C. Petronius Dexter flamen Portunalis M. Moravio Piscino sal.,

> Beginning in January, Albucius began to abuse his office in relation to our Collegia and set Nova Roma on a course towards a secularism run by monotheists.

I think those words come from a fanatical opinion. War of religions is not in course today in Nova Roma. Secularism is not a monotheism's issue, it may be a civil opinion, but everybody knows that unfortunately monotheism issues more fanatism than secularism.

> If left to them Nova Roma will abandon the Religio Romana. I am not.

About what religio Romana do you call? Do you think a religion which is used to treat a consul as "impious" if you want it, and with a collegium pontificum in your side and a collegium augurum as your own. But that it is not the religio Romana, it is only your religion, the religio Piscina.

> Cato, Albucius, and their cohorts are commiting a crime before the Citizens of Nova Roma as well as before the Gods.

Please, you are only a man. Stop to call yourself Gods! And why this care about citizens of Nova Roma? You said to us, you do not care Nova Roma.

> I, unlike you Petroni, stand against their falsehoods and injustices.

You stand against nothing like that. I wonder if your forever spite against them, is not the problem. All that is your problem in which you involved many people.

But now citizens are tired of your stubborn hatred, your tyrannic manners, we want to live in Nova Roma all together, even if we have many opinions and contrary advices. It is the basement of the Res Publica. You want to leave something in which there are other opinions than yours, get off! The gates of Nova Roma are wide open. Go and build Piscina Roma.

> That is the true reason that I am to be prosecuted, because I will not submit to the abusus potentatis of Albucius.

P. Albucius did not abuse his consul powers.

You treated him as impious because you did not perform the auguries he asked in order to convene the Senate. You are in a great augurial fault, do not accuse the others, please.

An augur performs the auspicies, it is his duty. You did not. So, instead of calling Albucius "impious" or instead of saying he abused his powers, you just had have to do your augur job.

Optime vale.

C. Petronius Dexter
tribunus Plebis Arcoiali scribebat
Idibus Octobribus P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.

Cato Piscino omnibusque in foro SPD

Piscinus, I will simply state that your remark:

"...and set Nova Roma on a course towards a secularism run by monotheists...Cato, Albucius, and their cohorts are commiting a crime...before the Gods."

is an outright, blatant lie.

I challenge you, on your honor as a cultore Deorum and as a pontiff, to prove this statement by showing a single post in which I encourage saecularism over the honoring of the sacra publica. One post in which I encourage the dishonoring of the gods of the State. One.

Remember that honoring the gods of the State and honoring the sacra publica is *not* the same as showing you any kind of respect *or* obeying you simply because you say something. You are not the gods, you are not the sacra publica, and you are not the religiones Romanae.

Valete,

Cato

EX OFFICIO AEDILIS L. IVLIAE P. ANNAEI

Official Aedilician Report: North American Conventus 2010/2763

L. Iulia Aquila omnibus civibus SPD.


08Oct2010
Friday morning Novi Romani are graciously welcomed to the Castra Rota by our hosts Sonja and Adriano Rota aka Legatus Pro Praetore (et Tribine) C. Aquillius Rota, his sons Chris aka Marcus and Traianus and their many cats and dogs. Piscinus and the Military had already been on site for a day or two; Maria and I arrived the night before. Petronius arrived this evening in time for our first dinner in the Taverna. Wonderful Gifts were exchanged between Novi Romani but I will only mention a few I received: from Petronius a precious authentic Roman coin with Faustina on one side and Venus on the obverse and a gift of a very special story in Latin, from Maria I received a much needed leather pouch and White Amber perfume, from Scholastica an exquisite poster of one of her very own drawings of an ancient woman in a Khiton. But there were more gifts; gifts that will always burn brightly in my heart; laughter, smiles, voices and a camaraderie that made us all feel we were at home.
A most precious gift of friendship.
This first day was very hectic as we worked to prepare for the throngs of visitors – we certainly could have used some servitors as in ancient Rome and were fortunate that this was a light day.
Opportunities were abundant to share our knowledge and tales of various aspects of Rome. At my booth the students asked questions about the many different charms and talismans I had displayed, the Gods and of course the Larariums - which often led to other Roman topics. The scheduled Lararium demonstration was relocated to my booth as the situation dictated. Sonja Rota taught about the food she was serving – including the bread and cheese which was fresh and homemade. We enjoyed Lentils, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's cheese and homemade bread, fresh fruit and also vinegar water and honey water. There was also a pen with two sheep and a goat.
Dinner that night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was not just special because we were all together but also because we welcomed our friend Petronius who came all the way from Paris France to join us in this most wonderful undertaking. Like a true Roman, he pitched in but he also delighted us with his wonderful warm humor and wit. Dinner included Lentils, grapes, extra sharp cheddar cheese, homemade Bread, homemade cheese, fresh fruit and other delights – and the wine flowed. As did the Pomegranate Vodka for some of us.

09Oct2010
What a busy day! With everything already in place we got right down to the business of being Novi Romani; in Tunicae, Pallae and Togae we greeted the inquisitive Saturday crowds, many of whom were educators and students. There were many blocks of time when my booth was surrounded by students asking many many questions – talks continued regarding the Gods, the Larariums, the talismans and much interest about the jewelry including the gems related to ancient times. They did not buy anything but they learned a lot – I also gave away lots of self drying clay so they could copy some of the Roman designs themselves and the younger children reveled in the stories geared for their ages. It was an enriching experience for me and I hope it was for the attendees as well.
The soldiers held court in different groups to teach about their arms, the medic Paulus Arrus Silvanus gave a very interesting talk on Roman Medicine and there were various other presentations on other aspects of the Roman Military. Dr Sailer was impressive with her informative presentation on the Egypt – Roman connection and stayed afterwards to talk to a group of very interested students. The Pilum throw was a big hit and I hope to be able to post a video soon of Saturday's festivities! At our lunch break (same menu as Friday) I provided Latin books: I read a love poem in English than Petronius read it in Latin and our Magistra, Scholastica, read an excerpt from the Aeneid. She also recited an excerpt from memory. We were joined by others as well for the readings. There was wool spinning demonstrations and Maria and others got to try their hand at it, Maria did very well! The pottery demonstration was magnificent and a few even went home with a handmade clay pot.
Dinner Saturday night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a delicious pork belly, artichokes, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's cheese, Quail eggs, salad, fresh fruit and all the wine one could drink!
That night after dinner we all met in Rota's living room and discussed Nova Roma until late in the night or early in the morning, while we drank wine and ate stuffed dates.
Everyone left pleasantly tired and satisfied!

10Oct2010
Sunday, a relaxing day for us all. We began with a Ientaculum for Novi Romani and the Rota family only, of regular eggs cooked on an outdoor griddle, hard boiled Quail eggs, homemade Farmer's cheese, fresh fruit, homemade Bread, butter and honey – water, tea and coffee. We did not stick to the schedule this day; our Pontifex Maximus did not perform the dedication to Mars, Magistra's clothing demonstration was not done and the Piscinus' prepared presentation never got started. But we did manage to enter many discussions; I almost drowned in Latin immersions by naively positioning myself in between Magistra and Petronius! We all got to know each other better with many topics on ancient Rome and Piscinus led a discussion in the evening regarding the future of the Religio.
And we ate. Lentils, cheese a big hunk of homemade bread for lunch.
Dinner at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a whole roasted wild hog caught by Legatus Pro Praetore Rota's friend Pee Wee!!!! Absolutely delicious! Tomato salad, Greens, olives, cheese homemade bread, fresh fruit and lots of wine.
We bid Piscinus farewell as he was to leave early in the morning.

11Oct2010
Monday, the last day and night of the Conventus, we pulled together to fulfill the promised schedule! At a brunch-time Ientaculum which consisted of regular eggs cooked on a griddle, with maple cured bacon, homemade Farmer's cheese, fresh fruit, homemade Bread, butter and honey etc. we set the schedule for the day! Magistra Scholastica would give her wonderful presentation on ancient clothing and Flamen Portunalis Petronius and I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ, would compose the simple but elegant coming of age ceremony, a Toga Virilis Ritual for Marcus Aquillius Rota, filius of C. Aquilius and his wife Sonja.
Scholastica mesmerized us with her beautiful clothing and her lovely presentation. The men, as well as the women, asked questions as well – our Magistra is a wealth of information – and has a great sense of humor, but I leave that to the reader to find out on their own by attending the next Conventus.
I watched as Petronius made the libum, and it was the best libum we all have ever tasted – the Gods were pleased.
The Toga Virilis Ritual was an inspiring and moving affair. Flamen Portunalis Petronius led the rite in Latin, I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ et Sacerdos Veneris Genetricis, assisted and translated in English, Magistra Scholastica and Sacerdos Vestalis Maria assisted us both. Dominus Rota removed the Toga Praetexta and placed the Toga Virilis and Domina Sonja removed the bulla and offered the nuts on the altar.
The text is as follows:

*************
Favete Linguis!!!

PRAEFATIO

Iane pater, te hoc ture commouendo
bonas preces precor
uti sies uolens propitius
Marco Aquillio Rotae, domo, familiaeque eius!

Father Ianus, in offering this incense to you I pray good prayers, so that you may be propitious to Marcus Aquillius Rota, to his house,
and to his household

PRECATIO

Iane pater, Quirine pater, Geni Marci Aquillii Rotae
uos precor, oro et obtestor
uti sietis uolentes propitii
Marco Aquillio Rotae, inter pubes intranti.

Father Ianus, Father Quirinus, Genius of Marcus Aquillius Rota so that it may be propitious to
Marcus Aquillius Rota entering into pubes

SACRIFICIUM

Quirine pater, Quiritium pater,
sisto dexter, uolens, propitius,
Marco Aquillio Rotae ex impube in pubes transeunti.
uti te bulla ommovenda, nucibus commouendis
bonas preces precatus sum,
eiusdem rei ergo macte uino inferio esto!

Father Quirinus, Father of the Quirites
be favorable and propitious to Marcus Aquillius Rota as he crosses the threshold from child to a man.
As I prayed to you good prayers in offering this bullae and these nuts for the sake of this be honored by this inferior wine offered in libation.

PIACULUM

Iane, Quirine, Vesta,
geni Marci Aquillii Rotae,
Omnes Di Immortales quocumque nomine:
si quidquam uobis in his sacris displicuit,
hoc uino libando, hoc libo commouendo,
ueniam peto
et vitium meum expio.

Janus, Quirinus, Vesta genius of Marcus Aquillius Rota, all gods by the names you are called; if there is something in this ceremony that displeases You in offering this wine, in offering this libum, I beg your forgiveness for my error.

**********

We then enjoyed the last feast of the Conventus at the Triclinium in the Taverna! Wild Hog, Lentils, fresh fruit, fresh homemade bread and cheese, olives, wine etc. etc.

Having experienced cooler weather just a few days before, South Carolina warmed up for the week so we had cool sweater weather nights and warm days in the 80's which brought out our friends the gnats during the day and mosquitoes in early evening but we co-existed peacefully – well mostly except for the wasp who entered the Triclinium as an uninvited guest one night and was quickly escorted out!

Many thanks to our gracious and generous hosts who treated us all like honored guests and beloved friends.
This was an experience I, and the others who attended, will not soon forget.
We left richer and wiser than when we first arrived and forged friendships that have the potential of lasting a lifetime.
We can also look forward to a Latin-Southern American English Dictionary!

Photos can be viewed here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/l_j_a/sets/72157625048031627/
I am waiting on others to submit any photos they may have taken to add to our album and I have some videos that I will post as soon as they are edited.

VIVAT RES PUBLICA NOSTRA PROSPERRIME!

Valete Optime Quirites,

L. Iulia Aquila
Ædilis Curulis Novæ Romæ
Sacerdos Veneris Genetricis
Praefectus Regio Tennessee : Provincia A.Æ
Procurator : Provincia A.Æ
Sacerdos Prima A.Æ
Accensa P. Memmio K. Buteone (II) cos. ‡ MMDCCLXIII a.u.c.
Idibus Octobribus P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.

M. Hortensia Maior peregrina civibus cultoribusque spd;

I will be leaving this week to visit with Livia and Lentulus in Pannonia, it is something I've looked forward to enormously. I've corresponded with them over the years and now we can meet. We will be holding a sellisternia, a dinner, in honour of Bona Dea in response to a vow I made last December. As well as other rituals.

I expect to learn a lot about how to conduct a ritual, have great discussions on how to live a life of Romanitas. And expect to share this with others.


Citizens, Peregrini we can all share rituals to the gods and Ancient Roman culture with others, if we don't then it is all a sterile online exercise.

dii nobis favent!!
M. Hortensia Maior
Pro Romae et Diis!

C. Maria Caeca omnibus in foro S. P. D.

I've just been enjoying the pictures posted by out Curule Aedile on Flickr,
and, from what I can tell, they are wonderful, and caught the spirit of our
Conventus nicely! I'll only comment on 1, because there is an amusing back
story.

There is a picture of me, sitting at a small table, with a kitten in front
of me. If I'm correct, this was taken at the 'gate" where the public came
in to experience our presentations and such. Well, originally, some of our
Roman soldiers were to staff the gate, take admission, and so forth.
Unfortunately, one group couldn't come, and so ...I became the fearsome gate
guard! Don't I look absolutely terrifying? Now, there were several cats of
all ages at the Rota establishment, and it seemed to me that if I sat down
or just stopped moving, I had a kitten (or more) near, around or on, me,
which was perfectly fine ...but ...it is a little difficult to look austere
and daunting while doing "gate guard" duty ...with kitten!

At one point, and this is in the video that Julia made, I believe, I am
sitting there, with 3 kittens all lined up on the front edge of the table,
helping me do my duty, no doubt, LOL!

Valete bene,
Maria, who may mistaking this picture for another one showing another
moment, shrug.

>
>
> A. Tullia Scholastica L. Juliae Aquilae C. Aquillio Rotae quiritibus bonae
> voluntatis S.P.D.
>
>
> EX OFFICIO AEDILIS L. IVLIAE P. ANNAEI
>
> Official Aedilician Report: North American Conventus 2010/2763
>
> L. Iulia Aquila omnibus civibus SPD.
>
> 08Oct2010
> Friday morning Novi Romani are graciously welcomed to the Castra Rota by our
> hosts Sonja and Adriano Rota aka Legatus Pro Praetore (et Tribine) C.
> Aquillius Rota, his sons Chris aka Marcus and Traianus and their many cats and
> dogs. Piscinus and the Military had already been on site for a day or two;
> Maria and I arrived the night before.
>
> ATS: And I arrived while Maria (and almost everyone else) slept, and you
> were tucked away in your motel.
>
>
> Petronius arrived this evening in time for our first dinner in the Taverna.
> Wonderful Gifts were exchanged between Novi Romani but I will only mention a
> few I received: from Petronius a precious authentic Roman coin with Faustina
> on one side and Venus on the obverse and a gift of a very special story in
> Latin, from Maria I received a much needed leather pouch and White Amber
> perfume, from Scholastica an exquisite poster of one of her very own drawings
> of an ancient woman in a Khiton.
>
> ATS: Actually it is a print of a drawing I made, and she is a more recent
> model (circa 1920) in a reconstructed Doric peplos. The older, highly
> inaccurate, terminology referred to the peplos as the Doric chiton, but we now
> distinguish the peplos from the khiton. The former is native Greek, and
> woolen, whereas the latter is imported, and linen...not to mention unisex
> (albeit in various forms), whereas the peplos was a strictly feminine garment.
>
>
> But there were more gifts; gifts that will always burn brightly in my heart;
> laughter, smiles, voices and a camaraderie that made us all feel we were at
> home.
>
> ATS: We (or most of us, anyway) had a wonderful time.
>
> A most precious gift of friendship.
>
> ATS: Indeed.
>
>
> This first day was very hectic as we worked to prepare for the throngs of
> visitors – we certainly could have used some servitors as in ancient Rome and
> were fortunate that this was a light day.
> Opportunities were abundant to share our knowledge and tales of various
> aspects of Rome. At my booth the students asked questions about the many
> different charms and talismans I had displayed, the Gods and of course the
> Larariums - which often led to other Roman topics. The scheduled Lararium
> demonstration was relocated to my booth as the situation dictated. Sonja Rota
> taught about the food she was serving – including the bread and cheese which
> was fresh and homemade. We enjoyed Lentils, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's
> cheese and homemade bread, fresh fruit and also vinegar water
>
> ATS: Methinks this is called posca. It tastes better than it sounds in
> English.
>
>
> and honey water. There was also a pen with two sheep and a goat.
> Dinner that night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was not just special
> because we were all together but also because we welcomed our friend Petronius
> who came all the way from Paris France to join us in this most wonderful
> undertaking. Like a true Roman, he pitched in but he also delighted us with
> his wonderful warm humor and wit. Dinner included Lentils, grapes, extra sharp
> cheddar cheese, homemade Bread, homemade cheese, fresh fruit and other
> delights – and the wine flowed. As did the Pomegranate Vodka for some of us.
>
> 09Oct2010
> What a busy day! With everything already in place we got right down to the
> business of being Novi Romani; in Tunicae, Pallae and Togae we greeted the
> inquisitive Saturday crowds, many of whom were educators and students. There
> were many blocks of time when my booth was surrounded by students asking many
> many questions – talks continued regarding the Gods, the Larariums, the
> talismans and much interest about the jewelry including the gems related to
> ancient times. They did not buy anything but they learned a lot – I also gave
> away lots of self drying clay so they could copy some of the Roman designs
> themselves and the younger children reveled in the stories geared for their
> ages. It was an enriching experience for me and I hope it was for the
> attendees as well.
> The soldiers held court in different groups to teach about their arms, the
> medic Paulus Arrus Silvanus gave a very interesting talk on Roman Medicine and
> there were various other presentations on other aspects of the Roman Military.
> Dr Sailer was impressive with her informative presentation on the Egypt –
> Roman connection and stayed afterwards to talk to a group of very interested
> students. The Pilum throw was a big hit and I hope to be able to post a video
> soon of Saturday's festivities! At our lunch break (same menu as Friday) I
> provided Latin books: I read a love poem in English than Petronius read it in
> Latin and our Magistra, Scholastica, read an excerpt from the Aeneid. She also
> recited an excerpt from memory. We were joined by others as well for the
> readings. There was wool spinning demonstrations and Maria and others got to
> try their hand at it, Maria did very well! The pottery demonstration was
> magnificent and a few even went home with a handmade clay pot.
> Dinner Saturday night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a delicious pork
> belly, artichokes, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's cheese, Quail eggs, salad,
> fresh fruit and all the wine one could drink!
> That night after dinner we all met in Rota's living room and discussed Nova
> Roma until late in the night or early in the morning, while we drank wine and
> ate stuffed dates.
> Everyone left pleasantly tired and satisfied!
>
> 10Oct2010
> Sunday, a relaxing day for us all. We began with a Ientaculum for Novi Romani
> and the Rota family only, of regular eggs cooked on an outdoor griddle, hard
> boiled Quail eggs, homemade Farmer's cheese, fresh fruit, homemade Bread,
> butter and honey – water, tea and coffee. We did not stick to the schedule
> this day; our Pontifex Maximus did not perform the dedication to Mars,
> Magistra's clothing demonstration was not done and the Piscinus' prepared
> presentation never got started. But we did manage to enter many discussions;
> I almost drowned in Latin immersions by naively positioning myself in between
> Magistra and Petronius!
>
> ATS: Ah, the wonders of Latin immersion! It was so nice to be able to
> chat with someone else in Latin...and to meet a couple of my students! Cito
> Latiné loqueris, as one of the early Assimil lessons says.
>
> Wasn¹t this the day when we had the nude swim? ;-)
>
>
> We all got to know each other better with many topics on ancient Rome and
> Piscinus led a discussion in the evening regarding the future of the Religio.
> And we ate. Lentils, cheese a big hunk of homemade bread for lunch.
> Dinner at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a whole roasted wild hog caught by
> Legatus Pro Praetore Rota's friend Pee Wee!!!! Absolutely delicious! Tomato
> salad, Greens, olives, cheese homemade bread, fresh fruit and lots of wine.
> We bid Piscinus farewell as he was to leave early in the morning.
>
> 11Oct2010
> Monday, the last day and night of the Conventus, we pulled together to fulfill
> the promised schedule! At a brunch-time Ientaculum which consisted of regular
> eggs cooked on a griddle, with maple cured bacon, homemade Farmer's cheese,
> fresh fruit, homemade Bread, butter and honey etc. we set the schedule for the
> day! Magistra Scholastica would give her wonderful presentation on ancient
> clothing and Flamen Portunalis Petronius and I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ, would
> compose the simple but elegant coming of age ceremony, a Toga Virilis Ritual
> for Marcus Aquillius Rota, filius of C. Aquilius and his wife Sonja.
> Scholastica mesmerized us with her beautiful clothing and her lovely
> presentation. The men, as well as the women, asked questions as well – our
> Magistra is a wealth of information – and has a great sense of humor, but I
> leave that to the reader to find out on their own by attending the next
> Conventus.
>
> ATS: It¹s a shame more of us could not attend. They have no idea how
> much they missed. The food was exquisite, day after day of authentic Roman
> food; lots of companionship and conversations in English, Latin, French, and
> German, for you see, academics are required to know all of the above (and then
> some).
>
>
> I watched as Petronius made the libum, and it was the best libum we all have
> ever tasted – the Gods were pleased.
> The Toga Virilis Ritual was an inspiring and moving affair. Flamen Portunalis
> Petronius led the rite in Latin, I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ et Sacerdos Veneris
> Genetricis, assisted and translated in English, Magistra Scholastica and
> Sacerdos Vestalis Maria assisted us both. Dominus Rota removed the Toga
> Praetexta and placed the Toga Virilis and Domina Sonja removed the bulla and
> offered the nuts on the altar.
> The text is as follows:
>
> *************
> Favete Linguis!!!
>
> PRAEFATIO
>
> Iane pater, te hoc ture commouendo
> bonas preces precor
> uti sies uolens propitius
> Marco Aquillio Rotae, domo, familiaeque eius!
>
> Father Ianus, in offering this incense to you I pray good prayers, so that you
> may be propitious to Marcus Aquillius Rota, to his house,
> and to his household
>
> PRECATIO
>
> Iane pater, Quirine pater, Geni Marci Aquillii Rotae
> uos precor, oro et obtestor
> uti sietis uolentes propitii
> Marco Aquillio Rotae, inter pubes intranti.
>
> Father Ianus, Father Quirinus, Genius of Marcus Aquillius Rota so that it may
> be propitious to
> Marcus Aquillius Rota entering into pubes
>
> SACRIFICIUM
>
> Quirine pater, Quiritium pater,
> sisto dexter, uolens, propitius,
> Marco Aquillio Rotae ex impube in pubes transeunti.
> uti te bulla ommovenda, nucibus commouendis
> bonas preces precatus sum,
> eiusdem rei ergo macte uino inferio esto!
>
> Father Quirinus, Father of the Quirites
> be favorable and propitious to Marcus Aquillius Rota as he crosses the
> threshold from child to a man.
> As I prayed to you good prayers in offering this bullae and these nuts for the
> sake of this be honored by this inferior wine offered in libation.
>
> PIACULUM
>
> Iane, Quirine, Vesta,
> geni Marci Aquillii Rotae,
> Omnes Di Immortales quocumque nomine:
> si quidquam uobis in his sacris displicuit,
> hoc uino libando, hoc libo commouendo,
> ueniam peto
> et vitium meum expio.
>
> Janus, Quirinus, Vesta genius of Marcus Aquillius Rota, all gods by the names
> you are called; if there is something in this ceremony that displeases You in
> offering this wine, in offering this libum, I beg your forgiveness for my
> error.
>
> **********
>
> We then enjoyed the last feast of the Conventus at the Triclinium in the
> Taverna! Wild Hog, Lentils, fresh fruit, fresh homemade bread and cheese,
> olives, wine etc. etc.
>
> Having experienced cooler weather just a few days before,
>
> ATS: You mean it was under 85? I must say, however, that I have never
> been more comfortable at 90 degrees than I was at Conventus...
>
>
> South Carolina warmed up for the week so we had cool sweater weather nights
> and warm days in the 80's which brought out our friends the gnats during the
> day and mosquitoes in early evening but we co-existed peacefully –
>
>
> ATS: Bug spray is good, bug spray is nice...
>
>
> well mostly except for the wasp who entered the Triclinium as an uninvited
> guest one night and was quickly escorted out!
>
> ATS: What about the other hexapod, the one of prodigious size?
>
>
> Many thanks to our gracious and generous hosts who treated us all like honored
> guests and beloved friends.
>
> ATS: I second that! Many, many thanks are due to the Rota family for
> providing us with a wonderful experience.
>
>
> This was an experience I, and the others who attended, will not soon forget.
>
> ATS: Indeed we won¹t!
>
>
>
> We left richer and wiser than when we first arrived and forged friendships
> that have the potential of lasting a lifetime.
> We can also look forward to a Latin-Southern American English Dictionary!
>
> ATS: LOL! You didn¹t mention that we also received instruction in
> Southern dialect English, where things are very strange...what sounds like a
> compliment is actually an insult, and the second person plural pronoun keeps
> getting pluralized in odd fashions. Wonder if any of Petronius¹ friends in
> Paris will understand his new Southern expressions...and, pray tell, what has
> happened to the grits? I never got a single bite of them despite eating some
> meals offsite, whereas in the past one could not get a meal without a helping
> thereof.
>
> Many, many thanks to all involved with the planning and execution of this
> wonderful event! Macte!
>
>
>
> Photos can be viewed here:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/l_j_a/sets/72157625048031627/
> I am waiting on others to submit any photos they may have taken to add to our
> album and I have some videos that I will post as soon as they are edited.
>
> ATS: I shall hold you to your promise about a certain video...
>
> VIVAT RES PUBLICA NOSTRA PROSPERRIME!
>
> Valete Optime Quirites,
>
> L. Iulia Aquila
> Ædilis Curulis Novæ Romæ
> Sacerdos Veneris Genetricis
> Praefectus Regio Tennessee : Provincia A.Æ
> Procurator : Provincia A.Æ
> Sacerdos Prima A.Æ
> Accensa P. Memmio K. Buteone (II) cos. ‡ MMDCCLXIII a.u.c.
> Idibus Octobribus P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.
>
>
> Vale, et valete.
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Petronius L. Juliae Aquilae omnibusque s.p.d.,

As you write, I arrived on Oct 08th evening. Plane landed in Savannah airport around 8 pm. C. Aquillius Rota came and picked me up as a Roman guy, he was dressed in tunic! Imagine, airport, night and a Roman in tunic! By Jove, it was easy for me to know that this man was Rota, but I strongly hoped that his car was more modern. :o)

>>> A most precious gift of friendship.

Indeed! Rota family was a kind host of this Conventus. C. Rota is working hard for his business and I raise my glass to Castra Rota! Gods bless you, Rota family!

For the night, I lodged in a motel looking like 60's country very nice and quiet. I took ages to understand how worked the shower handle/button. :o)

> 09Oct2010
> What a busy day!

Yes, it was! As I came from autumnal Paris and I landed by night, I had not realized that I was in South USA with a summer time for me in October! Palms, tropical trees, mosquitoes, summer sun and blue sky!

>>> With everything already in place we got right down to the business of being Novi Romani; in Tunicae, Pallae and Togae we greeted the inquisitive Saturday crowds, many of whom were educators and students.<<<

I wore my largest tunica because of the heat.

>>> At our lunch break (same menu as Friday) I provided Latin books: I read a love poem in English than Petronius read it in Latin <<<

Tibullus is so pleasant to read.

>>> and our Magistra, Scholastica, read an excerpt from the Aeneid. She also recited an excerpt from memory.<<<

A memorable performance.

>>> We were joined by others as well for the readings. <<<

Did you notice that some hesitate to quit us.

>>> There was wool spinning demonstrations and Maria and others got to try their hand at it, Maria did very well!<<<

She looked like a Vestal handweaving the dress of Vesta.

>>> The pottery demonstration was magnificent and a few even went home with a handmade clay pot.<<<

Yes, it was professional and interesting.

>>> Dinner Saturday night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a delicious pork belly, artichokes, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's cheese, Quail eggs, salad, fresh fruit and all the wine one could drink! <<<

I tasted a delicious homemade moretum cheese! Good eatin'

>>> That night after dinner we all met in Rota's living room and discussed Nova Roma until late in the night or early in the morning, while we drank wine and ate stuffed dates.
> Everyone left pleasantly tired and satisfied!<<<

Nova Roma indeed is an endless subject of discussion, we were forced to stop speaking only by the tiredness.

>>> 10Oct2010

Sunday, a relaxing day for us all.<<<

This day PeeWee the "boarhunter" prepared pieces of the beast on the fire. It was great and it reminded me of Obelix. When PeeWee showed me the picture of the boar killed, I believed the boar was a bear.

> 11Oct2010
>>> Scholastica mesmerized us with her beautiful clothing and her lovely presentation. The men, as well as the women, asked questions as well – our Magistra is a wealth of information – and has a great sense of humor, but I leave that to the reader to find out on their own by attending the next Conventus.<<<

Yes a very precious Greek and Roman wardrobe.

> I watched as Petronius made the libum, and it was the best libum we all have ever tasted – the Gods were pleased.

It was the first time I made a libum with cheese Rota's moretum. It tasted good even for human beings. Gods were pleased too.

> The Toga Virilis Ritual was an inspiring and moving affair.

Yes it was.

>>>Flamen Portunalis Petronius led the rite in Latin, I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ et Sacerdos Veneris Genetricis, assisted and translated in English, Magistra Scholastica and Sacerdos Vestalis Maria assisted us both. Dominus Rota removed the Toga Praetexta and placed the Toga Virilis and Domina Sonja removed the bulla and offered the nuts on the altar.<<<

We seriously performed this ritual in honor of Marcus Aquillius Rota and during this ceremony a real spirit mood blew on all us.

>>> Many thanks to our gracious and generous hosts who treated us all like honored guests and beloved friends.<<<

Yes, I am very touched by the kindness of Gaius Rota and his family.

> This was an experience I, and the others who attended, will not soon forget.

Of course!

Optime valete.

C. Petronius Dexter
Arcoiali scribebat
A. d. XVI Kalendas Novembres P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.

Cato omnibus in foro SPD

Hodiernus dies est ante diem XVI Kalendas Novembris; haec dies comitialis est.


"After settling the army in their summer quarters, whilst all was
quiet among the Samnites the consul began to purify it by getting rid
of the mutinous spirits. Some were dismissed as having served their
time; others were pronounced to be incapacitated through age or
infirmity; others were sent home on furlough, at first separately,
then selected cohorts were sent together, on the ground that they had
passed the winter far from their homes and belongings. A large number
were transferred to different places, ostensibly for the needs of the
service. All these the other consul and the praetor detained in Rome
on various imaginary pretexts. At first, unaware of the trick that was
being played upon them, they were delighted to revisit their homes.
They soon, however, found out that even those who were first sent away
were not rejoining the colors and that hardly any were disbanded but
those who had been in Campania, and amongst these mainly the leading
agitators. At first they were surprised, and then they felt a
well-grounded apprehension that their plans had leaked out. "Now,"
they said, "we shall have to suffer court-martial, informers will give
evidence against us, we shall one after another be executed in secret;
the reckless and ruthless tyranny of the consuls and senators will be
let loose on us." The soldiers, seeing how those who were the backbone
of the conspiracy had been cleverly got rid of by the consuls, did not
venture to do more than whisper these things to one another. One
cohort, which was stationed not far from Antium, took up a position at
Lantulae in a narrow pass between the mountains and the sea to
intercept those whom the consul was sending home on the various
pretexts mentioned above. They soon grew to a very numerous body, and
nothing was wanting to give it the form of a regular army except a
general. They moved on into the Alban district, plundering as they
went, and entrenched themselves in a camp under the hill of Alba
Longa. After completing their entrenchments they spent the rest of the
day in arguing about the choice of a leader, as they had not
sufficient confidence in any one amongst themselves. But who could be
invited from Rome? Which of the patricians or plebeians would expose
himself to such peril, or to whom could the cause of an army maddened
by injustice be safely committed? The next day found them still
engaged in the discussion, when some of those who had been dispersed
in the marauding expedition brought back the information that Titus
Quinctius was cultivating a farm in the neighbourhood and had lost all
interest in his City and the honourable distinctions he had won. This
man belonged to a patrician house, and after achieving great
reputation as a soldier, had his military career cut short by a wound
which made him lame in one of his feet, and he betook himself to a
rural life, far from the Forum and its party struggles. On hearing his
name mentioned they recalled the man to mind, and hoping that all
might turn out well they ordered an invitation to be sent to him. They
hardly expected that he would come voluntarily, and prepared to
intimidate him into compliance. The messengers accordingly entered his
farmhouse in the dead of night and woke him up from a sound sleep, and
after telling him that there was no alternative, it must either be
authority and rank or, if he resisted, death, they carried him off to
the camp. On his arrival he was saluted as their commander, and all
dismayed as he was by the strangeness and suddenness of the affair,
the insignia of his office were brought to him and he was peremptorily
told to lead them to the City. Acting on their own impulse rather than
their leader's advice they plucked up their standards and marched in
hostile array as far as the eighth milestone on what is now the Appian
Way. They would have gone on at once to the City had they not received
word that an army was on its march, and that M. Valerius Corvus had
been nominated Dictator, with L. Aemilius Mamercus as his Master of
the Horse, to act against them. " - Livy, History of Rome 7.39

Valete bene!

Cato

Salvete Omnes;

The mention of Posca in the report on the conventus prompted me to
share a recipe for a similar dink I prepare and imbibe during the
summer. It is tangy, but quite refreshing.

It is called Switchel and has long roots in rural New England.

Recipes -

#1: 1/2 c apple cider vinegar, 1/4 c unsulphured molasses, 1/2 cup
honey, t candied ginger - minced, water sufficient to make 2 qts

#2: 1 c cider vinegar, 1 c dark honey, 1 T fresh ginger root - grated,
1 qt water

#3: 1 c Balsamic vinegar, 1 c light honey, 1/2 t ground ginger, 1/4 t
ground allspice, 1 qt water

#4: 1 c cider vinegar, 2 c. maple sugar, 1 c. unsulphured molasses, 2
t candied ginger - minced, 1 gal. water

Method for all: Warm 2 c water, dissolve in the sweet and spice,
simmer on low for 10 minutes, turn off heat and cool for 15 min. Pour
1 pt cold water into a jug, add the sugar-spice water. Add-in the
vinegar and top-off to stated volume with more cold water. Let set
overnight in the refrigerator

...and, for variation a bit more, my take on Sekanjibin, a Persian
sweet-sour drink...called by the Greeks, Oxymel...this is a syrup,
which is diluted with water (hot or cold, to taste):

4 c crystallized honey, 2 1/2 c water, 1 c white wine vinegar, 1/2 c
fresh mint leaves - lightly bruised

Heat the water and dissolve in the honey, when it comes to a boil add
the vinegar. Simmer for 1/2 hour. Add the mint, remove from fire, let
cool. Dilute to taste at a rate of 5 - 10 oz water to 1 oz syrup. This
keeps without refrigeration.

--
In amicitia et fide
P Ullerius Stephanus Venator
Civis et Poeta

Sodalitas Coquuorum et Cerevisiae Coctorum
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sodalis_Coq_et_Coq/

(sites subject to occasional updates)
http://www.facebook.com/p.ullerius.stfnus.venator
http://nrfb.korsoft.com/
http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/

Salvete Quirites!

I hereby condemn the way and base on which Consul Albucius have set up
the Praetorian formula on the claim laid by G. Equitius Cato vs. M.
Moravius Piscinus Horatianus, My reasons are that

1. The Senate session was legal and Marcus Moravius Horatianus
Piscinus was therefore obligated under the Constitution to convene the
Comitia Curiata;

2. Therefore the claim presented by Cato is false, misleading, and
violates the Leges Saliciae.

3. Albucius has, in Article 5 of his formula, rejected the claim of
the Actor that the Reus "committed a falsum when and because he has
“called the comitia curiata to witness the appointment of a dictator
despite the fact that no such appointment has been made”."

Therefore, none of the Actor's claim can be held. Rather, it must
follow that if the Reus did not commit a falsum in convening the
Comitia Curiata, then his conduct was in correlation with his
constitutional obligations. And under the Leges Saliciae no Citizen
may be prosecuted for fulfilling his or her Constitutional duties.

4. Albucius has assumed powers to which he is not entitled, ignoring
the Constitution and Leges Saliciae, the Senate, the SCU on
appointment of praetores, and the Collegia.

5. Albucius has not abided with the provisions of the Leges Salicia in
that he did not make his decision on the claim by the Actor within 72
hours as required by the lex salicia iudiciaria Pars prima II; just as
he did not abide with the Lex Salicia poenalis, pars VI. 1 on the
Exclusion of Offenses. He has likewise violated the Lex Salicia
iudicaria, Pars Secunda, para. V. A through D by issuing an improper
formula.

6. In his 'conclusio formula, article 7', Albucius has "recommended"
that the Reus be found guilty even before the tribunal has begun.
This is a violation of the Lex Salicia poenalis 6.2 and 3 that
requires the iudices to be instructed on the presumption of innocence
of the Reus and the burden of proof placed on the Actor.

7. The claim is incongruent in that the claim concerns the convening
of the Comitia Curiata on 29 July 2010, but has included an attachment
dated 7 July 2010 concerning an entirely different matter with regard
to the duties of the Comitia .

8. Albucius is committing ABUSUS POTESTATIS, as defined by the Lex
Salicia Poenalis 17.1, where in he as "a magistrate of Nova Roma has
used his magisterial powers to act against the lawful rights of a
person as defined by the laws and Constitution of Nova Roma, or to
gain illegal advantages for himself or for others," in as much as he
had publicly stated on the Nova-Roma main list that unless the
Collegium Pontificum expelled M. Hortensia as flamenica Carmentis he
would prosecute its Pontifex Maximus in the claim of the Actor. That
is, he has linked a dipute between himself as Consul with the
Collegium Pontificum involving his violation of the Constitution
III.A; VI.B.1 and VI.B.1.c, abusing his authority to extort the
Collegium Pontificum.

How can Albucius make recommendations to convict before a tribunal is
even heard? This is a gross abuse of authority and only shows further
that this is a political trial.

There is more than enough to issue a veto, but on the request of the
Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus I do not issue an
intercessio as Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus want to take these
false allegations head on in a coming trial. Pontifex Maximus Marcus
Moravius Horatianus Piscinushas my full support as I know that
Albucius even at our meeting in Stockholm was looking for a
confrontation with our Pontifx Maximus. I have offered to mediate
between Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus and
Albucius, the Pontifex Maximus has met every proposal for an agreement
with a positive attitude, while Albucius as I see it hasn't shown much
interest in compromising.

Because of this I condemn the way and base on which Consul Albucius
have set up the Praetorian formula on the claim laid by G. Equitius
Cato vs. M. Moravius Piscinus Horatianus,


*****************
Vale

Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus

Consul Iterum
Princeps Senatus et Flamen Palatualis
Civis Romanus sum
http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page
************************************************
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
"I'll either find a way or make one"
************************************************
Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness
************************************************
Mons Palatinus, Clivus Victoriae
Palatine Hill, Incline of Victoriae

Caesar sal.

Oh how the wheel turns. I recall in the Cincinnatus trial, sponsored by Piscinus, that the court rejected the concept that Cincinnatus could not be prosecuted because he had a constitutional right to protect his property, rejected the concept of ownership of the list, rejected the rights under the law that limited the scope of Nova Roman legal reach, rejected all the contitutuonal and legal defences. In short the needs of the state, often trumpeted during those trials, was help supreme above the rights of an individual.

Here this consul claims that the session was legal, claims this, claims that. All claims, all assertions. He claims it is political, yet Piscinus, Modianus et al ushered in the political show trial concept. Now when allegedly stuck on the same sword as Cincinnatus was, the wriggling, moaning and complaining starts. I am sure that posts may pop up highlighting supposed differences in the two trials, but the bottom line to me is that if this is political in nature, then what is sauce for the goose should be sauce for the gander.

I also wonder who wrote points 1 to 8 for the consul, because the grammar and flow of the language is completely different from the last two paragraphs, which are clearly written in the consuls own style of English.

Why don't we just get on with the trial? Hopefully we can find someone in this trial of Piscinus to ape the style and behavior of Praetor Complutensis during the trial of Cincinnatus, in scourging the defendant and his advocatus, if he has one, with scathing comments, demeaning slights, impatience, obvious bias towards the prosecutor (Piscinus), legal wrigglings and all the other artifices of the show trial. If this is a show trial, a political trial, then let it be one based on the conduct of the trial of Cincinnatus. Fair is fair.

Personally I couldn't care less at this stage if it is a show trial or not, because it seems we have evidence from Dexter, who does not lie, that Piscinus has decided to found his own religious group outside of Nova Roma and cares nothing for NR. In which case why doesn't he save us all the agony of suspense and just quit? Why bother to go through with the trial? If he cares nothing for NR then logically he shouldn't care whether he is convicted or not, unless this is about ego and not principle. Why doesn't Piscinus just quit Nova Roma now? Cincinnatus simply withdrew and refused to recognize the farce of his trial, so if this trial is a farce as the junior consul claims, a show trial, then why doesn't Piscinus simply refuse to take part and do now what he is clearly planning to do later, and leave?

I also find it interesting that the junior consul who complains of political trials was the very same man (even before he declared himself a candidate for consul!) was advocating for a dictator in 2009. He was involved in planning, as was Piscinus, what is viewed by many of us as a political coup, the installation of a dictator, who equally many of us suspect would have been expected to engage in political purges in the senate. So if the junior consul is comfortable with politcal plotting and political purging, why not a political trial? Isn't it rather two faced of him to now object to what he claims is a political trial? Lets deal the cards and have full house of political this and political that.

Maybe the object lesson for the junior consul and Piscinus should be to be careful what you wish for. Maybe Nova Roma's own Cataline should heave himself up off his senatorial bench, take his followers, and leave what is no longered cared for, and sally forth out of the gates of Nova Roma.

I say to all those who sought to install a dictator that you have run your course, the game is played out, that your attempts to undermine the consular system of government failed, that your intentions to leave Nova Roma are exposed and that it is clear you intend to do as much damage to Nova Roma as you can before your inevitable departure.

I said Cataline, but that is too generous, too Roman. Let Nova Roma's own Sauruman and Wormtongue depart with their rag bag band of followers and go and wreck something else, for their power is almost faded, but for the love of all the Gods, just go....

Optime valete

Cn. Iulius Caesar
Senator
   

--- On Sun, 10/17/10, Christer Edling <christer.edling@...> wrote:

> From: Christer Edling <christer.edling@...>
> Subject: [SenatusRomanus] Condemnation of  Consul Albucius' call for a court against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> To: "Nova Roma -  Main list" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Cc: "Nova  Roma Announce" <novaroma-announce@yahoogroups.com>, "Nova  Roma -  Senatus" <SenatusRomanus@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Sunday, October 17, 2010, 9:50 AM
> Salvete Quirites!
>
> I hereby condemn the way and base on which Consul Albucius
> have set up 
> the Praetorian formula on the claim laid by G. Equitius
> Cato vs. M. 
> Moravius Piscinus Horatianus, My reasons are that
>
> 1. The Senate session was legal and Marcus Moravius
> Horatianus 
> Piscinus was therefore obligated under the Constitution to
> convene the 
> Comitia Curiata;
>
> 2. Therefore the claim presented by Cato is false,
> misleading, and 
> violates the Leges Saliciae.
>
> 3. Albucius has, in Article 5 of his formula, rejected the
> claim of 
> the Actor that the Reus "committed a falsum when and
> because he has 
> “called the comitia curiata to witness the appointment of
> a dictator 
> despite the fact that no such appointment has been
> made”."
>
> Therefore, none of the Actor's claim can be held. Rather,
> it must 
> follow that if the Reus did not commit a falsum in
> convening the 
> Comitia Curiata, then his conduct was in correlation with
> his 
> constitutional obligations. And under the Leges Saliciae no
> Citizen 
> may be prosecuted for fulfilling his or her Constitutional
> duties.
>
> 4. Albucius has assumed powers to which he is not entitled,
> ignoring 
> the Constitution and Leges Saliciae, the Senate, the SCU
> on 
> appointment of praetores, and the Collegia.
>
> 5. Albucius has not abided with the provisions of the Leges
> Salicia in 
> that he did not make his decision on the claim by the Actor
> within 72 
> hours as required by the lex salicia iudiciaria Pars prima
> II; just as 
> he did not abide with the Lex Salicia poenalis, pars VI. 1
> on the 
> Exclusion of Offenses. He has likewise violated the Lex
> Salicia 
> iudicaria, Pars Secunda, para. V. A through D by issuing an
> improper 
> formula.
>
> 6. In his 'conclusio formula, article 7', Albucius has
> "recommended" 
> that the Reus be found guilty even before the tribunal has
> begun.   
> This is a violation of the Lex Salicia poenalis 6.2 and 3
> that 
> requires the iudices to be instructed on the presumption of
> innocence 
> of the Reus and the burden of proof placed on the Actor.
>
> 7. The claim is incongruent in that the claim concerns the
> convening 
> of the Comitia Curiata on 29 July 2010, but has included an
> attachment 
> dated 7 July 2010 concerning an entirely different matter
> with regard 
> to the duties of the Comitia .
>
> 8. Albucius is committing ABUSUS POTESTATIS, as defined by
> the Lex 
> Salicia Poenalis 17.1, where in he as "a magistrate of Nova
> Roma has 
> used his magisterial powers to act against the lawful
> rights of a 
> person as defined by the laws and Constitution of Nova
> Roma, or to 
> gain illegal advantages for himself or for others," in as
> much as he 
> had publicly stated on the Nova-Roma main list that unless
> the 
> Collegium Pontificum expelled M. Hortensia as flamenica
> Carmentis he 
> would prosecute its Pontifex Maximus in the claim of the
> Actor. That 
> is, he has linked a dipute between himself as Consul with
> the 
> Collegium Pontificum involving his violation of the
> Constitution 
> III.A; VI.B.1 and VI.B.1.c, abusing his authority to extort
> the 
> Collegium Pontificum.
>
> How can Albucius make recommendations to convict before a
> tribunal is 
> even heard? This is a gross abuse of authority and only
> shows further 
> that this is a political trial.
>
> There is more than enough to issue a veto, but on the
> request of the 
> Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus I do
> not issue an 
> intercessio as Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus want to
> take these 
> false allegations head on in a coming trial. Pontifex
> Maximus Marcus 
> Moravius Horatianus Piscinushas my full support as I know
> that 
> Albucius even at our meeting in Stockholm was looking for
> a 
> confrontation with our Pontifx Maximus. I have offered to
> mediate 
> between Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus
> Piscinus and 
> Albucius, the Pontifex Maximus has met every proposal for
> an agreement 
> with a positive attitude, while Albucius as I see it hasn't
> shown much 
> interest in compromising.
>
> Because of this I condemn the way and base on which Consul
> Albucius 
> have set up the Praetorian formula on the claim laid by G.
> Equitius 
> Cato vs. M. Moravius Piscinus Horatianus,
>
>
> *****************
> Vale
>
> Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
>
> Consul Iterum
> Princeps Senatus et Flamen Palatualis
> Civis Romanus sum
> http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page
> ************************************************
> Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> "I'll either find a way or make one"
> ************************************************
> Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
> Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness
> ************************************************
> Mons Palatinus, Clivus Victoriae
> Palatine Hill, Incline of Victoriae
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>     SenatusRomanus-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>

Cato Fabio Quintiliano consule omnibusque in foro SPD

I would like to point out that, regardless of what may or may not have been said, by anyone other than myself, the full body of my petitio actionis, as accepted by the consul Memmius Albucius acting pro praetore, is as follows:

_____________________________________________________________________

C. Equitius Cato senatore Memmio Albucio consule omnibusque in foro SPD


I, Gaius Equitius Cato, announce my intention to the consul, acting on behalf of
the vacant praetura, to bring the charge of FALSUM against M. Moravius Piscinus.


(A) He called the comitia curiata to witness the appointment of a dictator
despite the fact that no such appointment has been made:

--------

"M. Moravius Piscinus Pontifex Maximus Lictoribus omnibus s. p. d.

All Lictores curiati of Nova Roma are to assemble for the Comitia Curiata
beginning at 00.00 hours CET Roma (18.00 hrs EST) on IV Kal. Sext. (29 July) in
order to invest Gnaeus Equitius Marinus, Censoirus et Magister Populi
designatus, with imperium for the office of dictator." - from message 78750, Mon
Jul 26, 2010 6:06 pm


--------

to which Gn. Equitius Marinus himself wrote:

--------


"I am NOT taking any oath of office until such time as the full Senate shall be
properly called by both Consuls to vote on the question. (Reading that last
sentence, I should also make clear that I require a proper majority vote of the
Senate before I will take office.)...Please ask the Consuls to provide us all
with a properly called session of the Senate to address the question that hangs
over us all." - from message 78961, Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:30 am

--------


(B) He has attempted to force members of the comitia curiata to break the law
and make themselves liable to charges under Nova Roman law, and he has illegally
attempted to "dismiss" at least one lictor in retaliation for refusing to break
the law per his direct instructions.

The comitia curiata is given the authority "To invest elected and appointed
magistrates with Imperium..." (Const. N.R. III.A.1)

As Gn. Equitius Marinus has been neither elected nor appointed to any office,
the lictors cannot be compelled to break the law by investing him with imperium;
yet in direct contradiction to this, Moravius Piscinus has threatened the
lictors openly - and even attempted to unilaterally "dismiss" one already:


---------

"Any lictor who disobeys this injunction of the Constitution by openly refusing
or neglecting to perform your constitutional duty is always subject to removal
from office by the Collegium Pontificum. I would hope we don't have to come to
that...So, if you oppose the dictatorship, just don't post a witness statement.
And don't tell me or anyone, publicly or privately, that you are knowingly not
posting a witness statement." - from message 78900, Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:08 am

"You have received your instructions as have all other Lictores curiati. My
instructions were that if you disagreed with the decision of the Senate that you
should remain silent. As you have done otherwise ... you are dismissed from the
Comitia Curiata and your appointment as a Lictor shall be reviewed by the
Collegium Pontificum at its next session." - from message 79017, Sun Aug 1, 2010
7:47 pm

----------


Under our law, the crime of FALSUM is defined - in part - as

"It shall be an offence knowingly and intentionally to provide false or
misleading information to other persons or bodies in such a way as to hinder
them in the fulfillment of their legal duties, to induce them to part with any
property or surrender any right which is theirs, or to incite them to perform an
action detrimental to their interests. This includes (but is not limited to)
intentional lies in front of a legal Novoroman tribunalis and knowingly
providing false information to a Novoroman magistrate." - lex Salicia poenalis,
pars altera 16.1


By threatening the comitia curiata - and illegally attempting to carry through
on his threat to act against any who disobeyed his instructions - Moravius
Piscinus has knowingly and intentionally provided false or misleading
information to other persons or bodies (the supposed appointment of Gn. Equitius
Marinus to the dictatorship to the comitia curiata and, by extension, the whole
citizenry of the Respublica) in such a way as to incite the lictors to perform
an action detrimental to their interests (breaking their oath to uphold the
Constitution, which empowers them to invest *only* appointed or elected
magistrates with imperium). He has committed the crime of FALSUM.

___________________________________________________________________

I would remind everyone that this - and no other - petitio actionis is the one which I have called for and which was accepted. It will stand - or fall - on its own merits, in a duly-convened court of Nova Roman law.

Valete,

Cato

C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.

Honorable senator, in my ongoing effort to grasp all of the facts of this case,
I greatly appreciate your referencing the original posts of the actors
involved.


However, I think you will find that (2) posts that you attribute to M. Moravius
Piscinus Pontifex Maximus were in fact posts from other members supposedly
quoting posts by M. Moravius Piscinus Pontifex Maximus. I reference messages
78900 & 79017 specifically. These (2) posts were from Lucius Cornelius Sulla
Felix and Valerianus Piscino respectfully.

If you could please find the actual post #s by M. Moravius Piscinus Pontifex
Maximus that were referenced so they could be examined directly it would be most
helpful if not just more factual to your argument.

Vale optime!




________________________________
From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sun, October 17, 2010 2:34:16 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Cato Fabio Quintiliano consule omnibusque in foro SPD

I would like to point out that, regardless of what may or may not have been
said, by anyone other than myself, the full body of my petitio actionis, as
accepted by the consul Memmius Albucius acting pro praetore, is as follows:

__________________________________________________________

C. Equitius Cato senatore Memmio Albucio consule omnibusque in foro SPD

I, Gaius Equitius Cato, announce my intention to the consul, acting on behalf of
the vacant praetura, to bring the charge of FALSUM against M. Moravius Piscinus.

(A) He called the comitia curiata to witness the appointment of a dictator
despite the fact that no such appointment has been made:

--------

"M. Moravius Piscinus Pontifex Maximus Lictoribus omnibus s. p. d.

All Lictores curiati of Nova Roma are to assemble for the Comitia Curiata
beginning at 00.00 hours CET Roma (18.00 hrs EST) on IV Kal. Sext. (29 July) in
order to invest Gnaeus Equitius Marinus, Censoirus et Magister Populi
designatus, with imperium for the office of dictator." - from message 78750, Mon
Jul 26, 2010 6:06 pm

--------

to which Gn. Equitius Marinus himself wrote:

--------

"I am NOT taking any oath of office until such time as the full Senate shall be
properly called by both Consuls to vote on the question. (Reading that last
sentence, I should also make clear that I require a proper majority vote of the
Senate before I will take office.)...Please ask the Consuls to provide us all
with a properly called session of the Senate to address the question that hangs
over us all." - from message 78961, Sat Jul 31, 2010 11:30 am

--------

(B) He has attempted to force members of the comitia curiata to break the law
and make themselves liable to charges under Nova Roman law, and he has illegally
attempted to "dismiss" at least one lictor in retaliation for refusing to break
the law per his direct instructions.

The comitia curiata is given the authority "To invest elected and appointed
magistrates with Imperium..." (Const. N.R. III.A.1)

As Gn. Equitius Marinus has been neither elected nor appointed to any office,
the lictors cannot be compelled to break the law by investing him with imperium;
yet in direct contradiction to this, Moravius Piscinus has threatened the
lictors openly - and even attempted to unilaterally "dismiss" one already:

---------

"Any lictor who disobeys this injunction of the Constitution by openly refusing
or neglecting to perform your constitutional duty is always subject to removal
from office by the Collegium Pontificum. I would hope we don't have to come to
that...So, if you oppose the dictatorship, just don't post a witness statement.
And don't tell me or anyone, publicly or privately, that you are knowingly not
posting a witness statement." - from message 78900, Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:08 am

"You have received your instructions as have all other Lictores curiati. My
instructions were that if you disagreed with the decision of the Senate that you
should remain silent. As you have done otherwise ... you are dismissed from the
Comitia Curiata and your appointment as a Lictor shall be reviewed by the
Collegium Pontificum at its next session." - from message 79017, Sun Aug 1, 2010
7:47 pm

----------

Under our law, the crime of FALSUM is defined - in part - as

"It shall be an offence knowingly and intentionally to provide false or
misleading information to other persons or bodies in such a way as to hinder
them in the fulfillment of their legal duties, to induce them to part with any
property or surrender any right which is theirs, or to incite them to perform an
action detrimental to their interests. This includes (but is not limited to)
intentional lies in front of a legal Novoroman tribunalis and knowingly
providing false information to a Novoroman magistrate." - lex Salicia poenalis,
pars altera 16.1

By threatening the comitia curiata - and illegally attempting to carry through
on his threat to act against any who disobeyed his instructions - Moravius
Piscinus has knowingly and intentionally provided false or misleading
information to other persons or bodies (the supposed appointment of Gn. Equitius
Marinus to the dictatorship to the comitia curiata and, by extension, the whole
citizenry of the Respublica) in such a way as to incite the lictors to perform
an action detrimental to their interests (breaking their oath to uphold the
Constitution, which empowers them to invest *only* appointed or elected
magistrates with imperium). He has committed the crime of FALSUM.

__________________________________________________________

I would remind everyone that this - and no other - petitio actionis is the one
which I have called for and which was accepted. It will stand - or fall - on
its own merits, in a duly-convened court of Nova Roman law.

Valete,

Cato







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

The posts from Piscinus commanding the lictores to disobey the Constitution and threatening them unless they did so (or to remain silent) were from the Comitia Curiata List, and were brought forward by members of the Comitia Curiata, to which I am not privileged to have access. However, any number of lictores could swear and testify that these are, in fact, direct quotes from Piscinus - and none, even those who promptly obeyed him - have denied these words.

Interestingly enough, even remaining silent would have put the lictores in a precarious position: the lex Salicia poenalis defines a crime as:

"A crime is committed in the moment when the reus acted or, in the case of a crime by omission, failed to act." (lex Sal. poen. 1.1)

So by commanding the lictores who disagreed with him to remain silent, Piscinus was instructing them to commit yet another crime: to fail to act against the crime he was instructing the rest to commit - the investment of imperium to a non-elected or appointed magistrate contrary to the Constitution.

Vale,

Cato

Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

If I may be blunt, Octavius Priscus, the whole scenario boils down to Pisciunus simply deciding what he wanted to do and how he wanted to do it, dragging the rest of the citizens - including the intended dictator - along behind him, regardless of what the Constitution or laws or mos maiorum of Nova Roma might be.

He believed he had the power, the support structure, and the sheer willpower to force the Respublica to bend to his will, using the threat of religion and the gods as a weapon, much like the mediæval papacy attempted to bring their opponents to heel with interdiction and excommunication.

Like those mediæval popes, he has diminished both the prestige and authority of the religious institutions he has been placed in a position from which he should instead have nourished and guided them, and has threatened the very foundations of the civil government of the Respublica.

He is, even now, attempting to pull cultores Deorum away from the Respublica to form a religion based on... well, him. He has, by his own words reported and sworn to by Petronius Dexter announced his intention to do so, and in fact even to leave Nova Roma. Why he continues to attack the consul maior and pull the puppet-strings of the consul minor is a mystery, unless it is to toss a grenade into what he believes are the ruins he has left behind in his wake.

I believe that he will find the Respublica full of citizens made of much sterner stuff than he gives us credit for.

Vale,

Cato

Fyi.



To: novaroma-announce@yahoogroups.com; senatusromanus@yahoogroups.com
CC: mhoratius@...; mlcinnyc@...; nr_senaculum@yahoogroups.com
From: albucius_aoe@...
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 2010 03:18:37 +0200
Subject: RE: [NovaRoma-Announce] So-called "condemnation" of Consul Albucius' call for a court against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus






Salve Collega,


I take good note of your �condemnation�, even if this word seems inappropriate, and of the friendly support that you bring to M. Moravius Piscinus Horatianus.


I will not remind our Quirites that you are the major responsible of the inconstitutional senatorial session of last July, which explains what you may still have some difficulties recognizing the major violation of our institutions that you did yourself.


I will not mention your argumentation on leges Saliciae and the pending judicial case, for I understand that it must read rather as a political position than as a sincere legal analysis : if it were, you would have vetoed the formula and reported these elements in your veto.
I would suggest, in addition, that you read yourself, and not trusting necessarily the probably sincere advices that you were given by other ones, our leges Saliciae : you will understand that they do not support your approach, which confuses our judicial system with current Western countries' institutions.


I will not either tell you the surprise to read under your hand that I would have ignored �the SCU on appointment of praetores� while you and your friends put all the possible obstacles to prevent the comitia centuriata that I had convoked to appoint our suffect praetors, and while *you*, once the Senate voted in a second time and on my proposal a senatus consultum ultimum to appoint Hon. Ullerius Venator and Tullia Scholastica, elected by the comitia, has vetoed their designation. It may be useful to remind you that, without your recurrent opposition and your friends' one, our suffect praetors would have been in office since last mid-July.
So either, dear colleague, you are of the utmost bad faith, or you are not conscious of your acts and of their possible consequences.


I will not comment on the contents of our meeting in April, when I drove up to you to Sweden, just for we had agreed to keep it private. I will just note that your allegation, according which I was �looking for a confrontation with our Pontifx Maximus�, is wrong and defamatory.
On your proposals of mediation, I prefer not reminding your last one. I am however ready to speak about it publicly, if necessary, and if you think that your dignitas will be reinforced by its evocation.

This said, and as I am naturally optimistic, if you think that your mediator's skills may work, I am ready, as acting pro praetore, to accept, if Hon. Equitius and Moravius also accept it, that the current judicial proceedings may be suspended during a nundinum to help the Parties to reach an agreement that I will be then happy to record, which will save every one time and energy. Please do not spare your efforts.



Vale Collega,




Albucius cos.
ag. p.p.

> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> CC: novaroma-announce@yahoogroups.com; SenatusRomanus@yahoogroups.com
> From: christer.edling@...
> Date: Sun, 17 Oct 2010 17:50:02 +0200
> Subject: [NovaRoma-Announce] Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Salvete Quirites!
>
> I hereby condemn the way and base on which Consul Albucius have set up
> the Praetorian formula on the claim laid by G. Equitius Cato vs. M.
> Moravius Piscinus Horatianus, My reasons are that
>
> 1. The Senate session was legal and Marcus Moravius Horatianus
> Piscinus was therefore obligated under the Constitution to convene the
> Comitia Curiata;
>
> 2. Therefore the claim presented by Cato is false, misleading, and
> violates the Leges Saliciae.
>
> 3. Albucius has, in Article 5 of his formula, rejected the claim of
> the Actor that the Reus "committed a falsum when and because he has
> �called the comitia curiata to witness the appointment of a dictator
> despite the fact that no such appointment has been made�."
>
> Therefore, none of the Actor's claim can be held. Rather, it must
> follow that if the Reus did not commit a falsum in convening the
> Comitia Curiata, then his conduct was in correlation with his
> constitutional obligations. And under the Leges Saliciae no Citizen
> may be prosecuted for fulfilling his or her Constitutional duties.
>
> 4. Albucius has assumed powers to which he is not entitled, ignoring
> the Constitution and Leges Saliciae, the Senate, the SCU on
> appointment of praetores, and the Collegia.
>
> 5. Albucius has not abided with the provisions of the Leges Salicia in
> that he did not make his decision on the claim by the Actor within 72
> hours as required by the lex salicia iudiciaria Pars prima II; just as
> he did not abide with the Lex Salicia poenalis, pars VI. 1 on the
> Exclusion of Offenses. He has likewise violated the Lex Salicia
> iudicaria, Pars Secunda, para. V. A through D by issuing an improper
> formula.
>
> 6. In his 'conclusio formula, article 7', Albucius has "recommended"
> that the Reus be found guilty even before the tribunal has begun.
> This is a violation of the Lex Salicia poenalis 6.2 and 3 that
> requires the iudices to be instructed on the presumption of innocence
> of the Reus and the burden of proof placed on the Actor.
>
> 7. The claim is incongruent in that the claim concerns the convening
> of the Comitia Curiata on 29 July 2010, but has included an attachment
> dated 7 July 2010 concerning an entirely different matter with regard
> to the duties of the Comitia .
>
> 8. Albucius is committing ABUSUS POTESTATIS, as defined by the Lex
> Salicia Poenalis 17.1, where in he as "a magistrate of Nova Roma has
> used his magisterial powers to act against the lawful rights of a
> person as defined by the laws and Constitution of Nova Roma, or to
> gain illegal advantages for himself or for others," in as much as he
> had publicly stated on the Nova-Roma main list that unless the
> Collegium Pontificum expelled M. Hortensia as flamenica Carmentis he
> would prosecute its Pontifex Maximus in the claim of the Actor. That
> is, he has linked a dipute between himself as Consul with the
> Collegium Pontificum involving his violation of the Constitution
> III.A; VI.B.1 and VI.B.1.c, abusing his authority to extort the
> Collegium Pontificum.
>
> How can Albucius make recommendations to convict before a tribunal is
> even heard? This is a gross abuse of authority and only shows further
> that this is a political trial.
>
> There is more than enough to issue a veto, but on the request of the
> Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus I do not issue an
> intercessio as Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus want to take these
> false allegations head on in a coming trial. Pontifex Maximus Marcus
> Moravius Horatianus Piscinushas my full support as I know that
> Albucius even at our meeting in Stockholm was looking for a
> confrontation with our Pontifx Maximus. I have offered to mediate
> between Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus and
> Albucius, the Pontifex Maximus has met every proposal for an agreement
> with a positive attitude, while Albucius as I see it hasn't shown much
> interest in compromising.
>
> Because of this I condemn the way and base on which Consul Albucius
> have set up the Praetorian formula on the claim laid by G. Equitius
> Cato vs. M. Moravius Piscinus Horatianus,
>
>
> *****************
> Vale
>
> Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
>
> Consul Iterum
> Princeps Senatus et Flamen Palatualis
> Civis Romanus sum
> http://www.novaroma.org/nr/Main_Page
> ************************************************
> Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> "I'll either find a way or make one"
> ************************************************
> Dignitas, Iustitia, Fidelitas et Pietas
> Dignity, Justice, Loyalty and Dutifulness
> ************************************************
> Mons Palatinus, Clivus Victoriae
> Palatine Hill, Incline of Victoriae
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Petronius P. Albucio consuli maiori omnibusque s.p.d.,

> So either, dear colleague, you are of the utmost bad faith, or you are not conscious of your acts and of their possible consequences.

I think those words are too diplomatic. Quintilianus is acting to leave Nova Roma and to build another organization. So, he knows what he do.

And this quote choosen as his own motto in the signature show us that he is stubborn to provoke the mess in Nova Roma before leaving:

> > Caeso Fabius Buteo Quintilianus
> > ************************************************
> > Aut inveniam viam aut faciam
> > "I'll either find a way or make one"
> > ************************************************

So, consul maior, please close the evil way the consul minor is making in a city which he does not care.

Optime vale.

C. Petronius Dexter
Arcoiali scribebat
A. d. XV Kalendas Novembres P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.

Cato Fabio Quintiliano consule Memmio Albucio consule omnibusque in foro SPD

Consul Albucius, you wrote:

"...if Hon. Equitius and Moravius also accept it, that the current judicial proceedings may be suspended during a nundinum to help the Parties to reach an agreement..."

I respect and admire your willingness to consider that there might be some agreement met between Piscinus and myself.

That being said, I state here absolutely and unequivocally that I will not accept anything less than a full, public court trial and sentence - whether I win or lose. I do not trust Piscinus as far as I could throw the Statue of Liberty and have not even a shred of faith that he would, even upon reaching any kind of private agreement, actually keep his word in public.

Even his calendar posting today reveals his utter determination to use religion as a coercive weapon.

I rely upon our law and the intelligence of our citizens.

Vale,

Cato

C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.

Thank you for responding senator. Yes, it would be difficult to reference
post#s that are not accessible to you and other non-Comitia Curiata and as such
I understand your use of hearsay. I trust that the parties you quote are
willing to testify and produce copies and or print screens of the original posts
from the Comitia Curiata?

I think that if the respublica was/is under threat of a coupe, then direct
evidence such as original posts, even from the Comitia Curiata, should be made
public for all to see.

Vale optime!




________________________________
From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sun, October 17, 2010 7:19:18 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

The posts from Piscinus commanding the lictores to disobey the Constitution and
threatening them unless they did so (or to remain silent) were from the Comitia
Curiata List, and were brought forward by members of the Comitia Curiata, to
which I am not privileged to have access. However, any number of lictores could
swear and testify that these are, in fact, direct quotes from Piscinus - and
none, even those who promptly obeyed him - have denied these words.

Interestingly enough, even remaining silent would have put the lictores in a
precarious position: the lex Salicia poenalis defines a crime as:

"A crime is committed in the moment when the reus acted or, in the case of a
crime by omission, failed to act." (lex Sal. poen. 1.1)

So by commanding the lictores who disagreed with him to remain silent, Piscinus
was instructing them to commit yet another crime: to fail to act against the
crime he was instructing the rest to commit - the investment of imperium to a
non-elected or appointed magistrate contrary to the Constitution.

Vale,

Cato







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.

Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the Pontifex
Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested in quite
frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the rhetoric and
hyperbole.

Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have stumbled into
Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how events led to
this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or ever be a
true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.

Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML; considering
her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed investigation?

Vale optime!






________________________________
From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sun, October 17, 2010 7:33:02 PM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

If I may be blunt, Octavius Priscus, the whole scenario boils down to Pisciunus
simply deciding what he wanted to do and how he wanted to do it, dragging the
rest of the citizens - including the intended dictator - along behind him,
regardless of what the Constitution or laws or mos maiorum of Nova Roma might
be.


He believed he had the power, the support structure, and the sheer willpower to
force the Respublica to bend to his will, using the threat of religion and the
gods as a weapon, much like the mediæval papacy attempted to bring their
opponents to heel with interdiction and excommunication.


Like those mediæval popes, he has diminished both the prestige and authority of
the religious institutions he has been placed in a position from which he should
instead have nourished and guided them, and has threatened the very foundations
of the civil government of the Respublica.

He is, even now, attempting to pull cultores Deorum away from the Respublica to
form a religion based on... well, him. He has, by his own words reported and
sworn to by Petronius Dexter announced his intention to do so, and in fact even
to leave Nova Roma. Why he continues to attack the consul maior and pull the
puppet-strings of the consul minor is a mystery, unless it is to toss a grenade
into what he believes are the ruins he has left behind in his wake.

I believe that he will find the Respublica full of citizens made of much sterner
stuff than he gives us credit for.

Vale,

Cato







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Cato omnibus in foro SPD

Hodiernus dies est ante diem XV Kalendas Novembris; haec dies comitialis est.

"As soon as they came into view and recognised the arms and standards,
the thought of their country instantly calmed the passions of them
all. They had not yet been hardened to the sight of civic bloodshed,
they knew of no wars but those against foreign foes, and secession
from their own countrymen began to be looked upon as the last degree
of madness. First the leaders then the men on both sides sought an
opening for negotiations. Quinctius, who had had enough of fighting
for his country and was the last man to fight against it, and Corvus,
who was devoted to all his countrymen, especially to the soldiers and
above all to his own army, came forward to a colloquy. When the latter
was recognised, his opponents showed as much respect for him as his
own men by the silence with which they prepared to listen to him. He
addressed them as follows: 'Soldiers! When I left the City I offered
up prayers to the immortal gods who watch over our State, your State
and mine, that they would of their goodness grant me, not a victory
over you, but the glory of bringing about a reconciliation. There have
been and there will be abundant opportunities for winning glory in
war, on this occasion we must seek for peace. That which I implored of
the immortal gods, when I offered up my prayers, you have it in your
power now to grant me if you will please to remember that you are
encamped not in Samnium, not amongst the Volscians, but on Roman soil.
Those hills which you see are the hills of your City; I, your consul,
am the man under whose auspices and leadership you twice defeated the
legions of the Samnites a year ago and twice captured their camp. I am
Marcus Valerius Corvus, soldiers, a patrician it is true, but my
nobility has shown itself in benefits to you, not in wrongs; I have
never been the author of any law bearing harshly on you or of any
oppressive enactment of the senate; in all my commands I have been
stricter with myself than with you. If noble birth, if personal merit,
if high office, if distinguished service could make any man proud, I
venture to say that such is my descent, such the proof I have given of
myself, such the age at which I obtained the consulship, being only
twenty-three, that I had it in my power to show myself harsh and
overbearing not only to the plebs but even to the patricians. What
have you heard that I have said or done as consul more than I should
had I been one of your tribunes? In that spirit I administered two
successive consulships, in that spirit will this dread Dictatorship be
administered; I shall not be more gentle towards these soldiers of
mine and of my country than to you who would be-I loathe the word-its
enemies.

'You then will draw the sword against me before I shall draw it
against you; if there is to be fighting it is on your side that the
advance will be sounded, on your side will the battle-shout and charge
begin. Make up your minds to do what your fathers and
grandfathers-those who seceded to the Sacred Mount and those who
afterwards took possession of the Aventine-could not make up their
minds to do! Wait till your wives and mothers come out from the City
with dishevelled hair to meet you as they once came to meet
Coriolanus! Then the Volscian legions refrained from attacking us
because they had a Roman for their general; will not you, an army of
Romans, desist from an impious war? Titus Quinctius! by whatever means
you were placed in your present position, whether willingly or
unwillingly, if there is to be a conflict, retire, I beg you to the
rearmost line; it will be more honourable for you to flee from a
fellow-citizen than to fight against your country. But if there is to
be peace you will take your place with honour amongst the foremost and
play the part of a beneficent mediator in this conference. Demand what
is just and you shall receive it, though we should acquiesce even in
what is unjust rather than embrue impious hands in one another's
blood.' T. Quinctius, bathed in tears, turned to his men and said:
'If, soldiers, I am of any use at all you will find that I am a better
leader in peace than in war. The words you have heard are not those of
a Volscian or a Samnite but of a Roman. They were spoken by your
consul, your commander, soldiers, whose auspices you have found by
experience to be favourable for you; do not desire to learn by
experience what they may be when directed against you. The senate had
at its disposal other generals more ready to fight against you; it has
selected the one man who has showed most consideration for his
soldiers, in whom you have placed most confidence as your commander.
Even those who have victory in their power wish for peace, what ought
we to wish for? Why do we not lay aside all resentment and ambitious
hopes-those treacherous advisers-and trust ourselves and all our
interests to his tried fidelity?' " - Livy, History of Rome 7.40


ROMAN REPUBLICAN TERMS - THE TWELVE TABLES

The Law of the Twelve Tables (Lex Duodecim Tabularum, more informally
simply Duodecim Tabulae) was the ancient legislation that stood at the
foundation of Roman law. The Law of the Twelve Tables formed the
centerpiece of the constitution of the Roman Republic and the core of
the mos maiorum. The Twelve Tables must be distinguished from the
unrelated, much older "twelve shields" of King Numa Pompilius. The
Ancile, in ancient Rome, is the legendary shield of the god Mars said
to have fallen from heaven upon Numa Pompilius. At the same time, a
voice was heard which declared that Rome should be mistress of the
world while the shield was preserved. The Ancile was, as it were, the
palladium of Rome. Though there was but one Ancile that fell from
heaven, there were twelve preserved, called the Ancilia; Numa, by the
advice, as it is said, of the nymph Egeria, ordered eleven others,
perfectly like the first, to be made. This was so that if anyone
should attempt to steal it, as Ulysses did the Palladium, they might
not be able to distinguish the true Ancile from the false ones.

These Ancilia were preserved in the temple of Mars, and were committed
to the care of twelve priests of Salii, instituted for that purpose.
They were carried every year, in the month of March, in procession
around Rome, and on the 30th day of that month, were again deposited
in their place.

According to traditional, semi-legendary historical accounts preserved
in Livy, during the earliest period of the Republic the laws were kept
secret by the pontifices and other representatives of the patrician
class, and were enforced with untoward severity, especially against
the plebeian class. A plebeian named Terentilius proposed in 462 BC
that an official legal code should be published, so that plebeians
could not be surprised and would know the law.

For several years patricians opposed this request, but in 451 BC a
Decemvirate, or board of ten men, was appointed to draw up a code.
They allegedly sent an embassy to study the legislative system of the
Greeks, particularly the laws of Solon, possibly in the Greek colonies
of southern Italy.

The first ten codes were completed by the first Decemvirate in 450 BC.
Here is how Livy describes their creation, "...every citizen should
quietly consider each point, then talk it over with his friends, and,
finally, bring forward for public discussion any additions or
subtractions which seemed desirable." The last two codes were
completed in 449 BC by the second Decemvirate, and after a secessio
plebis to force the Senate to consider them, the Law of the Twelve
Tables was formally promulgated. The Twelve Tables were literally
drawn up on twelve ivory tablets which were posted in the Forum
Romanum so that all Romans could read and know them.

The laws of the Twelve Tables were not a comprehensive statement of
all law; they are a sequence of definitions of various private rights
and procedures, similar to a bill of rights. They generally took for
granted such things as the institutions of the family, and various
rituals for formal transactions. For such an important document, it
is somewhat surprising that the original text has been lost. The
original tablets were destroyed when the Gauls under Brennus burnt
Rome in 390 BC. There was no other official promulgation of them to
survive, only unofficial editions. What we have of them today is brief
excerpts and quotations from these laws in other authors. They are
written in a strange, archaic, laconic, and somewhat childish and
sing-song version of Latin. As such, though we cannot tell whether the
quoted fragments accurately preserve the original form, what we have
gives us some insight into the grammar of early Latin.

Like most other primitive laws, they combine strict and rigorous
penalties with equally strict and rigorous procedural forms. In most
of the surviving quotations from these texts, the original table that
held them is not given. Scholars have guessed at where surviving
fragments belong by comparing them with the few known attributions. It
cannot be known with any certainty from what survives that the
originals ever were organised this way, or even if they ever were
organised by subject at all.

Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

Just as a matter of interest, the "hearsay" rule excludes public records and accounts and records of regularly conducted activity - both of which apply to the Comitia Curiata List; also, direct quotations from the published words of an individual are not considered "hearsay". I believe that for the purposes of the trial, the archives of the Comitia Curiata List should be opened to the iudices.

Vale,

Cato

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>
> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>
> Thank you for responding senator. Yes, it would be difficult to reference
> post#s that are not accessible to you and other non-Comitia Curiata and as such
> I understand your use of hearsay. I trust that the parties you quote are
> willing to testify and produce copies and or print screens of the original posts
> from the Comitia Curiata?
>
> I think that if the respublica was/is under threat of a coupe, then direct
> evidence such as original posts, even from the Comitia Curiata, should be made
> public for all to see.
>
> Vale optime!
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Sun, October 17, 2010 7:19:18 PM
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
>
> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
>
> The posts from Piscinus commanding the lictores to disobey the Constitution and
> threatening them unless they did so (or to remain silent) were from the Comitia
> Curiata List, and were brought forward by members of the Comitia Curiata, to
> which I am not privileged to have access. However, any number of lictores could
> swear and testify that these are, in fact, direct quotes from Piscinus - and
> none, even those who promptly obeyed him - have denied these words.
>
> Interestingly enough, even remaining silent would have put the lictores in a
> precarious position: the lex Salicia poenalis defines a crime as:
>
> "A crime is committed in the moment when the reus acted or, in the case of a
> crime by omission, failed to act." (lex Sal. poen. 1.1)
>
> So by commanding the lictores who disagreed with him to remain silent, Piscinus
> was instructing them to commit yet another crime: to fail to act against the
> crime he was instructing the rest to commit - the investment of imperium to a
> non-elected or appointed magistrate contrary to the Constitution.
>
> Vale,
>
> Cato
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense of those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than that I can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."

Vale,

Cato

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>
> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>
> Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the Pontifex
> Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested in quite
> frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the rhetoric and
> hyperbole.
>
> Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have stumbled into
> Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how events led to
> this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or ever be a
> true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
>
> Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML; considering
> her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed investigation?
>
> Vale optime!
>

C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.

Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius Piscinus
is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are you
aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this year?

Vale optime!




________________________________
From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense of
those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than that I
can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."

Vale,

Cato

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>
> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>
> Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the Pontifex
> Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested in
>quite
>
> frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the rhetoric
>and
>
> hyperbole.
>
> Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have stumbled into
>
> Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how events led to
>
> this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or ever be
>a
>
> true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
>
> Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
>considering
>
> her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed investigation?
>
> Vale optime!
>







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave,

We are all aware, since Piscinus posted it all over NR's newsgroups.

Vale,

Sulla

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 5:57 AM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...>wrote:

>
>
> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>
> Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> Piscinus
> is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
> you
> aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this year?
>
> Vale optime!
>
> ________________________________
> From: Cato <catoinnyc@... <catoinnyc%40gmail.com>>
>
> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
>
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
>
> Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense of
>
> those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> that I
> can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
>
> Vale,
>
> Cato
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> >
> > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> >
> > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> Pontifex
> > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested in
>
> >quite
> >
> > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> rhetoric
> >and
> >
> > hyperbole.
> >
> > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have stumbled
> into
> >
> > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how events
> led to
> >
> > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> ever be
> >a
> >
> > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> >
> > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> >considering
> >
> > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> investigation?
> >
> > Vale optime!
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla S.P.D.

It would seem to me that where the description of the group does not appear to mention Nova Roma that maybe recent statements about the PM leaving NR might be true. If this is so it would also seem that this may have been in the works since January. I also find it odd but may simply coincidental that Hortensia pops up surprisingly on the heals of the PM announcing his abandonment.

I think I may be finally seeing some clearer evidence here as to who the bad actors are.

Vale optime!


Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2010, at 11:14 AM, Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...> wrote:

> Ave,
>
> We are all aware, since Piscinus posted it all over NR's newsgroups.
>
> Vale,
>
> Sulla
>
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 5:57 AM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>>
>> Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
>> Piscinus
>> is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
>> you
>> aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this year?
>>
>> Vale optime!
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Cato <catoinnyc@... <catoinnyc%40gmail.com>>
>>
>> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
>>
>> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
>> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>>
>> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
>>
>> Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense of
>>
>> those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
>> that I
>> can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
>>
>> Vale,
>>
>> Cato
>>
>> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
>> Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>>>
>>> Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
>> Pontifex
>>> Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested in
>>
>>> quite
>>>
>>> frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
>> rhetoric
>>> and
>>>
>>> hyperbole.
>>>
>>> Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
>>> proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have stumbled
>> into
>>>
>>> Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how events
>> led to
>>>
>>> this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
>> ever be
>>> a
>>>
>>> true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
>>>
>>> Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
>>> considering
>>>
>>> her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
>> investigation?
>>>
>>> Vale optime!
>>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Ave,

Given the uncontested fact that the planning for the failed attempted
coup/dictatorship began well over a year ago - it would stand to reason that
once the coup failed their days in NR would be numbered because only a fool
would not think that those of us who supposed the constitutional authority
of Nova Roma would make sure justice at least has a chance to work its
course. Of course, if these individuals cared a lick for NR they should
just leave and allow those to remain to start fixing the damage that was
done to the organization and start healing the wounds that they created!

Vale,

Sulla

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:30 AM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...>wrote:

>
>
> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla S.P.D.
>
> It would seem to me that where the description of the group does not appear
> to mention Nova Roma that maybe recent statements about the PM leaving NR
> might be true. If this is so it would also seem that this may have been in
> the works since January. I also find it odd but may simply coincidental that
> Hortensia pops up surprisingly on the heals of the PM announcing his
> abandonment.
>
> I think I may be finally seeing some clearer evidence here as to who the
> bad actors are.
>
> Vale optime!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On Oct 18, 2010, at 11:14 AM, Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...<robert.woolwine%40gmail.com>>
> wrote:
>
> > Ave,
> >
> > We are all aware, since Piscinus posted it all over NR's newsgroups.
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Sulla
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 5:57 AM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...<jeancourdant%40yahoo.com>
> >wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> >>
> >> Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> >> Piscinus
> >> is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution?
> Are
> >> you
> >> aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> year?
> >>
> >> Vale optime!
> >>
> >> ________________________________
> >> From: Cato <catoinnyc@... <catoinnyc%40gmail.com> <catoinnyc%
> 40gmail.com>>
> >>
> >> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com> <Nova-Roma%
> 40yahoogroups.com>
>
> >> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> >>
> >> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> court
> >> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> >>
> >> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> >>
> >> Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> of
> >>
> >> those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> >> that I
> >> can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> >>
> >> Vale,
> >>
> >> Cato
> >>
> >> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com><Nova-Roma%
> 40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
>
> >> Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> >>>
> >>> Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> >> Pontifex
> >>> Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> in
> >>
> >>> quite
> >>>
> >>> frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> >> rhetoric
> >>> and
> >>>
> >>> hyperbole.
> >>>
> >>> Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> >>> proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> stumbled
> >> into
> >>>
> >>> Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> events
> >> led to
> >>>
> >>> this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> >> ever be
> >>> a
> >>>
> >>> true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> >>>
> >>> Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> >>> considering
> >>>
> >>> her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> >> investigation?
> >>>
> >>> Vale optime!
> >>>
> >>
> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Cato Octavio Prisco sal.

I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as may exist in a community like ours.

If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth (with him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what is happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances elsewhere.

There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.

Vale,

Cato

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>
> C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
>
> Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius Piscinus
> is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are you
> aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this year?
>
> Vale optime!
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
>
> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
>
> Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense of
> those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than that I
> can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
>
> Vale,
>
> Cato
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> >
> > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> >
> > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the Pontifex
> > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested in
> >quite
> >
> > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the rhetoric
> >and
> >
> > hyperbole.
> >
> > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have stumbled into
> >
> > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how events led to
> >
> > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or ever be
> >a
> >
> > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> >
> > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> >considering
> >
> > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed investigation?
> >
> > Vale optime!
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Ave!

Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a religion
centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?

The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals who
hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation - not
bound to any laws other than its own.

Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio Stegheria
(which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.

Vale,

Sulla

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...> wrote:

>
>
> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
>
> I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give
> himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as may
> exist in a community like ours.
>
> If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth (with
> him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what is
> happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances
> elsewhere.
>
> There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of
> action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
>
>
> Vale,
>
> Cato
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> >
> > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> >
> > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> Piscinus
> > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
> you
> > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> year?
> >
> > Vale optime!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
>
> > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> court
> > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> >
> >
> > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> >
> > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> of
> > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> that I
> > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Cato
> >
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > >
> > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > >
> > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> Pontifex
> > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> in
> > >quite
> > >
> > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> rhetoric
> > >and
> > >
> > > hyperbole.
> > >
> > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> stumbled into
> > >
> > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> events led to
> > >
> > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> ever be
> > >a
> > >
> > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > >
> > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> > >considering
> > >
> > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> investigation?
> > >
> > > Vale optime!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.

If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively resigned
both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on this, and
forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go forward with
a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real and good
works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?

I personally would like to see all the parties resolve their issues amicably and
begin the process of repairing the damage that has already been to the
Respublica.


I by no way mean to suggest I am against the PM in any fashion, for I really
don't know him, but if the parties are indeed irreconcilable then maybe the
statements made by the PM at the conventus, if true, offer a way out of the
crisis.

Just a thought.

Vale optime.




________________________________
From: Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 12:02:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus

Ave!

Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a religion
centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?

The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals who
hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation - not
bound to any laws other than its own.

Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio Stegheria
(which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.

Vale,

Sulla

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...> wrote:

>
>
> Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
>
> I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give
> himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as may
> exist in a community like ours.
>
> If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth (with
> him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what is
> happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances
> elsewhere.
>
> There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of
> action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
>
>
> Vale,
>
> Cato
>
> --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> >
> > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> >
> > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> Piscinus
> > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
> you
> > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> year?
> >
> > Vale optime!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
>
> > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> court
> > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> >
> >
> > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> >
> > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> of
> > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> that I
> > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Cato
> >
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > >
> > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > >
> > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> Pontifex
> > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> in
> > >quite
> > >
> > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> rhetoric
> > >and
> > >
> > > hyperbole.
> > >
> > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> stumbled into
> > >
> > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> events led to
> > >
> > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> ever be
> > >a
> > >
> > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > >
> > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> > >considering
> > >
> > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> investigation?
> > >
> > > Vale optime!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>
> A. Tullia Scholastica aegrotans C. Petronio Dextro Cn. Cornelio Lentulo
> quiritibus bonae voluntatis S.P.D.
>
>
>
> C. Petronius Cn. Lentulo suo s.p.d.,
>
>> > *Enormous Thanks* to all those participants who attended the Conventus,
>> even from the other side of the world, from Europe!
>
> I suspect that those words are for me. :o) I thank you too, mi Lentule, to
> understand how great was this meeting for almost all of us and very
> enlightening for me.
>
> ATS: Indeed. We had a wonderful time, not least because I got to meet
> another Latineloquens, and chat in Latin!
>
> Nova Roma is the organization that I dreamed. The main list of course is not
> her complete reflect, not at all, but you know that.
>
> First, I have to thank C. Aquillius Rota who has permitted this Conventus
> being. I thank him and his family very very deeply and respectfully.
>
> ATS: I add my thanks to them for accommodating and feeding us so well.
> The food was superb!
>
>
> I do not want to say more, I think he and Julia have to write an official
> report of the event. By the way, the T-shirt of the Conventus, even with the X
> more ;o) is great to wear!
>
> So, what a honor too to meet the aedilis curulis L. Julia Aquila in person.
> She is so energetic, and so devoted to Nova Roma. She also assisted me with
> serious for the emotional taking of the toga virilis of the older son of
> Aquilius Rota. A ceremony who satisfied everybody and made Nova Roma more
> hearty for all who participated in.
>
> ATS: Yes, it was a very nice ceremony.
>
>
>
> I also meet 2 delicious ladies, Maria Caeca and Tullia Scholastica,
>
> ATS: Benene sapio? Parvae muscae prope litus me optimam cenam habuere.
> ;-)
>
>
> very involved in Nova Roma success. What a great pleasure to meet them. By the
> way the Greek and Roman wardrobe of Scholastica is impressive and... heavy.
> :o)
>
> ATS: LOL! That it is, and I have lots more of these items at home. I
> don¹t know how Livia managed to get so many of hers into that basket on the
> video...
>
> I also met the pontifex maximus Piscinus. Famous meeting for me. I was there
> also to meet the PM of Nova Roma, a honorable member of the Collegium
> Pontificum. I thought a man, like you, my dear Lentulus, a man who could
> perform something religious, as you did during the Floralia last year, I
> thougth to meet a religious person very concerned by the Roman religio, so I
> brought to him a gift from Paris, from a serious numismate. A beautiful coin
> of the emperor Vespasianus with in its reverse written AVGVR above four tools
> of the rituals, the guttus, the lituus... but, instead of a religious man or a
> responsible pontifex I met somebody who seemed being swered from Nova Roma,
> using incense more to move away his face the mosquitos than as offering for
> the gods... He did nothing religious during all the Conventus, he did not
> perform any ritual of the religio Romana in honor of the gods for Nova Roma.
> Nothing. Not very professional for the pontifex maximus of Nova Roma in a
> Conventus of Nova Roma with moreover announced in the program that it will be
> performed ritual of the religio Romana.
>
> Finally, Lentule mi, for those who think that Nova Roma is in decline, I think
> that they are only sat in before their grumbling computers... and against all
> those grumblers, I will say Nova Roma is a great thing to share.
>
> ATS: I completely agree. Nova Roma is a wonderful organization, and
> these conventús, however small and remote, are a marvelous opportunity to meet
> other like-minded individuals. It is unfortunate that more of us could not
> attend. Few as we were, I met two of my students and a former student as well
> as another fine Latinist and enjoyed the opportunity to share my knowledge
> with the visitors to the site during the public portion of the conventus.
> Others might have been able to share the message of Romanitas had they been
> able to attend.
>
> Optime vale.
>
> C. Petronius Dexter
> Arcoiali scribebat
> Idibus Octobribus P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.
>
> Optime vale et valete.
>
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave,

Well, let me answer you in the long held Jewish mother's fashion by answering your question with another question. :). Given your observations just what conclusions can you come to based on what you have learned and your observations to date?

Vale

Sulla

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2010, at 1:50 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:

> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
>
> If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
> statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively resigned
> both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on this, and
> forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go forward with
> a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real and good
> works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?
>
> I personally would like to see all the parties resolve their issues amicably and
> begin the process of repairing the damage that has already been to the
> Respublica.
>
> I by no way mean to suggest I am against the PM in any fashion, for I really
> don't know him, but if the parties are indeed irreconcilable then maybe the
> statements made by the PM at the conventus, if true, offer a way out of the
> crisis.
>
> Just a thought.
>
> Vale optime.
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...>
> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 12:02:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Ave!
>
> Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a religion
> centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
> thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?
>
> The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals who
> hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation - not
> bound to any laws other than its own.
>
> Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
> identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio Stegheria
> (which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.
>
> Vale,
>
> Sulla
>
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> >
> > I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give
> > himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as may
> > exist in a community like ours.
> >
> > If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth (with
> > him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what is
> > happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances
> > elsewhere.
> >
> > There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of
> > action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> > Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
> >
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Cato
> >
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > >
> > > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> > Piscinus
> > > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
> > you
> > > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> > year?
> > >
> > > Vale optime!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> >
> > > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> > court
> > > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> > >
> > >
> > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > >
> > > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> > of
> > > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> > that I
> > > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> > >
> > > Vale,
> > >
> > > Cato
> > >
> > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > >
> > > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> > Pontifex
> > > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> > in
> > > >quite
> > > >
> > > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> > rhetoric
> > > >and
> > > >
> > > > hyperbole.
> > > >
> > > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> > stumbled into
> > > >
> > > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> > events led to
> > > >
> > > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> > ever be
> > > >a
> > > >
> > > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > > >
> > > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> > > >considering
> > > >
> > > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> > investigation?
> > > >
> > > > Vale optime!
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sta. Cornelia Aeternia L. Iuliae Aquilae Omnibus Civibus S.P.D.


The pics look awesome, I am glad everyone had a nice time, arrived and departed safely and made it back to their places of orgin safe and sound.

But one pic disturbs just a bit Julia, I see a Legionaire with a Wolf's Head on their Helm. It looks like either Wolf or Fox.


That's not real right? Faux correct?

Vale Optime,
Sta. Cornelia Aeternia

--- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com, "luciaiuliaaquila" <luciaiuliaaquila@...> wrote:
>
> EX OFFICIO AEDILIS L. IVLIAE P. ANNAEI
>
> Official Aedilician Report: North American Conventus 2010/2763
>
> L. Iulia Aquila omnibus civibus SPD.
>
>
> 08Oct2010
> Friday morning Novi Romani are graciously welcomed to the Castra Rota by our hosts Sonja and Adriano Rota aka Legatus Pro Praetore (et Tribine) C. Aquillius Rota, his sons Chris aka Marcus and Traianus and their many cats and dogs. Piscinus and the Military had already been on site for a day or two; Maria and I arrived the night before. Petronius arrived this evening in time for our first dinner in the Taverna. Wonderful Gifts were exchanged between Novi Romani but I will only mention a few I received: from Petronius a precious authentic Roman coin with Faustina on one side and Venus on the obverse and a gift of a very special story in Latin, from Maria I received a much needed leather pouch and White Amber perfume, from Scholastica an exquisite poster of one of her very own drawings of an ancient woman in a Khiton. But there were more gifts; gifts that will always burn brightly in my heart; laughter, smiles, voices and a camaraderie that made us all feel we were at home.
> A most precious gift of friendship.
> This first day was very hectic as we worked to prepare for the throngs of visitors – we certainly could have used some servitors as in ancient Rome and were fortunate that this was a light day.
> Opportunities were abundant to share our knowledge and tales of various aspects of Rome. At my booth the students asked questions about the many different charms and talismans I had displayed, the Gods and of course the Larariums - which often led to other Roman topics. The scheduled Lararium demonstration was relocated to my booth as the situation dictated. Sonja Rota taught about the food she was serving – including the bread and cheese which was fresh and homemade. We enjoyed Lentils, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's cheese and homemade bread, fresh fruit and also vinegar water and honey water. There was also a pen with two sheep and a goat.
> Dinner that night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was not just special because we were all together but also because we welcomed our friend Petronius who came all the way from Paris France to join us in this most wonderful undertaking. Like a true Roman, he pitched in but he also delighted us with his wonderful warm humor and wit. Dinner included Lentils, grapes, extra sharp cheddar cheese, homemade Bread, homemade cheese, fresh fruit and other delights – and the wine flowed. As did the Pomegranate Vodka for some of us.
>
> 09Oct2010
> What a busy day! With everything already in place we got right down to the business of being Novi Romani; in Tunicae, Pallae and Togae we greeted the inquisitive Saturday crowds, many of whom were educators and students. There were many blocks of time when my booth was surrounded by students asking many many questions – talks continued regarding the Gods, the Larariums, the talismans and much interest about the jewelry including the gems related to ancient times. They did not buy anything but they learned a lot – I also gave away lots of self drying clay so they could copy some of the Roman designs themselves and the younger children reveled in the stories geared for their ages. It was an enriching experience for me and I hope it was for the attendees as well.
> The soldiers held court in different groups to teach about their arms, the medic Paulus Arrus Silvanus gave a very interesting talk on Roman Medicine and there were various other presentations on other aspects of the Roman Military. Dr Sailer was impressive with her informative presentation on the Egypt – Roman connection and stayed afterwards to talk to a group of very interested students. The Pilum throw was a big hit and I hope to be able to post a video soon of Saturday's festivities! At our lunch break (same menu as Friday) I provided Latin books: I read a love poem in English than Petronius read it in Latin and our Magistra, Scholastica, read an excerpt from the Aeneid. She also recited an excerpt from memory. We were joined by others as well for the readings. There was wool spinning demonstrations and Maria and others got to try their hand at it, Maria did very well! The pottery demonstration was magnificent and a few even went home with a handmade clay pot.
> Dinner Saturday night at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a delicious pork belly, artichokes, Greek Olives, homemade Farmer's cheese, Quail eggs, salad, fresh fruit and all the wine one could drink!
> That night after dinner we all met in Rota's living room and discussed Nova Roma until late in the night or early in the morning, while we drank wine and ate stuffed dates.
> Everyone left pleasantly tired and satisfied!
>
> 10Oct2010
> Sunday, a relaxing day for us all. We began with a Ientaculum for Novi Romani and the Rota family only, of regular eggs cooked on an outdoor griddle, hard boiled Quail eggs, homemade Farmer's cheese, fresh fruit, homemade Bread, butter and honey – water, tea and coffee. We did not stick to the schedule this day; our Pontifex Maximus did not perform the dedication to Mars, Magistra's clothing demonstration was not done and the Piscinus' prepared presentation never got started. But we did manage to enter many discussions; I almost drowned in Latin immersions by naively positioning myself in between Magistra and Petronius! We all got to know each other better with many topics on ancient Rome and Piscinus led a discussion in the evening regarding the future of the Religio.
> And we ate. Lentils, cheese a big hunk of homemade bread for lunch.
> Dinner at the Triclinium in the Taverna was a whole roasted wild hog caught by Legatus Pro Praetore Rota's friend Pee Wee!!!! Absolutely delicious! Tomato salad, Greens, olives, cheese homemade bread, fresh fruit and lots of wine.
> We bid Piscinus farewell as he was to leave early in the morning.
>
> 11Oct2010
> Monday, the last day and night of the Conventus, we pulled together to fulfill the promised schedule! At a brunch-time Ientaculum which consisted of regular eggs cooked on a griddle, with maple cured bacon, homemade Farmer's cheese, fresh fruit, homemade Bread, butter and honey etc. we set the schedule for the day! Magistra Scholastica would give her wonderful presentation on ancient clothing and Flamen Portunalis Petronius and I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ, would compose the simple but elegant coming of age ceremony, a Toga Virilis Ritual for Marcus Aquillius Rota, filius of C. Aquilius and his wife Sonja.
> Scholastica mesmerized us with her beautiful clothing and her lovely presentation. The men, as well as the women, asked questions as well – our Magistra is a wealth of information – and has a great sense of humor, but I leave that to the reader to find out on their own by attending the next Conventus.
> I watched as Petronius made the libum, and it was the best libum we all have ever tasted – the Gods were pleased.
> The Toga Virilis Ritual was an inspiring and moving affair. Flamen Portunalis Petronius led the rite in Latin, I, Sacerdos Prima A.Æ et Sacerdos Veneris Genetricis, assisted and translated in English, Magistra Scholastica and Sacerdos Vestalis Maria assisted us both. Dominus Rota removed the Toga Praetexta and placed the Toga Virilis and Domina Sonja removed the bulla and offered the nuts on the altar.
> The text is as follows:
>
> *************
> Favete Linguis!!!
>
> PRAEFATIO
>
> Iane pater, te hoc ture commouendo
> bonas preces precor
> uti sies uolens propitius
> Marco Aquillio Rotae, domo, familiaeque eius!
>
> Father Ianus, in offering this incense to you I pray good prayers, so that you may be propitious to Marcus Aquillius Rota, to his house,
> and to his household
>
> PRECATIO
>
> Iane pater, Quirine pater, Geni Marci Aquillii Rotae
> uos precor, oro et obtestor
> uti sietis uolentes propitii
> Marco Aquillio Rotae, inter pubes intranti.
>
> Father Ianus, Father Quirinus, Genius of Marcus Aquillius Rota so that it may be propitious to
> Marcus Aquillius Rota entering into pubes
>
> SACRIFICIUM
>
> Quirine pater, Quiritium pater,
> sisto dexter, uolens, propitius,
> Marco Aquillio Rotae ex impube in pubes transeunti.
> uti te bulla ommovenda, nucibus commouendis
> bonas preces precatus sum,
> eiusdem rei ergo macte uino inferio esto!
>
> Father Quirinus, Father of the Quirites
> be favorable and propitious to Marcus Aquillius Rota as he crosses the threshold from child to a man.
> As I prayed to you good prayers in offering this bullae and these nuts for the sake of this be honored by this inferior wine offered in libation.
>
> PIACULUM
>
> Iane, Quirine, Vesta,
> geni Marci Aquillii Rotae,
> Omnes Di Immortales quocumque nomine:
> si quidquam uobis in his sacris displicuit,
> hoc uino libando, hoc libo commouendo,
> ueniam peto
> et vitium meum expio.
>
> Janus, Quirinus, Vesta genius of Marcus Aquillius Rota, all gods by the names you are called; if there is something in this ceremony that displeases You in offering this wine, in offering this libum, I beg your forgiveness for my error.
>
> **********
>
> We then enjoyed the last feast of the Conventus at the Triclinium in the Taverna! Wild Hog, Lentils, fresh fruit, fresh homemade bread and cheese, olives, wine etc. etc.
>
> Having experienced cooler weather just a few days before, South Carolina warmed up for the week so we had cool sweater weather nights and warm days in the 80's which brought out our friends the gnats during the day and mosquitoes in early evening but we co-existed peacefully – well mostly except for the wasp who entered the Triclinium as an uninvited guest one night and was quickly escorted out!
>
> Many thanks to our gracious and generous hosts who treated us all like honored guests and beloved friends.
> This was an experience I, and the others who attended, will not soon forget.
> We left richer and wiser than when we first arrived and forged friendships that have the potential of lasting a lifetime.
> We can also look forward to a Latin-Southern American English Dictionary!
>
> Photos can be viewed here:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/l_j_a/sets/72157625048031627/
> I am waiting on others to submit any photos they may have taken to add to our album and I have some videos that I will post as soon as they are edited.
>
> VIVAT RES PUBLICA NOSTRA PROSPERRIME!
>
> Valete Optime Quirites,
>
> L. Iulia Aquila
> Ædilis Curulis Novæ Romæ
> Sacerdos Veneris Genetricis
> Praefectus Regio Tennessee : Provincia A.Æ
> Procurator : Provincia A.Æ
> Sacerdos Prima A.Æ
> Accensa P. Memmio K. Buteone (II) cos. ‡ MMDCCLXIII a.u.c.
> Idibus Octobribus P. Memmio K. Fabio II coss.
>

Livia Scholasticae sal.

> ATS: LOL! That it is, and I have lots more of these items at home.
> I
> don¹t know how Livia managed to get so many of hers into that basket on
> the
> video...
>

Unfortunately I know no shrinking charm. My basket weighs about 20 kg. It
takes at least one strong man to move it. The only way I move it is by
emptying it first.

Optime vale,
Livia


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.

Are you saying that Nova Roma is too politically fractured for the scenario to
be realized?

Vale optime!




________________________________
From: Robert <robert.woolwine@...>
To: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 5:27:17 PM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Ave,

Well, let me answer you in the long held Jewish mother's fashion by answering
your question with another question. :). Given your observations just what
conclusions can you come to based on what you have learned and your observations
to date?

Vale

Sulla

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2010, at 1:50 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:

> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
>
> If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
> statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively resigned
> both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on this, and

> forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go forward with
>
> a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real and
>good
>
> works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?
>
> I personally would like to see all the parties resolve their issues amicably
>and
>
> begin the process of repairing the damage that has already been to the
> Respublica.
>
> I by no way mean to suggest I am against the PM in any fashion, for I really
> don't know him, but if the parties are indeed irreconcilable then maybe the
> statements made by the PM at the conventus, if true, offer a way out of the
> crisis.
>
> Just a thought.
>
> Vale optime.
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...>
> To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 12:02:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court

> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Ave!
>
> Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a religion
> centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
> thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?
>
> The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals who
> hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation - not
> bound to any laws other than its own.
>
> Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
> identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio Stegheria
> (which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.
>
> Vale,
>
> Sulla
>
> On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> >
> > I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give
> > himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as may
> > exist in a community like ours.
> >
> > If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth (with
> > him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what is
> > happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances
> > elsewhere.
> >
> > There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of
> > action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> > Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
> >
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Cato
> >
> > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > >
> > > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> > Piscinus
> > > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
> > you
> > > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> > year?
> > >
> > > Vale optime!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> >
> > > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> > court
> > > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> > >
> > >
> > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > >
> > > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> > of
> > > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> > that I
> > > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> > >
> > > Vale,
> > >
> > > Cato
> > >
> > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > >
> > > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> > Pontifex
> > > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> > in
> > > >quite
> > > >
> > > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> > rhetoric
> > > >and
> > > >
> > > > hyperbole.
> > > >
> > > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> > stumbled into
> > > >
> > > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> > events led to
> > > >
> > > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> > ever be
> > > >a
> > > >
> > > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > > >
> > > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> > > >considering
> > > >
> > > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> > investigation?
> > > >
> > > > Vale optime!
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave,

I am going to basically repeat my question to you. You have reviewed the archives. You have observed what has gone on, what is going on, and what is reasonably likely to go on. You seem like a smart guy; based on your observations what can you conclude and why do you base your conclusions on?

Vale

Sulla

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2010, at 3:01 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:

> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
>
> Are you saying that Nova Roma is too politically fractured for the scenario to
> be realized?
>
> Vale optime!
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert <robert.woolwine@...>
> To: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Cc: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 5:27:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Ave,
>
> Well, let me answer you in the long held Jewish mother's fashion by answering
> your question with another question. :). Given your observations just what
> conclusions can you come to based on what you have learned and your observations
> to date?
>
> Vale
>
> Sulla
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 18, 2010, at 1:50 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>
> > C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
> >
> > If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
> > statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively resigned
> > both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on this, and
>
> > forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go forward with
> >
> > a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real and
> >good
> >
> > works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?
> >
> > I personally would like to see all the parties resolve their issues amicably
> >and
> >
> > begin the process of repairing the damage that has already been to the
> > Respublica.
> >
> > I by no way mean to suggest I am against the PM in any fashion, for I really
> > don't know him, but if the parties are indeed irreconcilable then maybe the
> > statements made by the PM at the conventus, if true, offer a way out of the
> > crisis.
> >
> > Just a thought.
> >
> > Vale optime.
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...>
> > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 12:02:14 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
>
> > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> >
> > Ave!
> >
> > Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a religion
> > centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
> > thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?
> >
> > The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals who
> > hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation - not
> > bound to any laws other than its own.
> >
> > Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
> > identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio Stegheria
> > (which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Sulla
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > >
> > > I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give
> > > himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as may
> > > exist in a community like ours.
> > >
> > > If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth (with
> > > him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what is
> > > happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances
> > > elsewhere.
> > >
> > > There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of
> > > action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> > > Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
> > >
> > >
> > > Vale,
> > >
> > > Cato
> > >
> > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > > Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > >
> > > > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> > > Piscinus
> > > > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution? Are
> > > you
> > > > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> > > year?
> > > >
> > > > Vale optime!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ________________________________
> > > > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> > >
> > > > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > > > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> > > court
> > > > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > > >
> > > > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> > > of
> > > > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> > > that I
> > > > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> > > >
> > > > Vale,
> > > >
> > > > Cato
> > > >
> > > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > > Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> > > Pontifex
> > > > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> > > in
> > > > >quite
> > > > >
> > > > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> > > rhetoric
> > > > >and
> > > > >
> > > > > hyperbole.
> > > > >
> > > > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > > > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> > > stumbled into
> > > > >
> > > > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> > > events led to
> > > > >
> > > > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> > > ever be
> > > > >a
> > > > >
> > > > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> > > > >considering
> > > > >
> > > > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> > > investigation?
> > > > >
> > > > > Vale optime!
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Fl Vedius Germanicus C. Octavio Prisco S.P.D.

You need look no further than M. Horatius' email to his new email list,
#372 in its archives, entitled "Organizing for the Future of the Religio
Romana". Therein he lays out his plan to create a new organization
devoted to the Religio, in no uncertain terms.

In that email, he points out some problems with Nova Roma, and lays out
some plans as to how they will be rectified in his new organization. I
am, I should say, flattered that he has finally come around to my own
thinking on the subject, which I laid out on this email list, in the
context of focusing Nova Roma's efforts on local chapters (amongst other
things), back in 2007. He's three years behind me on the subject, but
the fact that he got there at all says something. But where I wrote of
nudging Nova Roma in a better direction, Piscinus takes another
direction, and it's not hard to see why.

Unfortunately, with the unraveling of his plans to institute a
dictatorship that would have thrown out those citizens he does not like,
he seems to have come to the conclusion that starting a new group is the
only way to go. If he cannot be in charge here, with only his friends
and cronies around him, he'll just do so someplace else.

Equally unfortunately, it seems as if he's determined to hang on here to
suck whatever life he can out of Nova Roma, to the benefit of his new
group. (That, of course, is a departure from the last time he did this
back in 2001, when he left to form the SVR; perhaps he thinks his
failure there was because he didn't keep a toe in the water here.) I
would hope that Piscinus would do the right thing and resign his office
in Nova Roma, since he has stated his intention to create a competing
organization, and the conflict of interest is manifest. But given his
long history, I won't be holding my breath.

Vale,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus
Pater Patriae

On 10/18/2010 11:30 AM, Jean Courdant wrote:
> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla S.P.D.
>
> It would seem to me that where the description of the group does not appear to mention Nova Roma that maybe recent statements about the PM leaving NR might be true. If this is so it would also seem that this may have been in the works since January. I also find it odd but may simply coincidental that Hortensia pops up surprisingly on the heals of the PM announcing his abandonment.
>
> I think I may be finally seeing some clearer evidence here as to who the bad actors are.
>
> Vale optime!

Salve;

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 4:31 PM, Tragedienne wrote:
>
> Sta. Cornelia Aeternia L. Iuliae Aquilae Omnibus Civibus S.P.D.
>
> The pics look awesome, I am glad everyone had a nice time, arrived and departed safely and made it back to their places of orgin safe and sound.
>
> But one pic disturbs just a bit Julia, I see a Legionaire with a Wolf's Head on their Helm. It looks like either Wolf or Fox.
>
> That's not real right? Faux correct?
>
> Vale Optime,
> Sta. Cornelia Aeternia
>

From an examination of the pictures, it looks to me to be the full
pelt of a coyote, which is nowhere near being an endangered specie...

In many states (including Illinois where I reside) coyotes are
considered a "fur bearing" or "vermin" specie, for which there exists
an "open season." There are only 7 - 8 days each year when coyotes
are not lawful game animals under Illinois Law.

Some states, not within their historical range, will consider coyotes
to be a non-native, invasive specie, like feral pigs, and have a fully
Open Season with no "bag limit."

Wisely done, hunting or trapping of any "game," "furbearer" (which is
how Illinois hunting/trapping laws list coyotes), "predator," or
"varmint" species is no threat to the animals long term survival. It
is hunters and trappers who have been most instrumental in
establishing "bag limits" and excise taxes, which go towards
preserving habitat (ref: Robertson-Pittman Act)

Most man - animal conflicts arise because we as a specie have over
used, or intruded into, the habitats of other species.

Nature is not kind. Her highest order job is to create fodder for the
future generations of oncoming life. We become fodder, coyotes become
fodder...microbes become fodder. Life feeds on life.

I'd rather see the pelt of a lawfully hunted/trapped coyote being used
as the decorative embellishment in a Roman recreation, than as a
rotting, bloated corpse by the side of the road because some driver
didn't pay attention and brake as they were able.

--
In amicitia et fide
P Ullerius Stephanus Venator
Civis et Poeta

Sodalitas Coquuorum et Cerevisiae Coctorum
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sodalis_Coq_et_Coq/

(sites subject to occasional updates)
http://www.facebook.com/p.ullerius.stfnus.venator
http://nrfb.korsoft.com/
http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/

Statia Cornelia Aeternia P. Ullerio Stephano Venatori sal:

<snippage for brevity>

It looks like we have a bit of difference of opinion of the matter Venii, which is okay.

I'd personally rather see neither, and animals of that kind in their natural habitats.

All I will say further on the subject.

Vale Optime,
Aeternia

>
> From an examination of the pictures, it looks to me to be the full
> pelt of a coyote, which is nowhere near being an endangered specie...
>
> In many states (including Illinois where I reside) coyotes are
> considered a "fur bearing" or "vermin" specie, for which there exists
> an "open season." There are only 7 - 8 days each year when coyotes
> are not lawful game animals under Illinois Law.
>
> Some states, not within their historical range, will consider coyotes
> to be a non-native, invasive specie, like feral pigs, and have a fully
> Open Season with no "bag limit."
>
> Wisely done, hunting or trapping of any "game," "furbearer" (which is
> how Illinois hunting/trapping laws list coyotes), "predator," or
> "varmint" species is no threat to the animals long term survival. It
> is hunters and trappers who have been most instrumental in
> establishing "bag limits" and excise taxes, which go towards
> preserving habitat (ref: Robertson-Pittman Act)
>
> Most man - animal conflicts arise because we as a specie have over
> used, or intruded into, the habitats of other species.
>
> Nature is not kind. Her highest order job is to create fodder for the
> future generations of oncoming life. We become fodder, coyotes become
> fodder...microbes become fodder. Life feeds on life.
>
> I'd rather see the pelt of a lawfully hunted/trapped coyote being used
> as the decorative embellishment in a Roman recreation, than as a
> rotting, bloated corpse by the side of the road because some driver
> didn't pay attention and brake as they were able.
>
> --
> In amicitia et fide
> P Ullerius Stephanus Venator
> Civis et Poeta
>
> Sodalitas Coquuorum et Cerevisiae Coctorum
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sodalis_Coq_et_Coq/
>
> (sites subject to occasional updates)
> http://www.facebook.com/p.ullerius.stfnus.venator
> http://nrfb.korsoft.com/
> http://www.catamount-grange-hearth.org/
>

Salve Aeternia;

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 6:44 PM, Tragedienne wrote:
>
> Statia Cornelia Aeternia P. Ullerio Stephano Venatori sal:
>
> <snippage for brevity>
>
> It looks like we have a bit of difference of opinion of the matter Venii, which is okay.
>
> I'd personally rather see neither, and animals of that kind in their natural habitats.
>
> All I will say further on the subject.
>
> Vale Optime,
>
> Aeternia
>

Null problem...folks I respect, and with whom I may a have a
difference of opinion in one or two or more areas, are still folks I
respect.

Vale - Venii

Cato omnibus in foro SPD

Hodiernus dies est ante diem XIV Kalendas Novembris; hic dies nefastus publicus est.

"There was a universal shout of approval, and T. Quinctius advancing
to the front asserted that his men would submit to the authority of
the Dictator. He implored Valerius to take up the cause of his unhappy
fellow-citizens, and when he had taken it up to maintain it with the
same integrity that he had always shown in his public administration.
For himself he demanded no conditions, he would not place his hope in
anything but his innocence, but for the soldiers there must be the
same guarantee that was given in the days of their fathers to the
plebs and afterwards to the legions, namely, that no man should be
punished for having taken part in the secession. The Dictator
expressed his approval of what had been said, and after telling them
all to hope for the best he galloped back to the City, and after
obtaining the consent of the senate, brought a measure before the
people who were assembled in the Petilian Grove granting immunity to
all who had taken part in the secession. He then begged the Quirites
to grant him one request, which was that no one should ever either in
jest or earnest bring that matter up against any one. A military Lex
Sacrata was also passed, enacting that no soldier's name should be
struck off the muster-roll without his consent. An additional
provision was subsequently embodied in it, forbidding any one who had
once been military tribune from being made to serve afterwards as a
centurion. This was in consequence of a demand made by the mutineers
with respect to P. Salonius, who had been every year either military
tribune or centurion of the first class. They were incensed against
him because he had always opposed their mutinous projects and had fled
from Lautulae to avoid being mixed up with them. As this proposal was
aimed solely at Salonius the senate refused to allow it. Then Salonius
himself appealed to the senators not to consider his dignity of more
importance than the harmony of the State, and at his request they
ultimately passed it. Another demand just as impudent was that the pay
of the cavalry should be reduced-at that time they were receiving
three times the infantry pay-because they had acted against the
mutineers." - Livy, History of Rome 7.41


"In the fifth year of the reign of Tatius, some retainers and kinsmen
of his, falling in with ambassadors from Laurentum on their way to
Rome, attempted to rob them of their money,Link to the editor's note
at the bottom of this page and when they would not stand and deliver,
slew them. It was a bold and dreadful crime, and Romulus thought its
perpetrators ought to be punished at once, but Tatius tried to put off
and turn aside the course of justice. This was the sole occasion of
open variance between them; in all other matters they acted in the
utmost concert and administered affairs with unanimity. The friends of
the slain ambassadors, shut out as they were from all lawful redress,
through the efforts of Tatius, fell upon him as he was sacrificing
with Romulus at Lavinium, and killed him, but escorted Romulus on his
way with loud praises of his justice. Romulus brought the body of
Tatius home and gave it honourable burial, and it lies near the
so-called Armilustrium, on the Aventine hill; but he took no steps
whatsoever to bring his murderers to justice. And some historians
write that the city of Laurentum, in terror, delivered up the
murderers of Tatius, but that Romulus let them go, saying that murder
had been requited with murder. This led some to say and suspect that
he was glad to be rid of his colleague, but it caused no disturbance
in the government, nor did it lead the Sabines into faction, nay, some
through the good-will they had for him, others through fear of his
power, and others because they regarded him as a benevolent god, all
continued to hold him in reverence to the end." - Plutarch, Parallel
Lives, "Romulus" 23

"Armilustrium ab eo quod in Armilustrio armati sacra faciunt, nisi
locus potius dictus ab his; sed quod de his prius, id ab ludendo aut
lustro, id est quod circumibant ludentes ancilibus armati." - Varro,
de Lingua Latina VI.3

"Before the consuls set out, the nine days' sacred rite was performed,
as a shower of stones had fallen from the sky at Veii. After the
mention of one prodigy, others also were reported, as usual. At
Minturnae, that the temple of Jupiter and the grove of Marica, and at
Atella also that a wall and gate, had been struck by lightning. The
people of Minturnae added what was more alarming, that a stream of
blood had flowed at their gate. At Capua, a wolf, which had entered at
the gate by night, had torn a watchman. These prodigies were expiated
with victims of the larger kind, and a supplication for one day was
made, according to a decree of the pontiffs. The nine days' sacred
rite was then performed again, because a shower of stones had been
seen to fall in the armilustrium." - Livy, History of Rome 27.37


Today is the celebration of the Armilustrium. The Armilustrium was a
festival in honor of Mars, the god of war. On this day the weapons of
the soldiers were ritually purified and stored for winter. The army
would be assembled and reviewed in the Circus Maximus, garlanded with
flowers and the trumpets (tubae) would be played as part of the
purification rites. The Romans gathered with their arms and armour on
the Aventine Hill, and held a procession with torches and sacrificial
animals. The dancing priests of Mars known as the Salii may also have
taken part in the ceremony.

As seen in the quotations from Livy and Plutarch above, the
Armilustrium was also the name of a large open space on the Aventine
Hill where the festival was held.

Valete bene!

Cato

C. Octavius Priscus F. Vedio Germanicov S.P.D.

Thank you Pater Patriae for pointing me to a most enlightening post. I sense
now that I may have been incorrectly presuming malevolent conduct on the part of
a number actors based upon the suppositions of others to whom I can not, with
certainty, make judgement of their motive.


As I have felt for some time now, the truth in Nova Roma often gets buried under
layers of rhetoric from those who deliberately mean to disinform, those who are
gullible, those constrained by policy, and those who just feel like putting
their 2 cents in. This makes obtaining a clear view of the facts for someone
new like myself a tedious and laborious process. I will continue my endeavor
however to ascertain the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth; may
the gods help me.

Vale optime!







________________________________
From: Vedius <vedius@...>
To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:10:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Fl Vedius Germanicus C. Octavio Prisco S.P.D.

You need look no further than M. Horatius' email to his new email list,
#372 in its archives, entitled "Organizing for the Future of the Religio
Romana". Therein he lays out his plan to create a new organization
devoted to the Religio, in no uncertain terms.

In that email, he points out some problems with Nova Roma, and lays out
some plans as to how they will be rectified in his new organization. I
am, I should say, flattered that he has finally come around to my own
thinking on the subject, which I laid out on this email list, in the
context of focusing Nova Roma's efforts on local chapters (amongst other
things), back in 2007. He's three years behind me on the subject, but
the fact that he got there at all says something. But where I wrote of
nudging Nova Roma in a better direction, Piscinus takes another
direction, and it's not hard to see why.

Unfortunately, with the unraveling of his plans to institute a
dictatorship that would have thrown out those citizens he does not like,
he seems to have come to the conclusion that starting a new group is the
only way to go. If he cannot be in charge here, with only his friends
and cronies around him, he'll just do so someplace else.

Equally unfortunately, it seems as if he's determined to hang on here to
suck whatever life he can out of Nova Roma, to the benefit of his new
group. (That, of course, is a departure from the last time he did this
back in 2001, when he left to form the SVR; perhaps he thinks his
failure there was because he didn't keep a toe in the water here.) I
would hope that Piscinus would do the right thing and resign his office
in Nova Roma, since he has stated his intention to create a competing
organization, and the conflict of interest is manifest. But given his
long history, I won't be holding my breath.

Vale,

Flavius Vedius Germanicus
Pater Patriae

On 10/18/2010 11:30 AM, Jean Courdant wrote:
> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla S.P.D.
>
> It would seem to me that where the description of the group does not appear to
>mention Nova Roma that maybe recent statements about the PM leaving NR might be
>true. If this is so it would also seem that this may have been in the works
>since January. I also find it odd but may simply coincidental that Hortensia
>pops up surprisingly on the heals of the PM announcing his abandonment.
>
> I think I may be finally seeing some clearer evidence here as to who the bad
>actors are.
>
> Vale optime!







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.

These are not rhetorical questions that am I asking. As you know, perusing the
archives, the ones that are public anyway, and listening to the rhetoric that is
routinely dished up on the lists that are, can, in no definitive way, give
anyone who has been here as short a time as I have any clear understanding of
what exactly is going on in Nova Roma. That is one reason why I continue to ask
these types of questions.

To put forth a conclusion, at this time however, as to what has REALLY gone on
and what is likely to occur in the future as a result would be most exceedingly
presumptuous of me at best and disingenuous at least.

I know there is a desire among many of the actors here to draw folks on to one
side or the other. I however am not interested in choosing sides and commencing
battle.


I would rather be a peace maker and broker. I would rather be someone who is
working towards something positive. I have a desire to become part of Nova Roma
in a meaningful and contributive way. What I'm interested in is understanding
the truth, whatever that truth may really be so that I can eventually function
in that role here in Nova Roma. That is another reason why I continue to ask
these types questions; regardless of how complex the issues are or however
sensitive the parties may be to being asked.


I would genuinely be most appreciative for an answer to my original question; if
you are genuinely inclined towards truly enlightening me.


Vale optime!



________________________________
From: Robert <robert.woolwine@...>
To: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 6:39:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court
against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus


Ave,

I am going to basically repeat my question to you. You have reviewed the
archives. You have observed what has gone on, what is going on, and what is
reasonably likely to go on. You seem like a smart guy; based on your
observations what can you conclude and why do you base your conclusions on?

Vale

Sulla

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2010, at 3:01 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:

> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
>
> Are you saying that Nova Roma is too politically fractured for the scenario to

> be realized?
>
> Vale optime!
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert <robert.woolwine@...>
> To: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Cc: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com" <Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 5:27:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a court

> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Ave,
>
> Well, let me answer you in the long held Jewish mother's fashion by answering
> your question with another question. :). Given your observations just what
> conclusions can you come to based on what you have learned and your
>observations
>
> to date?
>
> Vale
>
> Sulla
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 18, 2010, at 1:50 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
>
> > C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
> >
> > If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
> > statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively resigned

> > both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on this,
>and
>
>
> > forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go forward
>with
>
> >
> > a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real and
> >good
> >
> > works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?
> >
> > I personally would like to see all the parties resolve their issues amicably

> >and
> >
> > begin the process of repairing the damage that has already been to the
> > Respublica.
> >
> > I by no way mean to suggest I am against the PM in any fashion, for I really

> > don't know him, but if the parties are indeed irreconcilable then maybe the
> > statements made by the PM at the conventus, if true, offer a way out of the
> > crisis.
> >
> > Just a thought.
> >
> > Vale optime.
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...>
> > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 12:02:14 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
>court
>
>
> > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> >
> > Ave!
> >
> > Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a religion
> > centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
> > thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?
> >
> > The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals who
> > hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation - not
> > bound to any laws other than its own.
> >
> > Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
> > identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio Stegheria
> > (which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.
> >
> > Vale,
> >
> > Sulla
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > >
> > > I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to give
> > > himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power" as
may
> > > exist in a community like ours.
> > >
> > > If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth
(with
> > > him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is what
is
> > > happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his chances
> > > elsewhere.
> > >
> > > There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his course of
> > > action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> > > Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
> > >
> > >
> > > Vale,
> > >
> > > Cato
> > >
> > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > > Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > >
> > > > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M. Moravius
> > > Piscinus
> > > > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious institution?
Are
> > > you
> > > > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier this
> > > year?
> > > >
> > > > Vale optime!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ________________________________
> > > > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> > >
> > > > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > > > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> > > court
> > > > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > > >
> > > > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual sense
> > > of
> > > > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other than
> > > that I
> > > > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> > > >
> > > > Vale,
> > > >
> > > > Cato
> > > >
> > > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > > Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for the
> > > Pontifex
> > > > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most interested
> > > in
> > > > >quite
> > > > >
> > > > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from the
> > > rhetoric
> > > > >and
> > > > >
> > > > > hyperbole.
> > > > >
> > > > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of the
> > > > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> > > stumbled into
> > > > >
> > > > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> > > events led to
> > > > >
> > > > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova Roma or
> > > ever be
> > > > >a
> > > > >
> > > > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the ML;
> > > > >considering
> > > > >
> > > > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> > > investigation?
> > > > >
> > > > > Vale optime!
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ave,

Neither am I asking rhetorical questions. To be a peacemaker one must be
able to be honest with him or herself. You have asked many questions over
the months that you have been in NR. You have read the archives. You know
what is basically going on in the recent past, in the present and what is
likely going to be at least the immediate future of NR. I have answered
your questions regarding Piscinus's new list.

You asked:

If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively resigned

both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on this,
and
forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go forward
with
a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real and
good
works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?


I think the answer is obvious! And because it was obvious did not need to be
stated. Then you simply avoided my follow up question and then tried to ask
a very leading question, which does not seem to match up to your desire to
be a peacemaker. :)

The thing is , if you want to be a peacemaker, whatever role that would be.
You need to be able to come up to your own conclusions. Like I said before,
you read the ML archives, you know whats going on. What do YOU think? Not
being able to take a position on anything is not a productive stance.

Vale,

Sulla

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 5:09 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...>wrote:

>
>
> C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
>
> These are not rhetorical questions that am I asking. As you know, perusing
> the
> archives, the ones that are public anyway, and listening to the rhetoric
> that is
> routinely dished up on the lists that are, can, in no definitive way, give
> anyone who has been here as short a time as I have any clear understanding
> of
> what exactly is going on in Nova Roma. That is one reason why I continue to
> ask
> these types of questions.
>
> To put forth a conclusion, at this time however, as to what has REALLY gone
> on
> and what is likely to occur in the future as a result would be most
> exceedingly
> presumptuous of me at best and disingenuous at least.
>
> I know there is a desire among many of the actors here to draw folks on to
> one
> side or the other. I however am not interested in choosing sides and
> commencing
> battle.
>
> I would rather be a peace maker and broker. I would rather be someone who
> is
> working towards something positive. I have a desire to become part of Nova
> Roma
> in a meaningful and contributive way. What I'm interested in is
> understanding
> the truth, whatever that truth may really be so that I can eventually
> function
> in that role here in Nova Roma. That is another reason why I continue to
> ask
> these types questions; regardless of how complex the issues are or however
> sensitive the parties may be to being asked.
>
> I would genuinely be most appreciative for an answer to my original
> question; if
> you are genuinely inclined towards truly enlightening me.
>
>
> Vale optime!
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert <robert.woolwine@... <robert.woolwine%40gmail.com>>
> To: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>" <
> Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>>
> Cc: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>" <
> Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>>
> Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 6:39:02 PM
>
> Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> court
> against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
>
> Ave,
>
> I am going to basically repeat my question to you. You have reviewed the
> archives. You have observed what has gone on, what is going on, and what is
>
> reasonably likely to go on. You seem like a smart guy; based on your
> observations what can you conclude and why do you base your conclusions on?
>
> Vale
>
> Sulla
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 18, 2010, at 3:01 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...<jeancourdant%40yahoo.com>>
> wrote:
>
> > C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
> >
> > Are you saying that Nova Roma is too politically fractured for the
> scenario to
>
> > be realized?
> >
> > Vale optime!
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: Robert <robert.woolwine@... <robert.woolwine%40gmail.com>>
> > To: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>" <
> Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > Cc: "Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>" <
> Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>>
> > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 5:27:17 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for a
> court
>
> > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> >
> > Ave,
> >
> > Well, let me answer you in the long held Jewish mother's fashion by
> answering
> > your question with another question. :). Given your observations just
> what
> > conclusions can you come to based on what you have learned and your
> >observations
> >
> > to date?
> >
> > Vale
> >
> > Sulla
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > On Oct 18, 2010, at 1:50 PM, Jean Courdant <jeancourdant@...<jeancourdant%40yahoo.com>>
> wrote:
> >
> > > C. Octavius Priscus L. Cornelio Sulla s.p.d.
> > >
> > > If all of what has been said regarding M. Moravius Horatianus Piscinus'
>
> > > statments during the conventus are true, then hasn't he effectively
> resigned
>
> > > both his office and citizenship within Nova Roma? If I am correct on
> this,
> >and
> >
> >
> > > forgive me if I'm mistaken, but doesn't that negate the need to go
> forward
> >with
> >
> > >
> > > a trial which would only serve as a continued distraction from the real
> and
> > >good
> > >
> > > works that Nova Roma should be focusing on?
> > >
> > > I personally would like to see all the parties resolve their issues
> amicably
>
> > >and
> > >
> > > begin the process of repairing the damage that has already been to the
> > > Respublica.
> > >
> > > I by no way mean to suggest I am against the PM in any fashion, for I
> really
>
> > > don't know him, but if the parties are indeed irreconcilable then maybe
> the
> > > statements made by the PM at the conventus, if true, offer a way out of
> the
> > > crisis.
> > >
> > > Just a thought.
> > >
> > > Vale optime.
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > > From: Robert Woolwine <robert.woolwine@...<robert.woolwine%40gmail.com>
> >
> > > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 12:02:14 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for
> a
> >court
> >
> >
> > > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> > >
> > > Ave!
> > >
> > > Well except that it is patently absurd that anyone would create a
> religion
> > > centered around himself, if that is what Piscinus is doing! Delusional
> > > thinking? A mentally unbalanced mind? Where does it stop?
> > >
> > > The point being - we have enough crazy in NR - with the few individuals
> who
> > > hold out the last vestage strings that NR is an independent nation -
> not
> > > bound to any laws other than its own.
> > >
> > > Piscinus should take his crazy insane religion elsewhere and clearly
> > > identify it as the Religio Piscina or better yet...the Religio
> Stegheria
> > > (which is probably closer to what it truly is) than the Religio Romana.
> > >
> > > Vale,
> > >
> > > Sulla
> > >
> > > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 8:56 AM, Cato <catoinnyc@...<catoinnyc%40gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > > >
> > > > I think that Piscinus will do whatever he believes is necessary to
> give
> > > > himself a feeling of authority and power - even such virtual "power"
> as
> may
> > > > exist in a community like ours.
> > > >
> > > > If that means that he has to create a new religion out of whole cloth
>
> (with
> > > > him at its apex, of course) then he will do so. Apparently, this is
> what
> is
> > > > happening now. He couldn't get his way here, so he'll take his
> chances
> > > > elsewhere.
> > > >
> > > > There's nothing inherently wrong with either his ambition or his
> course of
> > > > action in creating this... Piscinianity... except when he uses our
> > > > Respublica as a host for his parasitical actions.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Vale,
> > > >
> > > > Cato
> > > >
> > > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com><Nova-Roma%
> 40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > > > Courdant <jeancourdant@...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > > >
> > > > > Senator, what do you think of the recent suggestions that M.
> Moravius
> > > > Piscinus
> > > > > is abandoning Nova Roma and setting up his own religious
> institution?
> Are
> > > > you
> > > > > aware that a new Religio Romana yahoo group was created earlier
> this
> > > > year?
> > > > >
> > > > > Vale optime!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ________________________________
> > > > > From: Cato <catoinnyc@...>
> > > >
> > > > > To: Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com><Nova-Roma%
> 40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > > Sent: Mon, October 18, 2010 7:23:47 AM
> > > > > Subject: [Nova-Roma] Re: Condemnation of Consul Albucius' call for
> a
> > > > court
> > > > > against Pontifex Maximus Marcus Moravius Horatianus Piscinus
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Cato Octavio Prisco sal.
> > > > >
> > > > > Maior is a peculiar and extraordinary person - meant in the actual
> sense
> > > > of
> > > > > those words - so nothing she does surprises me at this point. Other
> than
> > > > that I
> > > > > can only say, "grab the popcorn and let's wait and see."
> > > > >
> > > > > Vale,
> > > > >
> > > > > Cato
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In Nova-Roma@yahoogroups.com <Nova-Roma%40yahoogroups.com><Nova-Roma%
> 40yahoogroups.com>, Jean
> > > > Courdant <jeancourdant@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > C. Octavius Priscus Cn. Equito Cato S.P.D.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Yes senator, your position in that regard and your disdain for
> the
> > > > Pontifex
> > > > > > Maximus has been made quite clear many times. What I'm most
> interested
> > > > in
> > > > > >quite
> > > > > >
> > > > > > frankly are factual details that can be evaluated separate from
> the
> > > > rhetoric
> > > > > >and
> > > > > >
> > > > > > hyperbole.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Although I'm not a full citizen as of yet and will not be part of
> the
> > > > > > proceedings, if and when they occur, my interest is keen. I have
> > > > stumbled into
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Nova Roma at a most interesting time and I want to understand how
> > > > events led to
> > > > > >
> > > > > > this schism. I don't feel as if I will really understand Nova
> Roma or
> > > > ever be
> > > > > >a
> > > > > >
> > > > > > true part of her without a clearer understanding of these events.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Do you care to comment on the recent resurfacing of Maior on the
> ML;
> > > > > >considering
> > > > > >
> > > > > > her abrupt departure and strange statements about a supposed
> > > > investigation?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Vale optime!
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Q Caecilius Metellus C Octauio Prisco salutem dicit

To some, it may seem that you are simply being evasive in refusing to
give your opinion one way or the other on things. While I am more
inclined to believe that this is not the case, it strikes me that there
is an easy way to to resolve that part of things, and it seems I shall
have to be the one to ask.

With your statements that you've been reviewing the archives, what all
have you been able to glean from the archives? How far into the
archives have you travelled?

I know the answers to this will certainly help some of those
participating in this discussion have a better understanding of what of
our history you know, rather than continuing on assumptions.

Sit tecum Minerua.

Salvete Quirites, Senatores, Magistrates and Officers,

I have been asked to speak on the steps that a decuria of citizens would have made and would go on making to build up new organizations, whose goals and working would be similar to Nova Roma's ones.


What is at stake here ? That a group of citizens wishes to leave us to live its romanitas in other places.


I will be said that these cives may be the ones who, all along this year, took extreme positions, or took twice a part in the preparation of a dictatorship while they should have accepted working, in good willing and faith, with other ones in the frame of our institutions.


The matter remains the same one.


On a legal point of view, our Corporation and Republic never decided to exclude, from its membership, people who would create other organizations (either formal � non-profit orga. - or not), or join organizations which act in the same field than Nova Roma. In addition, and probably because the matter was never discussed deeper, the notion of �competing organization� was never defined.


This absence of definition allowed, in the recent years, several of our citizens to consider that they might belong both to NR and to other �Roman� organizations. If we focus on organizations that are close to Nova Roma in the fact that they also try to propose her/his members a global reenacting and day-to-day frame in living the whole society which was/is Rome, some of these persons were founders or active members of, for example, the Societas Via Romana, or, more recently, of Novum Byzantium. In addition, when we consider these memberships, we realize that every kind of factions, as currently present in Nova Roma political environment, has been represented in these double, triple etc. memberships.


If ever I personally never understood, as I have constantly told it, that one may wish having two irons in the fire in organizations which apparently are incompatible one with each other, I am obliged to admit that Nova Roma current Law do not forbid plural affiliations, in and outside. This was one of the points that I would have wished to amend during my consular term. At this time, our institutional conditions do not allow such a reform.




My attention is then brought on the fact that the recent initiatives of this group of �new founders� would be a betrayal of our Republic. I think that, as always, we must keep sticking to our laws : what they allow is not forbidden, and every other consideration may run the risk being subjective ones, and raising to no-ending disputes.


If thus some of us cannot find any longer, in our res publica, what they initially wished to live, specially for they think that they cannot any more transform our organization at their image, I fully understand that they may feel that their place is not any longer here, and that Nova Roma is no more, today, the Republic where they longed to be once.


We are not this kind of religious organizations or sects which considers that, from the moment someone entered them, this person remains a member at life and cannot get rid of the relation to this possessive organization.
If our ancient members may keep their Roman identity among us, they are free to come back, as our current citizens free to leave.


Why? For the simple reason that we believe that Nova Roma, as the natural continuation of Ancient Rome, is not a corporation like other ones, which would have to �compete� on some non-profit organizations market.




I am said that these members are senior ones, for a part of this decuria, or active ones, for another part, or ones who may contribute much to our organization, and that their leave would be a loss for us.


Well, looking at nearly 2,800 years of Roman History, I tend to see these risks as relative ones, and to think that these citizens have now, apparently, stated that they could not bring more to our community. We all will obtain and spare more in a peaceful separation than in a recurrent or long divorce. Nova Roma may regret these people, but the Republic will go on living.


So let us allow them living new adventures and consider that, finally, the most important is that romanitas be spread all over the world. If these people succeed in spreading it outside NR, this would be also a victory for us all, for nothing will erase the fact that their possible success would have taken its roots in NR.

It is never easy to leave a group in which we spend several years and involved much time and energy. We are, it is human, often eager to consider that, finally, we could stay a bit more, just to see how things turn on, etc.
I understand this feeling, and will not make any pressure of the persons of this decuria in order that they leave as soon as possible. If they need time to think, to verify their project, they are still welcome among us.



Naturally, I will ask them, if they confirm their intention to go, to let the place as they found it : clean, tidy and in order. :-). For if I will be the first one to wish these former members the best luck outside Nova Roma, I will not accept that they try to put disorder in our institutions or defame our cives inside our outside, just to show that, if they cannot help us anymore, at least they may remain, until the end, harmful to us.


This decuria of FallFlower Founders :-) has, apparently, still some ideas and common projects � I am told about two organizations, a more specific religious one in the U.S.A., and a more global one in Europe.
They will then need money and people.


They will thus be obliged to raised funds outside Nova Roma, for NR Inc.'s current finances cannot legally help them in their projects.


Concerning the people that this decuria will try to win, specially among our citizens, I see, respecting the freedom of every one, no difficulty, but from the moment that the contacts and manoeuvers remain private and do not try to use Nova Roma institutions, specially its public forums. In this last mind, the Praetura is still attentive to every possible promotional campaign. If necessary, stricter measures will be taken, naturally in the frame of Nova Roma Law.


Thanks for your attention Quirites, Senatores, Magistrates and Officers.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]