issue. Are there NR citizens
> creating repro-Roman altars or not? Period.
>
> If not, I will comission local artists. Period.
>
> Its a business deal. Period.
>
> It is something many here do not get, grasp, or comprehend.
>
> It is a simple transaction. If nobody here is capable, the comission
> will go to the local highest bidder.
> Valete,
> A. Sempronius Regulus
>
>
>
>
>

Ah, San Francisco, a city of my heart. So, that is where you are going? I think it is a better destiny than the other options. There we might meet. As I said, we have property there. If I could be there every time and always. If that is where you go, I envy your full-time residence there. --- On Mon, 4/27/09, Q. Valerius Poplicola <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote: From: Q. Valerius Poplicola <q.valerius.poplicola@...> Subject: [Austrorientalis] Re: Basic Issue/Re: [Nova-Roma] Roman Altars To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Austrorientalis@yahoogroups.com, ReligioRomana@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, April 27, 2009, 3:53 AM Yes, we do get sidetracked. Give it a couple of days. After two or three days if no one has responded to you, then commission away, I say. But, do give a quote when you do, because I may want to take one before I leave for San Fran. ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- -- From: "A. Sempronius Regulus" <asempronius. regulus@yahoo. com> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 10:44 PM To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogrou ps.com>; <ReligioRomana@ yahoogroups. com> Subject: Basic Issue/Re: [Nova-Roma] Roman Altars > Salvete, > While all the posts on this are interesting (including my replies and > Dumezil's complete theory is beside the point, it lead to new > discoveries) , none have addressed the basic issue. Are there NR citizens > creating repro-Roman altars or not? Period. > > If not, I will comission local artists. Period. > > Its a business deal. Period. > > It is something many here do not get, grasp, or comprehend. > > It is a simple transaction. If nobody here is capable, the comission > will go to the local highest bidder. > Valete, > A. Sempronius Regulus > > > > >

We own some of that city -- outer Richmond district above Golden Gate Park (which goes from the Hight Ashbury -- an old neighborhood we know well)-- it sees the Pacific. If you come up short and in need of help, if our place is available, give us a call.   As ever, always a reborn child of San Francisco and a tax payer; ASR --- On Mon, 4/27/09, Q. Valerius Poplicola <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote: From: Q. Valerius Poplicola <q.valerius.poplicola@...> Subject: Re: Basic Issue/Re: [Nova-Roma] Roman Altars To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Austrorientalis@yahoogroups.com, ReligioRomana@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, April 27, 2009, 3:53 AM Yes, we do get sidetracked. Give it a couple of days. After two or three days if no one has responded to you, then commission away, I say. But, do give a quote when you do, because I may want to take one before I leave for San Fran. ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- -- From: "A. Sempronius Regulus" <asempronius. regulus@yahoo. com> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 10:44 PM To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogrou ps.com>; <ReligioRomana@ yahoogroups. com> Subject: Basic Issue/Re: [Nova-Roma] Roman Altars > Salvete, > While all the posts on this are interesting (including my replies and > Dumezil's complete theory is beside the point, it lead to new > discoveries) , none have addressed the basic issue. Are there NR citizens > creating repro-Roman altars or not? Period. > > If not, I will comission local artists. Period. > > Its a business deal. Period. > > It is something many here do not get, grasp, or comprehend. > > It is a simple transaction. If nobody here is capable, the comission > will go to the local highest bidder. > Valete, > A. Sempronius Regulus > > > > >

Cato Marcae Hortensiae sal.

Salve!

Maior, is Laeca a Certified Public Accountant?

Are you sure, Maior, absolutely sure that every filing necessary has already been done? How can you be sure? Did you see the records of the documents showing proof all necessary State and Federal filings?

I haven't, and as a member of the Board of Directors of the corporation, I asked her directly, as CFO of the corporation, for copies of all records having to do with compliance with State and Federal law. A copy of the email in which I did so was also sent to the Secretary of the corporation, Tiberius Galerius Paulinus, and she responded (to chide me), so there is no question that she received it. What does the law say?

"Books; records of accounts. All books and records of a corporation may be inspected by any officer, director or voting member or the officer's, director's or voting member's agent or attorney, for any proper purpose at any reasonable time, as long as the officer, director or voting member or the officer's, director's or voting member's agent or attorney gives the corporation written notice at least 5 business days before the date on which the officer, director or voting member or the officer's, director's or voting member's agent or attorney wishes to inspect and copy any books or records." - Maine Nonprofit Corporation Act, Title 13-B 715.1

She has yet to comply with this request. What happens if she does not?

"Refusal to allow inspection. If a corporation does not make available for inspection or copying the books and records required by subsection 1 or if the corporation seeks to impose unreasonable restrictions on the use or distribution of such books and records, the Superior Court in the county where the corporation's principal office is located or, if the corporation has no principal office in this State, in the county where its registered office is located may order inspection and copying of the records demanded at the corporation's expense upon application of the officer, director or member or the officer's, director's or member's agent or attorney." - op.cit. 715.2

How much deeper are we going to let our officers dig this hole?

Vale,

Cato

Salve Livia

 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 "Your friends over at the BA are using the well-experimented techniques of repeating lies until people believe they are true and of trumping up charges against their political opponents."
 
 
 
Vale
 
Paulinus
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A. Sempronius Regulus escribió:

Salve,   As a professional in Indo-European Studies, I can say that turf (grass) placed on the altars (always, ALWAYS THREE, I have posted on this previously (search the archives) is totally correct. It may be only a small mound of turf within which incense and charcoal were nourished (nourished, that's the point) while wine, blood, animal parts were placed within. In Vedic India, the three fires were within immediate proximity (although no rule said they needed to be so -- just that they need to be within the sacred space plowed out in advance), Rome has sacred trenches by its mythical founders. The description of what was done matches the Vedic description of a sacrifice site. The first fire, the Vestal one, was inside the city. The second fire, guarding against demons or ill-influence, the Vulcanus has its Vedic counterpart. The third fire, the sacrificial fire, was the immediate one used at location. BTW, in both Vedic and Roman sources the geometric shape of these fires are identical. And at the deepest stratum of the Roman Forum (forgive, I can't remember, southeast or southwest), the three fire plan EXACTLY matches the physical layout of a Vedic fire sacrifice. But yes, a hollowing serving a turf liner.   Vale, A. Sempronius Regulus --- On Sun, 4/26/09, livia_plauta <livia.plauta@ gmail.com> wrote: From: livia_plauta <livia.plauta@ gmail.com> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Roman Altars To: Nova-Roma@yahoogrou ps.com Date: Sunday, April 26, 2009, 10:40 PM Salve Regule, I don't know anyone making reproductions of roman altars, but this is the occasion to mention an observation I made in Pompeii regarding their architecture. Some time ago on the religio list Piscinus mentioned that he believed some turf was placed on top of marble altars before using them for sacrifices, because usually no burn signs are visible. It would be impossible to light fires directly on the marble, because it is very sensitive to temperature variations and it would crack. Usually altars have the reproduction of a pillow on top, rolled up iat the two sides, and the surface in the centre is rough, sometimes with a small hole in the middle. Well, in Pompeii, where the altars were left in the state they were when in use, I found out that there was something on top of them, but not turf. The altar of Juppiter had some flat black lava stones inset on its top, filling exactly the space between the two pillow rolls, and smooth on top. Some other altars instead had big, specially shaped ceramic tiles on top. For your altar, I suggest asking any stone-mason and giving them a photo to base on. Optime vale, Livia > > Salvete omnes, >   > As I posted a few years ago, I'm constructing a small cella out of a mixture > of torn-down mausoleums and old houses with columns to make way for > sub-divisions (the building trade does not seem dead in Tennessee). The > cella will be placed within a templum. However, I am short one Roman altar > to place outside the cella but within the templum. >   > Does anyone in Nova Roma make reproduction Roman altars? >   > Thanks in advance, if you do, contact me off-list unless you think it will > be of general interest -- and making one a member of the equestrian order. >   > Valete, > A. Sempronius Regulus >

Q. Valerius Poplicola wrote:

> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was illegally
> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
> lawyer.
>

Salvete, cives.

This is a case of what Livia Plauta described as "[the technique of] repeating lies until people believe they are true". I have described in detail why it was illegal for Sulla to be in the senate in the first place, and Modianus corrected an error by his colleague.

At the time, Sulla was not a member of the board of directors nor of the senate. A perceived "legal loophole" which didn't, and still doesn't, exist was used by his allies to motivate why he should be allowed to sit and vote in the senate, without any of the responsibilities of being an actual director of the corporation.

An old magisterial decision, legal at the time, removed Sulla as senator and he was not reinstated until this year. Last fall, he had no right whatsoever to be in the senate. One censor unilaterally added him to the senate list and the other removed him. Yet he was allowed back in and allowed to vote as a non-senator, against our laws, because a ruckus was raised on the senate list. After this, he threatened NR with a lawsuit, and after the new year, the new censor pairing readmitted him into the senate.

Valete, Pius.

That's funny. Livia said he was removed for trolling. So which lie do you
guys want to advance? Trolling or "legal loophole". Either way it's a
vicious lie.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Kristoffer From" <from@...>
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 2:50 AM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> Q. Valerius Poplicola wrote:
>> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was illegally
>> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
>> lawyer.
>>
>
> Salvete, cives.
>
> This is a case of what Livia Plauta described as "[the technique of]
> repeating lies until people believe they are true". I have described in
> detail why it was illegal for Sulla to be in the senate in the first
> place, and Modianus corrected an error by his colleague.
>
> At the time, Sulla was not a member of the board of directors nor of the
> senate. A perceived "legal loophole" which didn't, and still doesn't,
> exist was used by his allies to motivate why he should be allowed to sit
> and vote in the senate, without any of the responsibilities of being an
> actual director of the corporation.
>
> An old magisterial decision, legal at the time, removed Sulla as senator
> and he was not reinstated until this year. Last fall, he had no right
> whatsoever to be in the senate. One censor unilaterally added him to the
> senate list and the other removed him. Yet he was allowed back in and
> allowed to vote as a non-senator, against our laws, because a ruckus was
> raised on the senate list. After this, he threatened NR with a lawsuit,
> and after the new year, the new censor pairing readmitted him into the
> senate.
>
> Valete, Pius.
>
>
>

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola" <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote:

>
> That's funny. Livia said he was removed for trolling. So which lie do you
> guys want to advance? Trolling or "legal loophole". Either way it's a
> vicious lie.
>

Who exactly do you mean by "you guys"?

MLA

Well, in particular Livia and Kristoffer, since they are the ones issuing
inaccurate statements. What else did you think I mean?

--------------------------------------------------
From: "M. Lucretius Agricola" <marcus.lucretius@...>
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 4:11 AM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Q. Valerius Poplicola"
> <q.valerius.poplicola@...> wrote:
>>
>> That's funny. Livia said he was removed for trolling. So which lie do you
>> guys want to advance? Trolling or "legal loophole". Either way it's a
>> vicious lie.
>>
>
> Who exactly do you mean by "you guys"?
>
> MLA
>
>
>
>

Salvete Poplicola et Octavi,
you obviously are confusing me with someone else or you think condemning someone's behaviour is the same as calling them names. I never called anyone "terrorist", "liar" or "traitor".
I just said that some people are using the same techniques as terrorists and telling lies, in the context of a simulation they are running, at the expense of our community.

However hard you try to provoke me you will never get me to call people names. I finished elementary school over 30 years ago.

Optime valete,
Livia

>
> I'm sorry, but you're still wrong.
>
> First, "failing to prove that you lied" does not make me a liar. But, I
> have shown and will show again how you're being deceptive, aka lying.
>
> > They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
> > trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma.
>
> This is so clearly not true. It doesn't even make sense it's so untrue.
> Perhaps you are ignorant that lawyers cost money (even if just to see if a
> lawsuit is possible). The only sane action that anybody, except apparently
> you, would take is to seek redress via a lawyer after an action is
> committed. And quite clearly, that is what happened. The lawyer call
> happened after Modianus removed Sulla. To deny that is a clear mark of
> trolling.
>
> Furthermore, Modianus did not have the legal authority from Nova Roma or
> elsewhere to remove Sulla, regardless of his so-called "trolling".
>
> " I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
> nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making it
> work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until I'm in
> some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends)."
>
> Yes, ranting and raving while foaming at the mouth on how evil people who
> disagree with you, how they're terrorists and dictators, is certainly
> "helpful". Bravo. Bravo.
>
> "> You really seem to have problems understanding plain English, sometimes.
> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
> > simulation game.
> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
> > try out the same strategies on an internet community."
>
> Yes! The non-native English speaker thinks I have something wrong with my
> native tongue! Classic! You compared their tactics to dictators and
> terrorists, if you have no idea what metaphor entails, you should not be
> speaking at all.
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:51 PM
> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
> Publica
>
> > Salve Poplicola,
> > you have failed to prove that I'm lying, so you are lying yourself.
> >>
> >> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was illegally
> >> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
> >> lawyer.
> >>
> > He was removed for the senate list for trolling. The obvious solution was
> > to stop trolling.
> >
> >> "access or not to certain mailing lists"
> >>
> >> When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been illegally
> >> blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like it if
> >> we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma after
> >> having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?
> >>
> > I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
> > nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making
> > it work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until
> > I'm in some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends).
> >
> >> I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going to
> >> call
> >> you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.
> >>
> > You really seem to have problems understanding plain English, sometimes.
> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
> > simulation game.
> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
> > try out the same strategies on an internet community.
> >
> > Vale,
> > Livia
> >
> >
> >
>

Salvete omnes,

I reiterate here that I never called anyone a terrorist. Saying someone uses the same techniques as terrorists is not the same as saying they are a terrorist. Sorry, but the moderators can scan my posts all they like: they won't find name-calling in them.

Optime valete,
Livia

>
> Cato praetores SPD
>
> Salvete.
>
> I will not request that Livia Plauta be placed on moderation for having labeled me the equivalent of a terrorist because no matter how hideous and cruel her words may be, I believe she has the right to speak them. They can only reveal the kind of twisted mentality with which she approaches her fellow-citizens, and she should be judged by the People for them.
>
> This is almost indescribably unacceptable, and I take her comment personally in the most cruel and horrific way.
>
> Valete,
>
> Cato
>

I would like to think that it's merely a cultural disconnect, but your
pattern of abuse says otherwise. I honestly have no clue someone can accuse
people of lying and acting like terrorists and dictators and then go right
around and deny they ever did such thing, while in the same breath accuse
them once more.

If you can't be at least civil, resorting instead to lowly ad hominem, I
think I will withhold my responses to you from here on out. No point in
arguing with a person like you.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 4:39 AM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> Salvete Poplicola et Octavi,
> you obviously are confusing me with someone else or you think condemning
> someone's behaviour is the same as calling them names. I never called
> anyone "terrorist", "liar" or "traitor".
> I just said that some people are using the same techniques as terrorists
> and telling lies, in the context of a simulation they are running, at the
> expense of our community.
>
> However hard you try to provoke me you will never get me to call people
> names. I finished elementary school over 30 years ago.
>
> Optime valete,
> Livia
>>
>> I'm sorry, but you're still wrong.
>>
>> First, "failing to prove that you lied" does not make me a liar. But, I
>> have shown and will show again how you're being deceptive, aka lying.
>>
>> > They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
>> > trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma.
>>
>> This is so clearly not true. It doesn't even make sense it's so untrue.
>> Perhaps you are ignorant that lawyers cost money (even if just to see if
>> a
>> lawsuit is possible). The only sane action that anybody, except
>> apparently
>> you, would take is to seek redress via a lawyer after an action is
>> committed. And quite clearly, that is what happened. The lawyer call
>> happened after Modianus removed Sulla. To deny that is a clear mark of
>> trolling.
>>
>> Furthermore, Modianus did not have the legal authority from Nova Roma or
>> elsewhere to remove Sulla, regardless of his so-called "trolling".
>>
>> " I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
>> nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making
>> it
>> work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until I'm
>> in
>> some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends)."
>>
>> Yes, ranting and raving while foaming at the mouth on how evil people who
>> disagree with you, how they're terrorists and dictators, is certainly
>> "helpful". Bravo. Bravo.
>>
>> "> You really seem to have problems understanding plain English,
>> sometimes.
>> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
>> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
>> > simulation game.
>> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
>> > try out the same strategies on an internet community."
>>
>> Yes! The non-native English speaker thinks I have something wrong with my
>> native tongue! Classic! You compared their tactics to dictators and
>> terrorists, if you have no idea what metaphor entails, you should not be
>> speaking at all.
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
>> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:51 PM
>> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
>> Publica
>>
>> > Salve Poplicola,
>> > you have failed to prove that I'm lying, so you are lying yourself.
>> >>
>> >> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was
>> >> illegally
>> >> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
>> >> lawyer.
>> >>
>> > He was removed for the senate list for trolling. The obvious solution
>> > was
>> > to stop trolling.
>> >
>> >> "access or not to certain mailing lists"
>> >>
>> >> When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been
>> >> illegally
>> >> blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like it
>> >> if
>> >> we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma
>> >> after
>> >> having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?
>> >>
>> > I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
>> > nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot
>> > making
>> > it work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least
>> > until
>> > I'm in some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends).
>> >
>> >> I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going to
>> >> call
>> >> you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.
>> >>
>> > You really seem to have problems understanding plain English,
>> > sometimes.
>> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
>> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
>> > simulation game.
>> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
>> > try out the same strategies on an internet community.
>> >
>> > Vale,
>> > Livia
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>

Salve Aemili,
if you think this means the Colosseum will be rebuilt, you will be sorely deceived.
The only thing that will be done in a short timeframe is replacing the provisonal fence with a new elegant metalwork fence, fencigg off all the Colosseum area, in order to shut out the illegal souvenir sellers.
The restoration project may also involve rebuilding part of the seats and the arena out of wood, in order to be able to use the Colosseum for shows. At least that's what has been mentioned in the Italian press, but no timeframe was mentioned.

Optime vale,
Livia

>
> Salvete Omnes
>
> Given our past discussions, I thought this was an interesting "restoration"
> project to say the least.
>
> http://www.adnkronos.com/AKI/English/CultureAndMedia/?id=3.0.3239195574
>
> Not trying to get anything going, just thought it was timely.
>
> Valete
>
> D. Aemilius Severus
>

Salve Poplicola,
I'm starting to think you really might have problems understanding your mother tongue. Or maybe it's one of those cases of your eyes reading what you want to read, rather than what's written.
Please, try to get some rest. It's easy to misunderstand of confuse text after spending many hours at the computer.
I never denied accusing people of lying or using the same strategies as terrorists. I merely pointed out (now for the third time), that this is not the same as accusing them of being liars of terrorists.

A liar is someone who habitually lies. I don't know anyone on the BA list well enough to say they do. For all I know, they all are perfectly normal and honest people, who just let out their aggressive side on internet mailing lists. So I would never dream of calling anyone there a liar.

A terrorist is someone who uses the strategy of terror, aided by some type of violence.
Using some of the same strategies of terrorism doesn't mean being a terrorist, specially if you don't use phisical violence.
How could anyone think I was calling them a terrorist, when I never accused anyone of using violence?

Optime vale,
Livia

>
> I would like to think that it's merely a cultural disconnect, but your
> pattern of abuse says otherwise. I honestly have no clue someone can accuse
> people of lying and acting like terrorists and dictators and then go right
> around and deny they ever did such thing, while in the same breath accuse
> them once more.
>
> If you can't be at least civil, resorting instead to lowly ad hominem, I
> think I will withhold my responses to you from here on out. No point in
> arguing with a person like you.
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
> Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 4:39 AM
> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
> Publica
>
> > Salvete Poplicola et Octavi,
> > you obviously are confusing me with someone else or you think condemning
> > someone's behaviour is the same as calling them names. I never called
> > anyone "terrorist", "liar" or "traitor".
> > I just said that some people are using the same techniques as terrorists
> > and telling lies, in the context of a simulation they are running, at the
> > expense of our community.
> >
> > However hard you try to provoke me you will never get me to call people
> > names. I finished elementary school over 30 years ago.
> >
> > Optime valete,
> > Livia
> >>
> >> I'm sorry, but you're still wrong.
> >>
> >> First, "failing to prove that you lied" does not make me a liar. But, I
> >> have shown and will show again how you're being deceptive, aka lying.
> >>
> >> > They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
> >> > trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma.
> >>
> >> This is so clearly not true. It doesn't even make sense it's so untrue.
> >> Perhaps you are ignorant that lawyers cost money (even if just to see if
> >> a
> >> lawsuit is possible). The only sane action that anybody, except
> >> apparently
> >> you, would take is to seek redress via a lawyer after an action is
> >> committed. And quite clearly, that is what happened. The lawyer call
> >> happened after Modianus removed Sulla. To deny that is a clear mark of
> >> trolling.
> >>
> >> Furthermore, Modianus did not have the legal authority from Nova Roma or
> >> elsewhere to remove Sulla, regardless of his so-called "trolling".
> >>
> >> " I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
> >> nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot making
> >> it
> >> work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until I'm
> >> in
> >> some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends)."
> >>
> >> Yes, ranting and raving while foaming at the mouth on how evil people who
> >> disagree with you, how they're terrorists and dictators, is certainly
> >> "helpful". Bravo. Bravo.
> >>
> >> "> You really seem to have problems understanding plain English,
> >> sometimes.
> >> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
> >> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
> >> > simulation game.
> >> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
> >> > try out the same strategies on an internet community."
> >>
> >> Yes! The non-native English speaker thinks I have something wrong with my
> >> native tongue! Classic! You compared their tactics to dictators and
> >> terrorists, if you have no idea what metaphor entails, you should not be
> >> speaking at all.
> >>
> >> --------------------------------------------------
> >> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@>
> >> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:51 PM
> >> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> >> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
> >> Publica
> >>
> >> > Salve Poplicola,
> >> > you have failed to prove that I'm lying, so you are lying yourself.
> >> >>
> >> >> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was
> >> >> illegally
> >> >> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he got a
> >> >> lawyer.
> >> >>
> >> > He was removed for the senate list for trolling. The obvious solution
> >> > was
> >> > to stop trolling.
> >> >
> >> >> "access or not to certain mailing lists"
> >> >>
> >> >> When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been
> >> >> illegally
> >> >> blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like it
> >> >> if
> >> >> we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma
> >> >> after
> >> >> having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?
> >> >>
> >> > I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is doing
> >> > nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot
> >> > making
> >> > it work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least
> >> > until
> >> > I'm in some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends).
> >> >
> >> >> I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going to
> >> >> call
> >> >> you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.
> >> >>
> >> > You really seem to have problems understanding plain English,
> >> > sometimes.
> >> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people are
> >> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
> >> > simulation game.
> >> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want to
> >> > try out the same strategies on an internet community.
> >> >
> >> > Vale,
> >> > Livia
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>

"> I never denied accusing people of lying or using the same strategies as
terrorists. I merely pointed out (now for the third time), that this is not
the same as accusing them of being liars of terrorists."

You must have huge cajones to say that kind of crap and expect to get away
with it.

--------------------------------------------------
From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 5:19 AM
To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
Publica

> Salve Poplicola,
> I'm starting to think you really might have problems understanding your
> mother tongue. Or maybe it's one of those cases of your eyes reading what
> you want to read, rather than what's written.
> Please, try to get some rest. It's easy to misunderstand of confuse text
> after spending many hours at the computer.
> I never denied accusing people of lying or using the same strategies as
> terrorists. I merely pointed out (now for the third time), that this is
> not the same as accusing them of being liars of terrorists.
>
> A liar is someone who habitually lies. I don't know anyone on the BA list
> well enough to say they do. For all I know, they all are perfectly normal
> and honest people, who just let out their aggressive side on internet
> mailing lists. So I would never dream of calling anyone there a liar.
>
> A terrorist is someone who uses the strategy of terror, aided by some type
> of violence.
> Using some of the same strategies of terrorism doesn't mean being a
> terrorist, specially if you don't use phisical violence.
> How could anyone think I was calling them a terrorist, when I never
> accused anyone of using violence?
>
> Optime vale,
> Livia
>>
>> I would like to think that it's merely a cultural disconnect, but your
>> pattern of abuse says otherwise. I honestly have no clue someone can
>> accuse
>> people of lying and acting like terrorists and dictators and then go
>> right
>> around and deny they ever did such thing, while in the same breath accuse
>> them once more.
>>
>> If you can't be at least civil, resorting instead to lowly ad hominem, I
>> think I will withhold my responses to you from here on out. No point in
>> arguing with a person like you.
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@...>
>> Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 4:39 AM
>> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
>> Publica
>>
>> > Salvete Poplicola et Octavi,
>> > you obviously are confusing me with someone else or you think
>> > condemning
>> > someone's behaviour is the same as calling them names. I never called
>> > anyone "terrorist", "liar" or "traitor".
>> > I just said that some people are using the same techniques as
>> > terrorists
>> > and telling lies, in the context of a simulation they are running, at
>> > the
>> > expense of our community.
>> >
>> > However hard you try to provoke me you will never get me to call people
>> > names. I finished elementary school over 30 years ago.
>> >
>> > Optime valete,
>> > Livia
>> >>
>> >> I'm sorry, but you're still wrong.
>> >>
>> >> First, "failing to prove that you lied" does not make me a liar. But,
>> >> I
>> >> have shown and will show again how you're being deceptive, aka lying.
>> >>
>> >> > They talked to lawyers in order to find out if they could find some
>> >> > trumped-up charge in order to sue Nova Roma.
>> >>
>> >> This is so clearly not true. It doesn't even make sense it's so
>> >> untrue.
>> >> Perhaps you are ignorant that lawyers cost money (even if just to see
>> >> if
>> >> a
>> >> lawsuit is possible). The only sane action that anybody, except
>> >> apparently
>> >> you, would take is to seek redress via a lawyer after an action is
>> >> committed. And quite clearly, that is what happened. The lawyer call
>> >> happened after Modianus removed Sulla. To deny that is a clear mark of
>> >> trolling.
>> >>
>> >> Furthermore, Modianus did not have the legal authority from Nova Roma
>> >> or
>> >> elsewhere to remove Sulla, regardless of his so-called "trolling".
>> >>
>> >> " I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is
>> >> doing
>> >> nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot
>> >> making
>> >> it
>> >> work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least until
>> >> I'm
>> >> in
>> >> some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends)."
>> >>
>> >> Yes, ranting and raving while foaming at the mouth on how evil people
>> >> who
>> >> disagree with you, how they're terrorists and dictators, is certainly
>> >> "helpful". Bravo. Bravo.
>> >>
>> >> "> You really seem to have problems understanding plain English,
>> >> sometimes.
>> >> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people
>> >> > are
>> >> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
>> >> > simulation game.
>> >> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want
>> >> > to
>> >> > try out the same strategies on an internet community."
>> >>
>> >> Yes! The non-native English speaker thinks I have something wrong with
>> >> my
>> >> native tongue! Classic! You compared their tactics to dictators and
>> >> terrorists, if you have no idea what metaphor entails, you should not
>> >> be
>> >> speaking at all.
>> >>
>> >> --------------------------------------------------
>> >> From: "livia_plauta" <livia.plauta@>
>> >> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:51 PM
>> >> To: <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
>> >> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: de Iure Fetiale, de Iure inter Homines, de Re
>> >> Publica
>> >>
>> >> > Salve Poplicola,
>> >> > you have failed to prove that I'm lying, so you are lying yourself.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> More lies from Livia. Why must you lie to everyone? Sulla was
>> >> >> illegally
>> >> >> removed from accessing the Board of Directors, and that's why he
>> >> >> got a
>> >> >> lawyer.
>> >> >>
>> >> > He was removed for the senate list for trolling. The obvious
>> >> > solution
>> >> > was
>> >> > to stop trolling.
>> >> >
>> >> >> "access or not to certain mailing lists"
>> >> >>
>> >> >> When you're a member of the board of directors, and you've been
>> >> >> illegally
>> >> >> blocked from the meeting room, it *does* matter. How would you like
>> >> >> it
>> >> >> if
>> >> >> we, with disregard to the Constitution, removed you from Nova Roma
>> >> >> after
>> >> >> having paid your taxes? You'd be all fine and dandy with it too?
>> >> >>
>> >> > I surely wouldn't threaten to *sue* NR for it. But my tactics is
>> >> > doing
>> >> > nothing harmful to NR, and instead dedicating a lot of energies ot
>> >> > making
>> >> > it work. This ensures that nobody will want to remove me (at least
>> >> > until
>> >> > I'm in some position wich causes the envy of one of your friends).
>> >> >
>> >> >> I seriously doubt it. But go on repeating these lies! I'm not going
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> call
>> >> >> you a dictator or a terrorist. That'd be just retarded.
>> >> >>
>> >> > You really seem to have problems understanding plain English,
>> >> > sometimes.
>> >> > I did not call anyone a dictator or terrorist. I said some people
>> >> > are
>> >> > using the same techniques dictators and terrorist use, as part of a
>> >> > simulation game.
>> >> > Some play "Risk" (the board game also know as Risiko), and some want
>> >> > to
>> >> > try out the same strategies on an internet community.
>> >> >
>> >> > Vale,
>> >> > Livia
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
>

Q. Valerius Poplicola wrote:

> You must have huge cajones to say that kind of crap and expect to get away
> with it.
>

Considering her gender, I find that highly unlikely.

You calling facts "lies", belittling them and insulting those who
brought them into the discussion does not win you arguments.

/Pius

Coato omnibus in foro SPD

Salvete!

Hodiernus dies est ante diem V Kalendas Maius; haec dies comitialis est.

"But swift is the pace of Fortune, bold is her spirit, and most
vaunting her hopes; she outstrips Virtue and is close at hand. She
does not raise herself in the air on light pinions, nor advance
'poised on tip-toe above a globe,' in precarious and hesitant posture,
and then depart from sight. But even as the Spartans say that
Aphrodite, fas she crossed the Eurotas, put aside her mirrors and
ornaments and her magic girdle, and took a spear and shield, adorning
herself to please Lycurgus, even so Fortune, when she had deserted the
Persians and Assyrians, had flitted lightly over Macedonia, and had
quickly shaken off Alexander, made her way through Egypt and Syria,
conveying kingships here and there; and turning about, she would often
exalt the Carthaginians. But when she was approaching the Palatine and
crossing the Tiber, it appears that she took off her wings, stepped
out of her sandals, and abandoned her untrustworthy and unstable
globe. Thus did she enter Rome, as with intent to abide, and in such
guise is she present toâ€`day, as though ready to meet her trial...And
she holds that celebrated Horn of Plenty in her hand, filled not with
fruits of everlasting bloom, but as many as are the products of the
whole earth band of all the seas, rivers, mines and harbours, these
does she pour forth in unstinted abundance. Not a few splendid and
distinguished men are seen in her company: Numa Pompilius from the
Sabine country and Priscus from Tarquinii, whom as adventitious and
foreign kings she set upon the throne of Romulus; and Aemilius Paulus,
leading back his army without a wound from Perseus and the
Macedonians, triumphing for a tearless victory, magnifies Fortune.
There magnifies her also the aged Caecilius Metellus Macedonicus,
borne to his grave by four sons of consular rank, Quintus Baliaricus,
Lucius Diadematus, Marcus Metellus, Gaius Caprarius, and by two sons-
inâ€`law of consular rank, and by grandsons made distinguished by
illustrious deeds and offices. Aemilius Scaurus, a novus homo, was
raised by her from a humble station and a humbler family to be
enrolled as the first man of the Senate. Cornelius Sulla she took up
and elevated from the embraces of his mistress, Nicopolis, and
designated him for a monarchy and dictatorship which ranked far above
the Cimbrian triumphs and the seven consulships of Marius. Sulla used
openly to declare himself, together with his exploits, to be the
adopted child of Fortune, loudly asserting in the words of Sophocles'
Oedipus, 'And Fortune's son I hold myself to be.' In the Latin tongue
he was called Felix, but for the Greeks he wrote his name thus: Lucius
Cornelius Sulla Epaphroditus. And the trophies at my home in
Chaeroneia and those of the Mithridatic Wars are thus inscribed, quite
appropriately; for not "Night," as Menander has it, but Fortune has
the "greater share in Aphrodite." - Plutarch, "On the Fortunes of the
Romans" 4 (ed.)

"I will sing of stately Aphrodite, gold-crowned and beautiful, whose
dominion is the walled cities of all sea-set Cyprus. There the moist
breath of the western wind wafted her over the waves of the loud-
moaning sea in soft foam, and there the gold-filleted Hours welcomed
her joyously. They clothed her with heavenly garments: on her head
they put a fine, well-wrought crown of gold, and in her pierced ears
they hung ornaments of orichalc and precious gold, and adorned her
with golden necklaces over her soft neck and snow-white breasts,
jewels which the gold- filleted Hours wear themselves whenever they go
to their father's house to join the lovely dances of the gods. And
when they had fully decked her, they brought her to the gods, who
welcomed her when they saw her, giving her their hands. Each one of
them prayed that he might lead her home to be his wedded wife, so
greatly were they amazed at the beauty of violet-crowned Cytherea." -
Homer, Hymn to Aphrodite

"Then it was the turn of Aphrodite. Hanging back a little, she tilted
her head so that her hair fell forward, concealing a blush on her
face. Then she loosened the girdle of her robe and beneath it, Paris
caught sight of her perfectly formed breast, white as alabaster.
'Paris,' she said, and her voice seemed to sing inside his head. 'Give
me the apple and in return I will give you the gift of love. You will
possess the most beautiful woman in the land, a woman equal to me in
perfection of form. With her you will experience the greatest delights
of love-making. Choose me, Paris, and she will be yours.' -
Apollodorus, The Library


Aphrodite, who is mentioned often by Plutarch in connection with
Fortuna, is the goddess whose name is the root of this month's name.
Aphrodite is an interesting partner to Fortuna, as she was as
faithless as she was beautiful --- and dangerous. When the hero
Peleus was married to the sea-nymph Thetis, all the gods were invited
to the ceremony --- all but one that is. Eris, the slighted goddess,
happened to a specialist in sowing discord, so she maliciously
deposited a golden apple on the banquet table. The fruit was inscribed
with the legend, "For the fairest". Immediately all the goddesses
began to argue about whose beauty entitled her to be the rightful
possesor of this prize.Finally it was decided to put the dispute to
arbitration. Reasonably enough, the designated judge was to be the
most handsome mortal in the world. This turned out to be a noble
Trojan youth named Paris, who was serving as a shepherd at the time.
So the three finalists -- Aphrodite, Hera and Athena -- sought him out
in the meadow where he was tending his flocks.

Not content to leave the outcome to the judge's discernment, the three
goddesses proceeded to offer bribes. Hera, Queen of Olympus, took
Paris aside and told him she would help him rule the world. Athena,
goddess of war, said she would make him victorious in battle.
Aphrodite sized Paris up and decided he would be more impressed with
the guaranteed love of the most beautiful woman in the world. This was
Helen, who happened to be married to the king of Sparta.

Paris promptly awarded the golden apple to Aphrodite, who in turn
enabled him to elope with Helen, who thenceforth became notorious as
Helen of Troy. Helen's husband and his brother raised a Greek army to
retrieve his wife, and this was the inception of the Trojan War.

The Trojan War was, of course, not Aphrodite's fault, but her love for
Alexandros, and her meddling caused considerable misery and death
among both armies. Later (Iliad, book 5, line 311), Aphrodite, once
again, entered the fray to save the life of her son Aineias (Aeneas).
As she was shielding her staggering son from the thunderous assault of
Diomedes, she was wounded in the hand. Athene, another meddler in the
Trojan War, had given Diomedes the power to see the immortals on the
battlefield. She advised him (op. cit. 5.129) to avoid all the gods
except Aphrodite, "her at least you may stab". Diomedes lunged at
Aphrodite and his pitiless bronze spear tore through the robe that the
Graces had carefully woven and cut the flesh of her immortal palm. The
blood of the gods, ichor, poured darkly on her perfect skin (op. cit.
5.340) as she fled the battlefield and went to Mount Olympos (Olympus)
to seek comfort from Dione. Zeus advised her, "No, my child, not for
you are the works of warfare. Rather concern yourself only with the
lovely secrets of marriage..." (op. cit. 5.428)

Aphrodite was married to the god of smiths, Hephaistos. However, the
golden goddess apparently tended to abandon poor Hephaistos as soon as
his burly back was turned, for on many occasions she was to be found
in the arms of her lover. As a result of these romantic interludes,
Aphrodite bore three children to Ares: Deimos ("terror"), Phobos
("fear"), and a daughter named Harmonia ("concord"). It was even
suggested in the Homeric Hymn to Aphrodite that there were only three
deities who could resist the passions that Aphrodite aroused, and they
were Athena, Artemis, and Hestia. Note that all three were goddesses,
and all were also virgins by choice. With the exception of these
goddesses, however, anyone foolish enough to ignore Aphrodite was
courting disaster.

According to one legend, Aphrodite used her powers to punish Eos, the
goddess of the dawn. Eos made the mistake of engaging in a tryst with
Ares. The result of this unfortunate choice on the part of poor Eos
was that the jealous Aphrodite punished the dawn goddess with an
insatiable appetite for love (in other words, Aphrodite turned Eos
into what amounts to a nymphomaniac). This punishment had a profound
effect on Eos, for she was compelled to take a series of lovers,
including Cephalus, Tithonus, and Orion (indeed, take is the proper
term for the affairs, because Eos seemed to prefer abducting her
paramours, much to their dismay). The outcome of these unions was
often disastrous to the man involved, and so Aphrodite's revenge was
complete.

Valete bene!

Cato

Salvete Pius et al

By virtue of the LAW  Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix was entitled to to be subscribed to the Senate list and that is what I did. The truth is  Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix  was removed as a member of the Senate so that a candidate, in a contested race for Consul, could be appointed to his seat. That is the long and the short of it.

 
It is clearly stated by the edict removing him that he could come back to the Senate at any time but would not be counted as a Senator until he was formally made a Senator again. That is what my recently departed colleague did earlier this year.

The Lex Popillia senatoria states in part:

 

IV. ((Ius sententiae dicendae))

Higher magistrates and ex-magistrates shall be entitled to attend meetings of the senate.

A. Any flamen Dialis, dictator, censor, consul, or praetor shall be entitled to attend meetings of the senate and to vote therein; any tribunus plebis shall be entitled to attend meetings of the senate but not to vote therein.

B. No flamen Dialis, dictator, censor, consul, praetor, or tribunus plebis shall be counted toward the total number of senatores.

C. Any dictatorius, censorius, consularis, or praetorius shall be entitled to attend meetings of the senate and to vote therein, except one who has been deliberately passed over for sublection.

D. No dictatorius, censorius, consularis, or praetorius shall be counted toward the total number of senatores unless he or she has already been sublected by the censores.

In the edict removing Sulla from the Senate the Censors who did so stated the following:  

Ex Officio
Censores Gnaeus Equitius Marinus Marcus Octavius Gracchus quiritibus salutem plurimam dicunt.
EDICTVM CENSORIVM DE SENATORIBVS ADLEGENDIS 
 
I. According to Paragraph IV. A. 1. d. of the Constitution of Nova Roma, the censors have the powers of maintaining the Album Senatorium.
 
II. The Lex Popillia Senatoria establishes that the censors may remove senators from the Album Senatorium for cause. Furthermore, it stipulates that former consuls and former censors who are not enrolled in the Album Senatorium may still attend the meetings of the Nova Roman Senate and vote therein.
 
III. Section II c of the Lex Popillia Senatoria stipulates that the Censors shall provide a public explanation when we strike existing senators from the Senate list. Therefore the following public explanation is provided: Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix is stricken from the Senate list for nonparticipation in the Senate since October of 2757 auc.
 
IV. Future convening magistrates of the Senate of Nova Roma shall understand that Lucius Cornelius Sulla is welcome to join the Senate mailing list, participate in, and vote in meetings of the Senate of Nova Roma by virtue of his Consular and Censorius status. 
 
V. The Edictum Censorium de Senatu of ante diem IV Kal. Ianuarias MMDCCLVIII established the maximum size of the Senate as 36 senators until after the census of MMDCCLIX. The Lex Popillia Senatoria directs the censors to maintain the size of the Senate at this level, replacing senators who resign or are otherwise lost.
 
VI. Marcus Moravius Piscinus Horatianus is hereby appointed a Senator of Nova Roma.
Datum sub manibus nostris XVI Kal. NOVEMBRIS MMDCCLVIII a.u.c.
Given under our hands this 17th day of October 2006 CE
 
Gnaeus Equitius Marinus Marcus Octavius Gracchus
Censores, Novae Romae
****************************************************************************

Unlike some I actually adhere to what is actually written in the law.
 

Valete

Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
Censor

Salvete
 
That line should read That is what my recently departed colleague AND I  did earlier this year.
 
Valete
 
Tiberius Galerius Paulinus
 

---

To: nova-roma@yahoogroups.com
From: spqr753@...
Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2009 07:51:42 -0400
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Sulla in the Senate

M. Moravius Horatianus Quiritibus, cultoribus Deorum, et omnibus salutem plurimam dicit: Optime vos omnes

Hodie est ante diem V Kalendas Maias; haec dies comitialis est:

Felices natalis, Luci Grati ! Today is the birthday of Quaestor L.Gratius Nerva of Brasilia, where he also serves as Scriba Ludorum and Scriba Militaris

Feriae Latinae

"Those Alban nations who used to take part in the sacrifices upon the Alban Mount, the Albani, the Æsulani , the Accienses, the Abolani, the Bube tani , the Bolani , the Cusuetani, the Coriolani , the Fidenates , the Foretii, the Hortenses , the Latinienses, the Longulani , the Manates, the Macrales, the Mutucumenses, the Munienses, the Numinienses, the Olliculani, the Octulani, the Pedani , the Polluscini, the Querquetulani, the Sicani, the Sisolenses, the Tolerienses, the Tutienses, the Vimitellarii, the Velienses, the Venetulani, and the Vitellenses. Thus we see, fifty-three peoples of ancient Latium have passed away without leaving any traces of their existence." ~ C. Plinius Secundus, Historia Naturalis 3.9 (69)

The feriae Latinae, to which Pliny refers above, predates the Founding of Rome. The names of these earlier Latins was recorded on an archaic inscription. Some are recognizable even though the list represents a pre-urban era of Latium – Bola, Corioli, Fidenae, and Pedum. The Hortenses came from a Latin people in Tuscany. The Aesulae are mentioned by Horace, but nothing else is known of them. The Longulani were overtaken by the Volscii. To these can be added the Albani, Tolerienses and Tutienses named for rivers or Mont Albano itself. Missing are the great urban centers of the historical period – Aricia, Lavinium, Praeneste, Tibur, Tusculum, and most conspicuously, Rome. Interesting are the Velienses listed, perhaps representing a village on the Velia, which is a ridge between the Esquiline and Palatine. And there were the Querquetulani on the list. Tacitus (Annales 6.65.1) tells us that the inhabitants of the Caelian Hill were called by this name because the Caelian was originally called mons Querquetulanus. So it appears that the feriae Latinae was celebrated before the villages of the seven hills, Septimonium, united to form Rome.

The festival was held on Mount Albano where legend placed Alba Longa, the birth-place of Romulus and Remus. A temple on Mount Albano that was used durig the feriae Latinae dates to the time of the Tarquinii, who legend attributes to having built it. Rome's presidency of the festival may date further back. In the historical period the feriae Latinae had become essentially a Roman festival of Latin cities. Upon entering office on 1 March, one of the first duties of the consules was to announce the date, generally late in April, on which the feriae Latinae would be celebrated. Even after the consules began to take office on 1 January (after 153 BCE), the traditional dates in late April were still used. Both consules of Rome had to attend, leaving the Cityprotected under the praefectus urbi. In the absence of both consuls a magister populi feriarum Latinarum causa was appointed to represent Rome. Only with the festival completed could consules leave for their provinces, although this was to change somewhat in such desperate times as with the war with Hannibal. Still it remained an obligation of the consules to attend to their religious duties, such as the feriae Latinae, before anything else. Thus the feriae Latinae held significant importance.

Each Latin city was to be represented by its highest magistrate. They assembled at the Tarquinian temple. The Roman consul initiated the rites with a libation of milk pour to Jupiter Latarius. Magistrates from other cities brought sheep, cheese, and other offerings. The Roman consul, acting on behalf of all the Latin cities, then sacrificed a pure white heifer who had never been yoked. Each city's representative received an equal portion of the sacrificial meat. Exclusion from this sacramental meal was to be excluded from the communion with the Gods and exclusion from the Latin League. Hung in the trees around the sacrament were oscilla. These were puppets, as were hung in trees at Paganalia, to represent the worshippers of the Gods. General festivities followed, celebrating the alliance of Rome and the Latins.


Death of Titus Tatius

"Some years subsequently the kinsmen of King Tatius ill-treated the ambassadors of the Laurentines. They came to seek redress from him in accordance with international law, but the influence and importunities of his friends had more weight with Tatius than the remonstrances of the Laurentines. The consequence was that he brought upon himself the punishment due to them, for when he had gone to the annual sacrifice at Lavinium, a tumult arose in which he was killed. Romulus is reported to have been less distressed at this incident than his position demanded, either because of the insincerity inherent in all joint sovereignty, or because he thought he had deserved his fate. He refused, therefore, to go to war, but that the wrong done to the ambassadors and the murder of the king might be expiated, the treaty between Rome and Lavinium was renewed." ~ Titus Livius 1.14


Our thought for today is from Epictetus' Enchiridion 49

"When any one shows himself vain, on being able to understand and interpret the works of Chrysippus, say to yourself: "Unless Chrysippus had written obscurely, this person would have had nothing to be vain of. But what do I desire? To understand Nature, and follow her. I ask, then, who interprets her; and hearing that Chrysippus does, I have recourse to him. I do not understand his writings. I seek, therefore, one to interpret them." So far there is nothing to value myself upon. And when I find an interpreter, what remains is to make use of his instructions. This alone is the valuable thing. But if I admire merely the interpretation, what do I become more than a grammarian, instead of a philosopher, except, indeed, that instead of Homer I interpret Chrysippus? When any one, therefore, desires me to read Chrysippus to him, I rather blush, when I cannot exhibit actions that are harmonious and consonant with his discourse."

Timothy or Stephen Gallagher wrote:

> By virtue of the LAW Lucius Cornelius Sulla Felix was entitled to to be subscribed to the Senate list[.]
>

Salve, Tiberi Galeri Pauline.

Not in this instance.

The lex Popillia senatoria IV.C says:

"Any /dictatorius/, /censorius/, /consularis/, or /praetorius/ shall be
entitled to attend meetings of the senate and to vote therein, except
one who has been deliberately passed over for sublection."

Note, again, "except one who has been deliberately passed over for
sublection".

III.B, C, D and E says (written together for brevity):

"They shall {first,next} sublect any
/{dictatorii,censorii,consulares,praetorii}/ (citizens who have
completed terms as /{dictator,censor,consul,praetor}/) who have not
already been sublected, removed, or passed over for sublection."

Note that these are the four positions named in IV.C. Note also that
these paragraphs say "shall", not "may". Any of these shall be added.

III.G says:

"They may pass over for sublection any citizen qualified under III.B, C,
D, or E whose past conduct they consider would be seriously harmful to
the dignity of the senate. They shall make public explanation of their
reason for doing so. "

Note the "may". This means that a citizen belonging to one of the four
classes specified in III.B, C, D and E will either be sublected or
passed over. There is no other alternative. This means that after the
next time the censors sublect new senators, there will be no
"non-senators" that have not been passed over for sublection. They were
either sublected or they weren't. And again, back to the beginning.

IV.C says:

"Any /dictatorius/, /censorius/, /consularis/, or /praetorius/ shall be
entitled to attend meetings of the senate and to vote therein, except
one who has been deliberately passed over for sublection."

Again, note "except one who has been deliberately passed over for
sublection", which according to the fully logical and complete chain
above means all non-senator dictatorius, censorius, consularis or
praetorius.

This does NOT cover why Sulla wasn't allowed to sit in the senate until
the censors sublected him by edict. This is covered in another paragraph.

III.F says:

"They shall next sublect citizens at their discretion, giving due weight
to their past tenure of public office, to their seniority, and to their
good character. These may include citizens who were passed over or
removed from the senate by previous /censores/."

This is another "shall"-point in the sublection iteration. The censors
don't have an option not to perform this point fully if they are
sublecting new senators. This has happened since Sulla was removed from
the senate. This is where Sulla would have been sublected along with
other senators after his removal, if he hadn't been passed over. Back
again.

IV.C says:

"Any /dictatorius/, /censorius/, /consularis/, or /praetorius/ shall be
entitled to attend meetings of the senate and to vote therein, except
one who has been deliberately passed over for sublection."

Again, note "except one who has been deliberately passed over for
sublection", which Sulla was, several times.

Q.E.D.

Vale, Pius.

Salve Tite Octavi,

> Note, again, "except one who has been deliberately passed over for
> sublection".

Excised, the same tired old argument that was debated on the Senate list
months ago. Suffice it to say, the censores of this year and the censores
of the year Sulla temporarily lost the "Senator" title do not agree with
your interpretation of "deliberately passed over".

This quibbling over the definition of a word in a needlessly complex rule
perfectly illustrates Nova Roma's decline into irrelevance.

Just a few days ago, we were discussed on another forum:

http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=26377

The general consensus there seems to be that Nova Roma is politics-obsessed
and not worth the effort to join.

The internal "laws" of this group are being used as a cudgel by its officers
to retaliate against people who annoy them. This has needlessly exposed
Nova Roma to legal liability.

And for what end?

Those in charge have risked everything, just to be able to keep those
other directors whom they hate in the dark.

Personally, whenever any law is vague or subject it to multiple interpretations,
I prefer to interpret it in a way that protects the rights of the individual.
That's the tradition of the country that I live in.

Why so much hate? Why expend so much energy, and bring about the destruction
of Nova Roma, just to revenge yourself on someone you don't like?

Imagine, what this place could have been, if it weren't for all these laws.
And all this intellectual effort wasted arguing about what "deliberately passed
over" means. Perhaps, if those in charge here valued human beings more than they
value words and definitions, Nova Roma could have been something.

Vale, M. Octavius Gracchus.

--
Matt Hucke (hucke@...), programmer.
author, Graveyards of Illinois - http://www.graveyards.com/
CYNICO.NET - hosting from $8.33/month; domains $13 - http://cynico.net/

Aurelianus to "Clodius" Sulla sal.

Please quit openly recruiting people for that snake-pit that is the Back Alley. If anyone wants to be there, they will join up the normal way . . . by following inuendo and rumor.

Vale.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Woolwine" <l_cornelius_sulla@...> wrote:
>
> Actually the constitution is not clear - this is the problem with our praetors running amuck.
>
> But hey lets begin the funeral rite for the ML with this little statistic:
>
> BA list for April - 3974 messages
> ML for April - 1232 messages
>
> If any citizen wishes to join the fun an educational list: BackAlley-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Vale,
>
> Sulla
>
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Lucius Coruncanius Cato <l.coruncanius_cato@> wrote:
> >
> > Lucius Coruncanius Cato omn SPD.
> >
> > As you say, cives are free to join any list to discuss matters outisde (not regarding) NR. For discussing issues within (about) NR, the Constitution is clear. And stating clearly some rules about those lists will spare all of us tons and tons of nonsense especulation.
> >
> > It could be shorter, but then we would be again arguing about what is 'free speech' and what is 'free beer'.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Di te incolumem custodiant.
> >
> > L. Coruncanius Cato
> >
> > Candidate to Aedilis Curulis
> >
> > --- El vie, 24/4/09, Robert Woolwine <l_cornelius_sulla@> escribió:
> > De: Robert Woolwine <l_cornelius_sulla@>
> > Asunto: [Nova-Roma] Re: Draft of a new edictum de sermone
> > Para: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> > Fecha: viernes, 24 abril, 2009 3:26
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > And, if you want to join a list with NO moderation at all. A list that has discussions about anything from the Religo, to politics to things outside of NR there is always the back alley list! :)
> >
> >
> >
> > Thank you for promulgating this Praetor this is the best reason to join the back alley!
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogrou ps.com, "Publius Memmius Albucius" <albucius_aoe@ ...> wrote:
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Praetores omnibus s.d.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > You will find in the files section of this Forum (Renewed_edictum_ de_sermone_ draft corr..doc)
> >
> > >
> >
> > > the draft edictum that Praetor Marinus and I have prepared, to set more transparent rules in this forum and limit the moderation periods.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > This draft has been sent yesterday to our tribunes (see below) in order that they may contribute, by their positive observations, to help us build the best tool as possible.
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Valete omnes,
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > P. Memmius Albucius
> >
> > > praetor, for the joint praetura
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Tribunis s.d.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > As announced, I am glad sending you, attached in Word format, the draft that Praetor maior Marinus and I have written down.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Its aims are:
> >
> > > - giving extensive and clear rules on moderation in NR public fora;
> >
> > > - introducing a transparent system which sets the freedom of speech as a principle and the moderation as an exception
> >
> > > - lowering the moderation periods : one month for our new members (currently 2 months), maxi 90 days for the hardest moderation (currently no limit).
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Please let us be aware of your observations and suggestions.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Valete,
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > P. Memmius Albucius pr.
> >
> > > for the praetura
> >
> > >
> >
>

Fl. Galerius Aurelianus Tribunus Plebis s.p.d.

In the event that this is considered to be the issuing of the new edictum de sermone, I pronounce intercessio against it on the basis of violating 3.b. of the Constitution in that this edictum doesn't advance the mission and function of Nova Roma.

Vale.

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "Publius Memmius Albucius" <albucius_aoe@...> wrote:
>
> Praetores omnibus s.d.
>
> You will find in the files section of this Forum (Renewed_edictum_de_sermone_draft corr..doc)
>
> the draft edictum that Praetor Marinus and I have prepared, to set more transparent rules in this forum and limit the moderation periods.
>
> This draft has been sent yesterday to our tribunes (see below) in order that they may contribute, by their positive observations, to help us build the best tool as possible.
>
>
> Valete omnes,
>
>
> P. Memmius Albucius
> praetor, for the joint praetura
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Tribunis s.d.
>
> As announced, I am glad sending you, attached in Word format, the draft that Praetor maior Marinus and I have written down.
>
> Its aims are:
> - giving extensive and clear rules on moderation in NR public fora;
> - introducing a transparent system which sets the freedom of speech as a principle and the moderation as an exception
> - lowering the moderation periods : one month for our new members (currently 2 months), maxi 90 days for the hardest moderation (currently no limit).
>
> Please let us be aware of your observations and suggestions.
>
> Valete,
>
>
> P. Memmius Albucius pr.
> for the praetura
>